The Armour Archive

The only good example of a "Gothic shorty" vambrace I could find is this one in Munich. ref_arm_85_003



It has a single-buckle, and the strap must have attached somewhere in that rusted out spot.

Does anyone know of another example? The Helmschmied armors in Vienna have short vambraces, but I don't have any pics that show the fastenings.

Mac

The A 62 KMW lower cannons have pins now, but they have blind rivets where a strap would have been. The strap rivet is closer the closure, though. If you put the hinges on the 'outside' and the strap on the inside, it should interfere minimally, if at all.

Hi,

here are the ones from Nuremberg. Also very short ones.

Mac wrote: Does anyone know of another example? The Helmschmied armors in Vienna have short vambraces, but I don't have any pics that show the fastenings.

Mac

A60 has buckles

Mac I have sent you a couple of emails that may help you in this search if it is not too late.

Thanks, James, Rene, and Tom!

It looks like strap and buckle is the thing.

Mac

Blair shows A 60's cannons strapped as well. Yes, I know, I should be able to remember...

I put one of the pauldrons into the kiln just to see what I was up against. It's going to be another tight fit.



While I thought about that, I started disassembling the pauldrons and removing the leathers. I expect to be able to put these same leathers back in when I do the final assembly, and to that end, they are labeled.



Having pulled out the leathers, I have reassembled them with nuts and bolts that have already been through the heat treating process. To keep the upper lames fully extended, I have installed temporary straps of steel.



Having had a good experience with the cuirasse, I have installed tubes rather than wires to handle the pauldrons. This will let me get them in and out of the kiln faster and more safely.



Shifting back to the vambraces.... Here is where I plan to install the straps and buckles. The buckle shown here is a double, but I will use singles to save on bulk under the gauntlet cuff.



The areas where the buckle mounting tab and the end of the strap will be riveted are currently rather unsuitable for all the fluting. I would like to have unfluted "seats" for the strap and buckle. On the front tassets, I simply left places for the buckles. Here I will have to go back and reduce the flutes to get my smooth places. That will probably be tomorrow. It's getting a bit late to make a lot of noise tonight.



Mac

Mac wrote:Shifting back to the vambraces.... Here is where I plan to install the straps and buckles. The buckle shown here is a double, but I will use singles to save on bulk under the gauntlet cuff.

A double sounds reasonable to make sure that the strap stays put while the gauntlet rotates around in use. Is there no reason to worry about it getting bunched up under the gauntlet? I suppose it'll be set for one size anyway, so perhaps you don't expect much spare material?

As far as I can tell, single buckles are more common than doubles on all sorts of vambraces.

I think the rule is something like this... "If you expect the strap to experience a more or less constant tension, then use a single. If you expect the strap to sometimes be in compression, or for there to be a lot of jostling, then use a double."

Mac

I went back last night and reduced the fluting where the ends of the straps and the mounts of the buckles would be. It wasn't too noisy, and I hope the neighbors can deal. I made up steel straps to hold the vambraces closed, and set up the wires to get them in and out of the kiln.



Today, I put wires on the besegews....



....and the elbows.



Having thought about it for a while, I decided that I should really put braces across the open sides of the pauldrons. It took about an hour, but that seems like cheap insurance.



Everything but the helmet is ready for heat treating. Perhaps that will happen on Monday. The helmet still needs some work, so it will have to go it alone in couple of weeks.

Mac

Mac wrote:I think the rule is something like this... "If you expect the strap to experience a more or less constant tension, then use a single. If you expect the strap to sometimes be in compression, or for there to be a lot of jostling, then use a double."

Thanks! Those besegews look gorgeous. Must have missed them earlier.

Gerhard von Liebau wrote: Thanks! Those besegews look gorgeous. Must have missed them earlier.

I'm glad you like them! They are my first and only attempt at repoussé on pitch.

I'm not at all sure how I will finish them. They are almost smooth enough that I can just polish them up.... but not quite. Unfortunately, there's not way to get my usual abrasives in there. Perhaps some careful work with shaped sanding blocks will do the trick, but if I start in too coarse it will be a world of trouble.

Mac

Sand blasting? :p

Mac wrote: I'm glad you like them! They are my first and only attempt at repoussé on pitch.

I'm not at all sure how I will finish them. They are almost smooth enough that I can just polish them up.... but not quite. Unfortunately, there's not way to get my usual abrasives in there. Perhaps some careful work with shaped sanding blocks will do the trick, but if I start in too coarse it will be a world of trouble.

Mac

A couple of days in a concrete mixer with the blades taken out, full of sand?

It'd be tedious work with a dremel.

I believe Mac doesn't have much faith left in tumblers since the last time he used one..

Fair enough.

I have a vibratory bowl burnishing machine, holds about 2 gallons of ceramic, plastic, metal or glass media and shakes it, less likely to do damage than a tumbler
if you were more local I would lend it to you

As finely detailed as those besagews are, they need to be handled more like silversmith's work than anything else. Traditionally that means starting out with files and rifflers, and moving on to different grades of stone slips. I'd probably use little sanding blocks for some areas, but slip stones have the advantage that they can be shaped to fit very tight curves and corners, while holding their cutting edges longer than sandpaper. Tedious work however you face it, though!
http://www.gesswein.com/p-290-gesswein- ... tones.aspx

The thing about any of the bulk finishing methods is that (like sandblasting) they will not remove the faceting from the tool....at least now without removing a substantial thickness. They will bring the whole surface to a uniform finish but the underlying marks will still be there.

