byzantine armour

crazysaxon · Post by **crazysaxon** » Tue Jan 18, 2005 11:07 pm

i ve been to find examples of trying to find examples of armour that would have been worn by the varangian guard. any ideas?

D. Sebastian · Post by **D. Sebastian** » Tue Jan 18, 2005 11:29 pm

[img]http://www.hausvdk.com/VDKresearch/Byzantine/varangian.jpg[/img]

[img]http://www.hausvdk.com/VDKresearch/Byzantine/Varangian_Guards-Skylitzes_Chronicle.jpg[/img]

[img]http://www.hausvdk.com/VDKresearch/Byzantine/Byzantine-Guards.jpg[/img]
(Egfroth and crew)

[img]http://www.honorblade.com/pics/04Crusades-DSeb-1.jpg[/img]
(Me)

D. Sebastian · Post by **D. Sebastian** » Tue Jan 18, 2005 11:33 pm

[img]http://www.hausvdk.com/galleries/BoredomMay04/001_025bw.jpg[/img]

[img]http://www.hausvdk.com/galleries/BoredomMay04/005_018m.jpg[/img]

Sorry, lots of Byzantine crossover there.

crazysaxon · Post by **crazysaxon** » Tue Jan 18, 2005 11:56 pm

ooohhh thanx

Egfroth · Post by **Egfroth** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 7:17 am

OK - first, you should get some background. After a fair bit of investigation, I've come to the conclusion that the majority of Varangian Guardsmen would have been issued with Byzantine armour from the Imperial arsenal, as most would have arrived in Byzanium with very little armour of their own - see http://www.angelfire.com/empire/egfroth ... Armour.htm

To see what Byzantine armour looked like, see http://www.geocities.com/egfroth1/ByzAr ... 6424880530 and http://www.geocities.com/egfrothos/Dovecote.html - follow the links on both to get some really cool pictures done at the time the stuff was actually being worn.

And for theoretical and practical reconstructions, see http://www.levantia.com.au/military/armour.html and http://www.levantia.com.au/military/KKK.html - these are part of a larger site on Byzantium as a whole at http://www.levantia.com.au/

Also http://www.geocities.com/egfroth1/HbkHelmets.htm , if you want info on helmets of the type the Varangians were likely to have worn - and instructions on how to make them.

For more info on the Varangians as a whole, see http://www.geocities.com/egfrothos/Varangians.html

Are you planning to make armour to use yourself? If so, are you planning to go SCA style or metal weapons?

It's nice to see such an interest in the Varangian Guard. There's a lot of us about - see http://www.geocities.com/nvgincweb/

PS: It is VERY doubtful that the first picture above is off a Varangian Guardsman. He's actually the centurion from a church mosaic showing the Crucifixion - the "Varangian" connection seems to have been plucked out of thin air by the author of an Osprey book on Byzantium, and then perpetuated ever since by being quoted in other publications.

crazysaxon · Post by **crazysaxon** » Thu Jan 20, 2005 3:46 pm

just one last question. i am trying to figure out how many plates i need for lammelar. any hints?

InsaneIrish · Post by **InsaneIrish** » Thu Jan 20, 2005 4:10 pm

crazysaxon wrote:just one last question. i am trying to figure out how many plates i need for lammelar. any hints?

totally depends on the deminsions of the plates used.

If you use the birka style plates off the archive figure 1 inch per plate horizontal and 3.5 inches per row vertical.

So to cover a 40 inch around body with a 16 inch drop from the armpit figure 5 rows of 40 plates. That is 200 plates for the body plus how ever many you need for your chest and upper back.

Armourkris · Post by **Armourkris** » Thu Jan 20, 2005 4:24 pm

ok, so this isnt really a usefull post, i just noticed it says your in victoria and figured i'd say hi, and it's cool to have more local people.
I'm in Eisenmarche (coquitlam)

Welcome to the Archive.

Mateo · Post by **Mateo** » Thu Jan 20, 2005 4:29 pm

Any good sources for late period spanish armor? C 1590 ish? Im getting into heavy a bit, and if I find that I like it, I'll want a kit for myself that is in persona. Web searches have turned up little in the way of examples or for-sale items, but I might just be barking up the wrong trees.

Thanks!

-Mateo

crazysaxon · Post by **crazysaxon** » Thu Jan 20, 2005 6:27 pm

Tybolt wrote:ok, so this isnt really a usefull post, i just noticed it says your in victoria and figured i'd say hi, and it's cool to have more local people.
I'm in Eisenmarche (coquitlam)

Welcome to the Archive.

greetings Eisenmarche

I am Godric of An tirs favorate merc household

Egfroth · Post by **Egfroth** » Fri Jan 21, 2005 5:47 am

Crazysaxon, there are quite a range of sizes for lamellae, so the number of plates varies. Perhaps the best idea would be to find a contemporary picture of a style you like the look of, and work out about how many plates there are on the front of the suit, and double it for front and back. Then work out the size of plates you need based on that, compared with your own body size.

Mateo, you'd probably be best to start a thread asking for info on late period Spanish armour. That way the people who know about it would be aware you want the information. They may not be reading a thread on Byzantine armour.

crazysaxon · Post by **crazysaxon** » Fri Jan 21, 2005 2:51 pm

i got bored last night and did a mok up in cardboard and found i need 300 plates.

so thank you all for the helpful advice

Egfroth · Post by **Egfroth** » Fri Jan 21, 2005 6:55 pm

Where are you going to have the fastening? At the front, back or sides? Don't forget to allow for a little bit of overlap, so you don't get a gap where you do the klivanion up.

crazysaxon · Post by **crazysaxon** » Fri Jan 21, 2005 10:08 pm

i am thinking of having it done up at the sides. iam also planning on using para cord to lace it ( still have a few hundred meters some where)

Gerhard von Liebau · Post by **Gerhard von Liebau** » Fri Jan 21, 2005 10:10 pm

Hey Crazy Saxon, welcome to the Archive!

I'm currently working on my own Rus-influenced Varangian outfit. I'm going for the "evil" splinted arm and leg armor, which most guys around here simply despise due to lack of evidence, but I like it, so... That's what I'm gonna' do! I need a new tunic, belt fittings, necklace, shoes, a shield and axe, and a new sword... But, here I am as of tonight!

Egfroth here has been helpin' me a lot, and is a great source of information! I think I'm making my outfit (circa 1125) a bit unpredictable for him, as I'm only a year into historic reenactment, and haven't been persuaded to do everything "by the book", yet.

[img]http://www.yoyofreak.net/forums/index.php?act=Attach&type=post&id=2657[/img]

Cheers!

-Gregory-

Egfroth · Post by **Egfroth** » Sat Jan 22, 2005 12:35 am

Gregory J. Liebau wrote:I'm currently working on my own Rus-influenced Varangian outfit. I'm going for the "evil" splinted arm and leg armor, which most guys around here simply despise due to lack of evidence, but I like it, so... That's what I'm gonna' do!

(Sigh!)
Looks good so far, though.

I need a new tunic, belt fittings, necklace, shoes, a shield and axe, and a new sword... But, here I am as of tonight!

A nice overall impression. What shoes are you planning on? Have you seen Peter Beatson's "Idiot-proof shoe-making" site?

-Gregory-

byzantine armour

byzantine armour

Late Period Spanish