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by Mac
Tue Feb 25, 2020 7:00 am
Forum: Historical Research
Topic: Austrian Coppersmiths - Water powered hammers
Replies: 27
Views: 1325

Re: Austrian Coppersmiths - Water powered hammers

Well, some helms were definitely raised at the edges, since there are some that do have compression cracks. Also I don't think that wrought iron is as ductile as thin copper, as I think they "collapse" and shrink inwards the rim of the vessels to get them out from one another, and then hammer the e...
by Mac
Tue Feb 25, 2020 6:57 am
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Buff Leather EDIT Leather is in! How should we torture it?
Replies: 75
Views: 1421

Re: Buff Leather redux

Xtracted wrote:I suggest documenting your process, mark your straps and treat them all with different methods and come back to us on a regular basis fully reporting what has happened to each different strap. :wink:

Yea! .. and don't neglect leaving some of the test strips under tension. :wink:

Mac
by Mac
Tue Feb 25, 2020 6:54 am
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Burgonet build (working on gorget neck lames)
Replies: 192
Views: 3140

Re: Burgonet build (critique please)

This looks a bit roomy to me, but it's within fudging distance of where you need to be. https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/jzAq2OP167RvT9ysrRLh83I5oT5zHwgt_97fN1t8LDJ_k6p2mUma5RhZOVsuQknG-4_DBwvAF9jxUeCwgWlxiAXH_y8gPy5tSZCRvz7HAv9aOii2b1zwyyOMXH_P-1b-w2absNdlVQ=w850-h1024 I think I would try rotating...
by Mac
Tue Feb 25, 2020 6:43 am
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Burgonet build (working on gorget neck lames)
Replies: 192
Views: 3140

Re: Burgonet build (critique please)

What a bizarre technology! Sometimes I think the world is passing my by.. other times I am sure of it. https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/Ipg3w8w8p-DLqfVC92pWvpRkHCjbJizjPeqUlydTdMIJup1QEW6VRGR0WnKuFZUrl7G0DuZg7gbdwM_VernIGr4efjklaM2QD3kai3EXWL1RTX8XHKTOmYTYGuH_HF9ve3C06YRERQ=w850-h1024 This is proba...
by Mac
Tue Feb 25, 2020 6:26 am
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Burgonet build (working on gorget neck lames)
Replies: 192
Views: 3140

Re: Burgonet build (critique please)

The change in head profiles does seem to mess with the original drawing. https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/LXFLLqfmxWMPqpEZ6Y-HgY8QjXd4CzP-r8-YIE6c0z8zXQfrmE7ZI5eCknr5Y31MEtYhcbyfndk1u_TPjaYWbOE3VH97Y6HvQ0hZXAYtMD2nsLqNbsSDX2l6BmyMUlMiQYJYmdaMEw=w850-h1024 You are right to begin by lining up the eye...
by Mac
Tue Feb 25, 2020 6:21 am
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Buff Leather EDIT Leather is in! How should we torture it?
Replies: 75
Views: 1421

Re: Buff Leather redux

My understanding is that "marine oils" are used in the tanning process, but that they squeeze as much out as they can when they are done. These oils are probably fish oils in very recent times, but it would not surprise me it they were traditionally from marine mammals. I should add, for the sake of...
by Mac
Sun Feb 23, 2020 7:45 am
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Burgonet build (working on gorget neck lames)
Replies: 192
Views: 3140

Re: Burgonet build (critique please)

Xtracted wrote:.

I am very obsessive but I have been battling this heavily for around ten years because of the impact is has on productivity. I consider myself obsessive productive these days. Most of the time.
Mea culpa :oops: I didn't mean to strike a nerve.