Mac

John Vernier wrote: http://www.gesswein.com/p-290-gesswein- ... tones.aspx

Yeow! A useful selection of those would be a hefty investment!

I agree with you in principal, but I hope to get away with cheaper tools and a less-than-silversmithy final finish.

Mac

Dynafile might be worht a try:

http://www.abrasivesupply.com/Dynabrade ... _s/519.htm

I know what you mean. I used them when I was in school, and I wish I had a drawerful of them, but I don't.

Cet wrote:Dynafile might be worht a try:

http://www.abrasivesupply.com/Dynabrade ... _s/519.htm

I'm thinking about the Porter Cable profile sander. They have a short (1/8?) straight line stroke. I'm making an offer for a used one on Ebay.



Mac

That might do. I can check if my dynafile can run off my portable compressor as a plan B.

Compressor..... you know... sometimes I wonder if I should break down and get one. I understand that "real men use air tools". Perhaps I should ask for a compressor for my birthday. My folks are always at a loss for what to get me.

Mac

The thing is that if you want to run air tools you need a pretty large compressor - 5hp or so, to keep up with the volume of air the tool uses. You want to look at the CFM rating of the tool you want to run. A smaller compressor might keep up with some tools for short bursts, but I've heard of people burning them out very quickly by underestimating their needs.

5hp maybe is not needed if the compressor has a tank large enough. Anyway, John is right, with air tool you need to check the pressure and the flow needed to run each tool. Then is quite simple do to the math and decide which duty cicle suits your needs. From my hobbist point of view, 2 hP is enough, yes, I want more that 50 liters reserve, but spare tanks are quite cheap.In the meanwhile I use the time to recharge the tank to check if I'm doing fine (the compressor start when the pressure drop under a set value, so, after the first run, that is quite long, the others are quite short in comparison.. the downtime is not minutes).

As of now, I just have a small 2 hp compressor but that's solely to run a finish nailer and an airbrush. For something more intense, Signo pretty much has the measure of it. My da has a 350 Gal tank with a 5 hp compressor attached. It almost never runs out when we're working on the cars but when we moved it from the shed to the basement, it took FOREVER to fill back up...

Thanks for the advise on compressors, Guys!

Mac

I have used air tools mainly for woodworking, and admittedly the duty cycles I'm used to are a lot longer than what Mac probably needs. Using a Dynabrade random orbit sander on a set of cabinets can mean running a large volume of air almost continuously for hours. Using a dynafile for detail work is going to be a lot more intermittent. A smaller compressor with a largish tank would probably do. Still it seems like a lot of kit for a small effect - although I find that once you have a compressor you find uses for it. It revolutionizes cleaning shop, though not necessarily all to the good.

BTW I noticed that those Gesswein slip stones are pricey because they sell them by the dozen at a minimum. Search Gesswein Stone on Ebay and you will find numerous partial boxes and mixed sets for relatively cheap.

John hit on it but CFM is what you want to look at when looking at compressors AND the tools that are driven by them. Look at a chart of the CFM usage for the tools you envision using and then size the comp by CFM larger than that.

Die grinders and sanders are notorious for high CFM usage. Nail guns not si much. Here is a chart.

https://www.cpocampbellhausfeld.com/on/ ... -chart.jpg

Today is a heat treating day. The pauldrons, elbows, lower cannons, and bessagews were all austinitized at 1450°f and quenched at about 100°f. Each of the parts then went into the range (set at 500°f) for about 10 minutes. They probably did not get to 500, but they did all get to a medium brown color, and that's just fine for now.



While the kiln cools down for the final tempering, I have been working out how to correct some small warpages.

The wings of the elbows have curled in just a bit, and I will shove them back out with aluminum angle stock. Note the steel "perch" for the end of the prop. My first thought was to brace against the inside of the point, but the angles were wrong. I hope to use the same piece of aluminum for both elbows. That will work if the aluminum does not sag at all. We'll see how that goes this evening.



The lower lame of the upper cannon on the right pauldron got flattened a bit, and I am going to shove it out with another aluminum prop.



Both of the pauldrons opened a bit here.... They will get clamped into position for the tempering.



The lower cannons are a bit gappy at the overlaps now. I will get a pic of the clamping I intend to use on them after dinner.



Mac

To tighten up the gappyness of the lower cannon, I applied my fleet of tired old C clamps. These poor little guys get a lot of abuse.



It occurred to me that I have never posted a pic that showed the difference in color between stuff that had been "stop tempered" and stuff that has had its final temper. The one on the left has been in the range at 500°f for ten minutes. The one on the right has been in the kiln at 750°f for 15 minutes.



Things went smoothly this evening, and it only took about two and half hours to get all of today's parts tempered. Sometimes it takes longer, but I had good luck keeping the kiln at the right temperature. I really aught to get a digital control for the kiln. This business of sitting there adjusting the control knobs to hold a temperature is pretty tedious.



The clamping and bracing worked pretty well, and I will start grinding tomorrow.

Mac

Moving right along! The progress has been fun to watch. I may tool up to try spring steel one of these days...

Wow Mac you are a master. I wish I could see this in person. The amazing systems you have in place to ensure everything is perfect it really fantastic.

One of my children was looking through a kids book and he came up and asked if I knew the experts in it.... sure enough it was you and Toby Capwell. I actually told him he had met Toby before but he may not have remembered as this photo was Toby in armour and he met with us at the Wallace.... I was surprised there was a photo of you in the book!

Best of luck with your project. It is great to see this step by step.

RPM