The Armour Archive

Russ Mitchell

Thanks, Cliff. I'm going to have to go back to my old essay and recalc some theoretical numbers. That's several sources generally implying 1mm each, thus 2mm plus random buff leather due to overlap. Will need to figure some sort of test to determine whether the M transfers seamlessly through two pla...

Russ Mitchell

kyb0417:

You're still doing us a real service here. I'd be very happy to see Korean sources and get a rough idea inside them with machine translation prior to going to friends for specific points (I have a friend living in Busan). Either way, thank you very much for the information.

Russ Mitchell

what! you speak of the devil! in the sca we are told that a mere tap to the face with anything pointed would kill us dead. we are also told, by sca experts, that hand drawn missiles always destroyed any armour and also destroyed the body behind it. how dare you argue with the awesome power of point...

Russ Mitchell

That makes me wonder how common lacquered leather may have been out to the steppe zones: Korea being one anchor of the Silk Road -- when the Mongols are described as making leather armor with pitch, do you suppose the fellow was actually seeing lacquer of some sort? It's not a material he would have...

Russ Mitchell

Why do you think they did it that way? Looking at the digs at Wisby and Towton, torso damage seems to be very, very rare. It's the limb and head shots that took most of those who were buried down. But I would be concerned with an arrow sticking out of my chest, etc... -Aaron And yet we know they we...

Russ Mitchell

Halbrust: Something to consider, as a guy carrying lots of old martial arts and fencing injuries. Damage is cumulative. I used to do twenty rounds a night and TKO guys on a regular basis -- now it'd be seriously foolhardy for me to step into the ring. On a good day none of those injuries are an issu...

Russ Mitchell

Signo,

Makes me really want to get my hands on an original -- at least at the thicknesses I wasn't thinking, I hadn't really expected any weight savings whatsoever. Perhaps some folks were using notably thin stuff?

Russ Mitchell

Happy New Year. Very nice -- it's a lot of fun to see both your enthusiasm, and that channeled into achievement is ever better.

Russ Mitchell

::facepalm:: Just watched their test online, it was even more embarrassing than their "We're gonna do the Archimedes thing without consulting so much as ONE basic textbook on optics." (hint for the clueless -- you need only two shields, and god HELP whatever you're lensing at, as any solar...

Russ Mitchell

Agreed. Remember us going 'round on that when comparing lamellar and mail when you were editing that paper of mine? And until somebody gets permission to get in there with calipers, we're just stuck as far as I know. I don't have weights, but even if you find them, I'd advise caution in making guess...

Russ Mitchell

No, they're folks online with lots of citations all over their work. None of my acquaintances work in that field.
@Randall: I agree, I've never bothered to make one myself. Mahaquitls never really appealed to me.

Russ Mitchell

Yeah, that's good information to know, Jiri. I *know* layered paper shrugs a sword blow at half that thickness, maybe even a touch less -- I haven't tried the true mache' yet, but it's on the agenda.

Russ Mitchell

I only have it orally. You take long sections of obsidian and slice a sapling as it grows, binding it back up and making sure it stays well-watered and alive, and it grows around the wood. By the time it's absorbed most of it and only the sharp bits are showing, it's about as solidly "in there&...

Russ Mitchell

I just saw some of this guy's work up-close today when he picked up leather from me. This guy can REALLY make weapons -- he'd offered me one for my stuff (as I want to gradually assemble a casual SCA kit w/o compromising my LH stuff), and I'd been "nah, I've got stuff." Well, pretty much e...

Russ Mitchell

You're welcome -- it tears me up that I had all that stuff and couldn't do jack with it (my hand/wrist's screaming at me even now), so I hope you can really get some use out of it.

Russ Mitchell

Hrm...thanks, guys. That gives me some ideas to work with.

Russ Mitchell

Yeah, it's a traditional way of making a mahaquitl. Polish peasants didn't need war clubs -- they had axes, and perfectly effective ones.

Russ Mitchell

Can't seem to find any online; just fender washers, which are thicker than I'd like. Anybody got a link to one?

Russ Mitchell

No luck, Cliff. Still don't have anything that actually lists thicknesses on the plates -- I can give you "I looked at it" but nothing formally citeable except anecdotally.

Russ Mitchell

Agreed, but Siberia's a whole 'nuther country.

Russ Mitchell

Possible indirect evidence -- stirrups of the period are made for soft sole rather than a hard one. Given that felt retains warmth even when wet, it seems entirely plausible to me.