Mac
by Mac
Sun Feb 23, 2020 6:37 am
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Burgonet build (working on gorget neck lames)
Replies: 192
Views: 3140

Re: Burgonet build (critique please)

I revised the side view and did the front and back. I tried putting in some details on the shoulder but it became very messy real fast so I am missing Macs point here. At this point, you have enough of the gorget set out that you can return to the helmet. It would be nice to establish the outlines ...
by Mac
Sun Feb 23, 2020 5:59 am
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Cuisses with a Medial Wrapper
Replies: 38
Views: 689

Re: Cuisses with a Medial Wrapper

I’ve been primarily referencing this example, the Chartres cuisses, and two leg harnesses from The Met (those displayed with the infamous red corrazina and those inexplicably included with the the same corrazina and similar parts online) for my current project. You mean these pieces in the Met ? Ye...
by Mac
Fri Feb 21, 2020 6:57 pm
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Cuisses with a Medial Wrapper
Replies: 38
Views: 689

Re: Cuisses with a Medial Wrapper

Tom B. wrote:also this St George,

Image
Image
Golly! I've never seen this one.


Mac
by Mac
Fri Feb 21, 2020 6:46 pm
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Cuisses with a Medial Wrapper
Replies: 38
Views: 689

Re: Cuisses with a Medial Wrapper

If anyone is interested, I have had some surprising early success with the “knee bump” but I’ll forgo elaborating unless anyone’s interested. Fortunately I’m still fussing with those so I can postpone decisions on wrappers and related for a bit longer and, perhaps, come up with a solution that invo...
by Mac
Fri Feb 21, 2020 6:41 pm
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Something completely different
Replies: 97
Views: 3521

Re: Something completely different

So... here's a thought. What if this helmet is not so much a radical departure, as it is a working life modification? What if it's really just the union of a typical bellows visored sallet and a bog standard rotating bevor? Mac OK. Upon reflection, it can't have been a "bog standard rotating bevor"...
by Mac
Fri Feb 21, 2020 4:44 pm
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Burgonet build (working on gorget neck lames)
Replies: 192
Views: 3140

Re: Burgonet build (critique please)

There's a nice photo essay here , which shows a two lame collar all disassembled, and then put put back together with fresh leather. The side view is a pretty good example of what this type of gorget should look like. The front is different than where you are headed, but the back should be pretty si...
by Mac
Fri Feb 21, 2020 4:12 pm
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Burgonet build (working on gorget neck lames)
Replies: 192
Views: 3140

Re: Burgonet build (critique please)

I also did the dreaded back perspective and hopefully I have started understanding it a bit. You can also see my hiding neck in that view. Tomorrow I hope I can get started on the helmet sketch. I think your really want to run that line in the back pretty much straight from the rim of the collar to...
by Mac
Fri Feb 21, 2020 3:59 pm
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Hammer Question for Mac
Replies: 50
Views: 1145

Re: Hammer Question for Mac

Here's that last view of the Bellota. https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/n70VBkmvJan3AFCGXQ3a0xNaVYxySl2iTdTSo80SvxhFvA6H19tC2b3Yvb5izYVJFSnE8LGPe16-5iXOVMCoATz7Wugj1wTVjApNeHcZoFMjFW_XIGGsrQg1oEbuBkLupfpmOhnf0MRiVV7A6lGOiaz_HqDc6_zN9SsqKIy-FROSGruA2ggrICQiqy7ls4v_w9ddbce6sc7grrQ8g9KWvlS40NU5Ph7Udrwl...
by Mac
Fri Feb 21, 2020 11:49 am
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Hammer Question for Mac
Replies: 50
Views: 1145

Re: Hammer Question for Mac

Hi again: Could I get pics, top and side of the Bellota hammer, including the quarter? Please. Ilkka https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/nCLl1yxxOJCv8xso44D05-ETW388D-5GX4EuBCcQL12P4TCB-87lespcYeJjtCwhOBhIqYP2Vo80z5escSxnToCMXOyIkoVvQxtPBleU9U6khgjwVHdQlf9a6kMfjK9BAzIUaVs7512y1qb3tn5PQWYJvDmPQeeluNJ6...
by Mac
Fri Feb 21, 2020 11:46 am
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Hammer Question for Mac
Replies: 50
Views: 1145

