The Armour Archive

I have been toying with this idea for several years.

A favorite tool of mine is a piece of 2" steel with a rounded dip in it.
It is C-clamped to my work bench.
I made it with my right angle grinders, it took me two or three days… and it still isn’t finished.

However, it works wonders for my metal pounding needs.
If it was on a 1” tool shank it would be the tits.

Now the logistics: For me + mega grinding and shaping hours = very pricy.
So… If one has a grinder.
Would an unfinished stake be viable?

It would consist of a 2” steel bar, about 4” long, welded to a 1” square tool shank.
Parts, shipping, profit and labor cost, un-painted and unfinished…
Rough welded.
As is!
You grind it. You shape it.
Cheap price.

Just a thought after drinking to many beers from the BBQ.

Hal

sounds good maybe add a few sketches of different shapes to make it in to, then people might by several to make into tools as they need them

Iron D, you do well with surprise tools... I suppose this is what I am doing with this insane idea also.
I can not guarantee what will become of the tool or how useful it will be.
It was just an off shoot of my imaginations‘.
Like cartoons flashing in my head.
I had to write it down.

yes, you can be as insane as me ( almost )

I don't have a welder. I don't regularly have access to pieces of 1" square stock unless I order a short bar from McMaster-Carr at a premium or a full 20' piece from the metal-yard. I have the tendency to collect tools and to modify the tools I collect since I can't build them from scratch as easily.

That said I'd need to have a very specific tool in mind to get it welded first and then ground second. That's like hafting a hammer head before grinding and polishing the face. It can be done but it's inconvenient. I would want a very clear plan before I started off down that road. What does your ground stake thing look like?

Sean

Pictures or a sketch would help.
There are a number of people without acces to welding equipment that may want to purchase "blanks" or U finish pieces.
If you have good compressor you can do some rough shapeing with cheap Arc rod by turning up the heat and use an air nosel to simply blow off the weld pool.
Its a bit rough compaired to carbon arc cutting but basicly the same principal.

Hummm... I could use my plasma torch but it is only rated for 3/8".

Take it at an angle and sort of shave off bits as you go. its going to be ugly but its faster then just going at it with an angle grinder.

I think my plasma torch could rough out a dip.

This is what I was thinking.
I sure miss SolidWorks.
Pc paint is an etch-o-sketch.

Hal

I've got a washing tip on my plasma cutter at work, if you've got or can get something similar i think it wouldnt be to tough or slow to wash it out with the plasma cutter. That said I'd personally use my oxy acetalyne torch and just chop it out and clean it up with the grinder.

Kris

That is a good idea but my oxy/acetylene set up is very small and for art.
What ever I do to the proposed tool would add cost and value.
I was thinking of lower cost and end user labor.

I know this is not for the newbie who has never run a right angle grinder.
This is why I tossed therein the idea.
I appreciate the hive mind and your replies.
You have helped me design many tools.

As we speak; I am sketching up my "Super Tool".
This time... I am using Big Chief tablets and yellow #2 pencils.

Thank you for your support.

Hal

Well if it is long enough to reach the wrist of a raised gauntlet from both the knuckles and the cuff then it could be a great shape. Seems a shame to waste the other half of the tool though. Anything else you could do if the 2" rod was longer?

Depending on tools I would use a band-saw to cut a V notch rather then use a OA torch but that's just me.

Sean

Sean

I think that the 2" refers to the diameter. I've been thinking of mangling a "dip" into my 3" rod, the 2" rod I have is stainless

depending on the sketch I may have some O/A cutting to do this weekend - the bandsaw I have access to isn't a precision tool (even compared to the cutting torch!)

Scott Martin

What about finding someone with access to a mill? Unless I am seeing something else, you could put the 2" rod into a vice at 45 degrees and take a ball nosed end-mill to it. Hal, you seem the kind of guy who either owns a mill or knows someone that can be bribed with a 6-pack to allow you to use his mills for a couple of hours.

-Ben

Atlanta,

Yes, I know some folks with Bridgeports and Clausings, that would be the most precise way.
I have a shaped tool for my use already, I wanted to offer a U-grind-it to my clients.
Maybe it was just a beer dream after all.
So I compromised and made this as a pilot… to see how it goes.



Solid steel... 2” diameter with a 1” square shank.
11 inches by 11 inches.
13 pounds 2.8 ounces.
Designed for the flat rate shipping box.

I will install a gusset and call it… "Hal’s Behemoths".
"Super Tool" will be made from 2" square stock.

Hal

Ps: I don’t think I can offer very many of these as this shit is too heavy and expensive.
I do not have a scrap yard and must pay retail metal prices.
I am sure one could get a better deal elsewhere.

Halberds wrote:Atlanta,

Yes, I know some folks with Bridgeports and Clausings, that would be the most precise way.
I have a shaped tool for my use already, I wanted to offer a U-grind-it to my clients.
Maybe it was just a beer dream after all.
So I compromised and made this as a pilot… to see how it goes.



Solid steel... 2” diameter with a 1” square shank.
11 inches by 11 inches.
13 pounds 2.8 ounces.
Designed for the flat rate shipping box.

I will install a gusset and call it… "Hal’s Behemoths".
"Super Tool" will be made from 2" square stock.

Hal

Ps: I don’t think I can offer very many of these as this shit is too heavy and expensive.
I do not have a scrap yard and must pay retail metal prices.
I am sure one could get a better deal elsewhere.

I an interested in the 2" square stock "Super Tool"

How much?