Russ Mitchell

The artist trying to keep from going bored out of his gourd, maybe? The crosshatching on the greaves tends to support this in my opinion, though that could just as reasonably be said to be equally-legit decoration on leather. Both are plausible enough -- if you told me how a jawshan was constructed...

Russ Mitchell

Since they'd have (LOTS) of horizontal and vertical overlap, they'd really NEED to be thin, but it's a neat idea.

Russ Mitchell

I only know it from eyeballing, Cliff -- don't have any actual caliper measurements. What I saw looked like .75 to maybe 1.5mm to me. The European jack I looked at, had thinner edges on the plates than the centers, and very distinctly so, almost as if they'd be stamped out. I've got a very full week...

Russ Mitchell

As I'm slowly easing out of the leather stuff due to bad tendonitis I took stock of what was still useful in patterning for felt and such, and realized... hey, some tourney armor was made of paper mache... I haven't ever done that, but I *have* made layered-paper pauldrons once that were stout enoug...

Russ Mitchell

Yeah, they're special that way. It's a nice job they do, but unaffordable unless you're stupid-rich with money.

Russ Mitchell

UPDATE: one of the folks who's contacted me has actually committed to swinging by and taking it up --- which is the best option from my end, and I look forward to seeing the stuff actually get used. Thanks, y'all.

Russ Mitchell

Hi folks. I've got a couple thousand bucks worth of leatherworking goods and materials (patterns out the wazoo, all the basic tools, high-end lunette and swivel knife).... and horrifically-bad tendonitis that is looking permanent, enough that I'll still eventually do some projects, but won't be doin...

Russ Mitchell

Sorry, you're right: "ended" is too strong. "Crippled" is more appropriate.

Russ Mitchell

Actually, most of the Hungaro-Byzantine conflicts had little to do with Bulgarian, but instead revolved around the Serbs and over who would control Dalmatia (for instance, when the IVth crusade hit Zadar, they were attacking a town under *Hungarian* suzerainty, not Byzantine). But if you want to und...

Russ Mitchell

There is clear evidence of some Middle Eastern warriors wearing lamellar over mail so I don't doubt that was done. I was just trying to find suppiort for the claim that Byzantines did it. Most of the cited evidence turned out to be no evidence at all after tracking it down. That second image makes ...

Russ Mitchell

James -- I saw it, too. If that ridge married up to the other side, these may have been "one size fits most" with the metal forming a puckered-out edge.

Russ Mitchell

The prototypical Hungarian blade is like that, Ruel, but by the 16/17th century, there's a ton of variation.

Russ Mitchell

The sabre blade could be hungarian; the furniture is definitely not.
I have definitely NOT examined primary sources -- the only Tatar under my belt is enough to shout "Jaur Nohaj" at people who irritate me during events.

Russ Mitchell

Anu Mand would translate it for us if I asked her very nicely. She's in Tallinn, let me see if I can get a hold of her.

Re: Lamellar thickness

Re: Lamellar thickness

Re: (SCA) Body armor needed?

Re: Discovered Korean armour artifact in 2011

Re: (SCA) Body armor needed?

Re: (SCA) Body armor needed?

Re: Paper Mache armor - any experience?

Re: Making of: Ocean's Wrath (Maxamillian/Gothic/Fantasy)

Re: Paper Mache armor - any experience?

Re: Lamellar thickness

Re: War clubs - Poland

Re: Paper Mache armor - any experience?

Re: War clubs - Poland

Re: Plastidip Hewing Spear

Re: FS/FT/FF Leatherworking shop to good home.

Re: Paper Mache armor - any experience?

Re: War clubs - Poland

Re: Round Scale Mail

Re: Lamellar thickness

Re: Valenki boots

Re: Valenki boots

Re: Legitimacy of Armour type

Re: Round Scale Mail

Re: Lamellar thickness

Paper Mache armor - any experience?

Re: Lamellar scales

Re: FS/FT/FF Leatherworking shop to good home.

FS/FT/FF Leatherworking shop to good home.

Re: Byzantine Armour

Re: Byzantine Armour

Re: Byzantine Armour

Re: Leather vambraces found in Estonia AND Lithuania!

Re: 16-17thc Crimean Tatar armor?

Re: 16-17thc Crimean Tatar armor?

Re: Leather vambraces found in Estonia