Re: Hammer Question for Mac

Hi Mac: Thanks for the weights. I did not expect any of them to be at 23 to 24 oz. Nor did I expect them to be light at 7 to 8 oz. This will help. I will work out the dimensions of width and radius from the pics, since you did supply a 25cent piece for convenient scale. Thanks again. Ilkka Very goo...
by Mac
Fri Feb 21, 2020 10:22 am
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Cuisses with a Medial Wrapper
Replies: 38
Views: 689

Re: Cuisses with a Medial Wrapper

Here's an example of a cuisse wrapper which is attached to the main plate with straps and buckles. It is contemporary with our extant examples which have slots at their lateral edges. It also seems to be the sort of cuisse with a "knee bump" rather than a lame. So.. it seem eminently comparable. htt...
by Mac
Fri Feb 21, 2020 10:11 am
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Something completely different
Replies: 97
Views: 3521

Re: Something completely different

So... here's a thought. What if this helmet is not so much a radical departure, as it is a working life modification? What if it's really just the union of a typical bellows visored sallet and a bog standard rotating bevor?

Mac
by Mac
Fri Feb 21, 2020 10:04 am
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Something completely different
Replies: 97
Views: 3521

Re: Something completely different

Getting back to this beast, it is indeed very much like the A 79 foot-combat helm in that the track for the locking collar continues around the back under the tail. I thought that the piece(s) in question might have worked the same way, but if the quotation is accurate, no soap. DSC04722.JPG I gues...
by Mac
Fri Feb 21, 2020 9:56 am
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Burgonet build (working on gorget neck lames)
Replies: 192
Views: 3140

Re: Burgonet build (critique please)

Fat head take 2. Action! https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/TOlknsSJMfA_5zC5k01Fxu6Tfq5i4_eZy9izXJH-g6lxqHwSQ2ASn3XdEXCSCzhWeMo2TliBBwmQC3Pi-eHLjyfUMG8Hooqo5ioPo7lNbUti9g00HUt96fmvEmv7w0M4AsaPpNflkA=w850-h1024 https://photos.app.goo.gl/J8pTzzn4FamQiAb48 OK! I'd still change that thing about the line...
by Mac
Fri Feb 21, 2020 9:49 am
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Burgonet build (working on gorget neck lames)
Replies: 192
Views: 3140

Re: Burgonet build (critique please)

Actually, I based it on the angles of Wades augsburg gorget that I handled at the forging. It has that inwards angle of the top lame in the back. http://allenantiques.com/images/A-201-a-pin-side.jpg Hmmm.... I see what you mean. I'm inclined to see that as a "bug", rather than a "feature". It spoil...
by Mac
Fri Feb 21, 2020 9:40 am
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Hammer Question for Mac
Replies: 50
Views: 1145

Re: Hammer Question for Mac

Hi Mac and everyone else: I am looking to make some fluting hammers and wondered if Mac could answer a few questions: Ref the pic below. 1) What is the weight of the fluting hammers? 2) What is the radius of the face on each end? 3) What is the thickness of the various fluting heads? I am planning ...
by Mac
Thu Feb 20, 2020 4:36 pm
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Burgonet build (working on gorget neck lames)
Replies: 192
Views: 3140

Re: Burgonet build (critique please)

Fire at will. Okey doke! This is a good start! Here are some things to consider, more or less in the order that they struck me... --The neck looks a bit suspicious in the front view. I expect to see something more straight sided. Take a few caliper widths and verify what you have there.. especially...
by Mac
Thu Feb 20, 2020 1:03 pm
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Burgonet build (working on gorget neck lames)
Replies: 192
Views: 3140

Re: Burgonet build (critique please)

My current project is the "technical drawings" for Toby C's next book; so I'm immersed in this very thing. I'm spending weeks taking what 15th c. artists have handed us, and trying to suss out what they were really seeing and putting that into three views. It's hard work. There is a lot of transfer...
by Mac
Thu Feb 20, 2020 12:38 pm
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Burgonet build (working on gorget neck lames)
Replies: 192
Views: 3140

Re: Burgonet build (critique please)

Doh :oops: I pushed the button before I wrote anything, so I've removed it.