I can see a lot of uses for that tool, either ground (into numerous shapes) or left alone. Regretably I'm not buying tools or I would have you add a gussed under the long end and buy it off of you.

Sean

How long would you need it?

And don't tell me a long time because you will be making armour on it.

I meant... how long the top piece of 2" square?


Sean,

A gusset is on the list of things to do.

Length of 2" round I would want it at least long enough to go from wrist to point of elbow so I could slide an assembled arm over it to remove dents, adjust bent lames or support a rivet for peening. I tend to kludge those with a length of pipe in the vice but it vibrates. Some times I can get a different T-stake in through the elbow hole but not always.

Length of 2" square for the top? Don't know but probably about the same.

Sean

Depending on price, I might be interested in one. What about turning the end into a ball or small dish? It might require adding a stake on axis with the 2" rod for it to work, but if it works with the anbil I'm getting I'd definitely be interested.

This is the first round one, I had some 2" round on hand.
I am waiting for a materials quote for the 2" square at this time.
I will have to pay cutting charge and drive 90 miles, as I can not fit a 20 ft. piece in my Mazda.

Here is the round one with a 3/8" gusset installed.



I think I will auction this one off on the classifieds.
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=159517
I started at $48.00, although I have more in it than that.
At least I can measure the interest it generates.

Thank you for your comments and help.

Hal

Oh shit!
The quote for the 2" square material came in this afternoon.
I do not think there will be enough demand for me to invest my life savings in 20 feet of the 2" square material.

This idea is right out.
I guess it was a pipe dream after all.
Dumb idea # 976

Hal

Wow. This is really close to an idea I've been toying with, though I didn't think of adding a gusset. Good idea. I'm sorry to see it fall through for you.

My idea was more double sided 1.5" to 2" round kind of like a small raising stake. It would be rounded on one side for raising and have a divot ground into the other for anticlastic forming. The divot side would be slightly rounded so not to add dings to the work.

Since you introduced your idea first would you mind if I tried picking up where you left off? I don't want to step on any toes.

You go right ahead and best of luck.
How did your ball stakes work out?
I still have a bunch on the shelf.

I have several feet of 2" solid round bar and a short piece of 2" square I will prototype with.
Actually this stuff is to heavy for me to lug around.

This is a cool tool:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/grailchase ... 4157359725

Perhaps it will give us some ideas.

Hal

PS: Sean, the length of the top bar you like, would fit in the flat rate box long wise.
(Elbow to wrist) One has 13-1/4" in that direction.
However the shank will suffer and be 9-1/4" long.
I think that is a fair trade off.
Where do you think to... position the shank?
In the center like the original would be my best bet.
What about a 1" hardy hole stop collar?

Given the cost I wouldn't build any except on request and then put the shank where the buyer wanted it. I'm inclined to have an Asymetric tool so I can use a short or long end as needed.

If you were willing to put more labor into it you could save some cost by using pipe on one end and solid round on the other but that is your choice.

Let me see if we have any 2" stock in the scrap bin. You never know what is there.

Sean

Good call on the custom shank placement.
I don't need any 2" round stock, but if you have welders you can have one made there.

The big dish you sent me was used on the mid-15th. century Milanese gauntlet to start the knuckles.

Well I found some 2" square-stock in the scrap bin. Actually is't a 2" x 2.25" chunk cut out of a large block and is only 7" long. Also I think it might be titanium alloy rather then steel and not good for a stake. Oh well. I'm sure I can find a use for 4 1/2 pounds of random titanium block.

I also found a 1/4" plate of stainless that someone had Wire-EDM the Philly-flyiers logo, a k-bar silouete and 2 of the unrealisticly endowed mud-flap girls. The prototype shop must be bored. Sorry but it was too funny and I had to share. Why would someone want mud-flap-girls 1/4" thick?

Sean

I suspect its for a bar back splash or some other "man cave" art.

If the proto shop is board and useing shop materials I would find them a project.
Maybe jig and fixture work to improve existing processes.
perhaps some new french curves, and drafting templates.
or marshal guages by the Gross.
board people with power tools leads to acidents.

Well, if the boss catches you… there will be hell to pay.
This is my idea of shaping the blank 2" tool.



Any one have some more sketches to show?

Hal

I wonder if drive shafts and axles would provide material to help keep costs reasonable.

My hearing is still not quite right after someone got board and filled a empty TIG tube with oxy/acetalean and decided to set it off in the tool room, Luckily the door was open, he was the only one bleading from the ears...

Here is the quick sketch I made while doodling tool ideas at work... It would be double ended. Small raising stake on one end and the other end would have the gouge in the top and edges ground down so it wont damage the piece being worked.

losthelm wrote:I wonder if drive shafts and axles would provide material to help keep costs reasonable.

My hearing is still not quite right after someone got board and filled a empty TIG tube with oxy/acetalean and decided to set it off in the tool room, Luckily the door was open, he was the only one bleading from the ears...

I think the use of any sizable metal and source to lower cost is good.
Some one that lives close to a nice scrap yard could offer lower prices.

As for the ears, I know what you mean, a dumb ass shot off his rifle... muzzle next to my ear.

ask locals who repair cars, trucks or heavy machinery Hal.
if there is no scrap yard nearby they may be happy to get rid of some pieces.

You know... we do have a auto scrap yard in town.
I should pay them a visit with a 12 pack.

yup, look for parts for FWD shafts, spring steel in anti roll bars, FWD axles will often have a huge ball each end where they swivel