Mac
by Mac
Thu Feb 20, 2020 12:37 pm
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Burgonet build (working on gorget neck lames)
Replies: 192
Views: 3140

Re: Burgonet build (critique please)

In a way, this sort of thing is what distinguishes the draftsman from the artist. The artist makes a line that "feels right, even if it is wrong". The draftsman makes a line that it "is right, even if it feels wrong". Mac As a person who makes a living as a draftsman (electronic mostly) I want this...
by Mac
Thu Feb 20, 2020 12:05 pm
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Burgonet build (working on gorget neck lames)
Replies: 192
Views: 3140

Re: Burgonet build (critique please)

While I was typing up the post above, I noticed another place where symmetry needs to be reconciled. The red line is where I expect the head to be at its widest. Sure; this will vary from person to person, but helmets are based on typical and normal, rather than specific individuals. Wherever that l...
by Mac
Thu Feb 20, 2020 11:26 am
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Burgonet build (working on gorget neck lames)
Replies: 192
Views: 3140

Re: Burgonet build (critique please)

I removed as much space at the sides as I dared to. The narrower neck is a step in the right direction, but I would advise you to dare a bit more. :wink: The thing that jumps out at me is that the front and back views need to be reconciled at their horizons. Since this is a projection, rather than ...
by Mac
Wed Feb 19, 2020 12:29 pm
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Burgonet build (working on gorget neck lames)
Replies: 192
Views: 3140

Re: Burgonet build (critique please)

Since we are all off on this tangent, I thought I'd do it too. As far as I can tell, the distribution of any and all human characteristics within the population will fall on the famous bell curve. This goes for all the things that can be measured, as well as those that can not (or have not) been mea...
by Mac
Mon Feb 17, 2020 4:03 pm
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Buff Leather EDIT Leather is in! How should we torture it?
Replies: 75
Views: 1421

Re: Buff Leather redux

I found this from Australia https://www.etsy.com/listing/721712955/buff-leather-strap-3inch-70mm-x-minium?gpla=1&gao=1&&utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=shopping_us_a-craft_supplies_and_tools-raw_materials-leather&utm_custom1=2b97818a-ba6f-4b47-bfa8-dd2a39752fe2&utm_content=bing_35201266...
by Mac
Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:31 am
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Something completely different
Replies: 97
Views: 3521

Re: Something completely different

Could it be that the mounting arms are bent over much more then they have been ? At last the angles are not symetrical. My impression is that the one on the right (with the threaded stalk) is bent, but that the left one is more or less OK. In reality, of course, it's impossible to be sure. In this ...
by Mac
Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:23 am
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Something completely different
Replies: 97
Views: 3521

Re: Something completely different

Here is a sketch I made this morning to show the sort of thing that I think might work with the Philly bevor. First of all, as we have seen in my post of 2/16 (above) a normally proportioned sallet does not extend deep enough to provide a place for this bevor to attach. Therefore we have to look fur...
by Mac
Mon Feb 17, 2020 9:59 am
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Something completely different
Replies: 97
Views: 3521

Re: Something completely different

You may regret asking for a sketch from me, Mac. I went to the Stevie Wonder School of Drawing and flunked out. Still, happy to give it a shot. Full disclosure, while thinking through how I might put what was in my head into a sketch, my first step was a face palm and saying to myself, "Duh. Of cou...
by Mac
Mon Feb 17, 2020 7:59 am
Forum: Armour - Design and Construction
Topic: Something completely different
Replies: 97
Views: 3521

Re: Something completely different

Those are the rivets that hold the "thingies" to the main plate. Mac Are they an integrated part of the thingies and are they held in place by something that looks like a lock washer and not peened? They feel rather excessive? They also kinda look like something that has a function beyond just bein...