The Armour Archive

I noticed that the bronze cross-guards have holes for screws/lagbolts but the aluminum ones do not. So how do they stay put?

I know several people that have used a 2 part epoxy. They say it works great. I have not done an aluminum one myself, so I cannot say for sure.

One has two brass rods inserted through it and peaned over on both ends along with wedges. The other has gorilla glue on it.

I've used a number of these, and we just drill a crosswise hole though the guard and the rattan, then put a shovel rivet through it and peen it over. Taking it out for the next sword is a matter of grinding it off and driving the remnants out.

I drill a hole in the guard, tap the hole for a hex-socketed set screw and tighten it down. This method keeps the guard from twisting with impacts but doesn't weaken the rattan as much as drilling a through-hole.
By the way, I really like my mandrake guards.

Alexander

I made some wood wedges from rattan and hammered them in. Then putt some strapping tape around the top and bottom just to besure they don't wiggle out. It seems to work pretty good.

Donngal

Mu problem was with the pommel. I kept shearing lag bolts when I used them, and when I made a taping fork, the damn thing kept spinning around on the rivit. I finally shoe-gooe'd it... hoping that will hold, but still remove easily.

As for the guard, I drilled through it and riveted through the rattan.

And... it didn't hold. I guess I'm going to have to order a taping fork from Mandrake, and see if that works any better than what I fabricated.

Curently Mandrake is working on a new Idea for the Cross gaurds and tapping forks. I to had the same problem with mine and kept sheering the Pewter scent stopper off even when it glued on. I also tried to use Wedges in the cross gaurd no luck. It seems that the RAttan would shrink and the wedges would fall out I even used some thick glue still no luck.

I was going to use the taping fork...but it didn't fit into the pommel! So I wood glued in a lag bolt.

I Gorilla Glue-d the crossgaurd on and used leather wedges, also glued, to tighten it up.


We will see if these hold up.

I did the same thing as Donngal. I shaved the rattan handle just enough to slide it to the location I wanted - the rattan was slightly thicker than the hole in the cross guard (quillion) and I then tapped wooden wedges (which came with mine from Mandrake) into the base and then strapping taped it at that area and have never had a problem.

Helmut

I have mounted my Mandrake cross guard as follows:

I first shave the hilt of the rattan so as to be a good fit on the cross guard
at the top and a good fit on the pommel. Between these areas, I also
shape the rattan so that it has an ovaloid cross section (like the handle of
a hammer).

Next I traced out the profile of the cross guard,on a piece of heavy card
stock.

On the card stock profile, I marked where I would want to drill through
the cross guard, and then using the profile, center punched the corresponding location(s) on the cross hilt.

Then I drilled though each side of the cross guard with a 3/16" drill, and
when that was complete, I drilled across the entire cross hilt with a 1/4"
drill to get both holes alligned.

I then placed the cross guard on the rattan, and drilled through the rattan, first with a 3/16" drill bit, and then a 1/4" drill bit.

I then inserted a 1/4-20 bolt through the rattan / cross guardassembly and marked the bolt for length, trimmed the bolt, and then tightened the nut.

For the space on the hilt between the cross guard and the pommel, I start
at the top and spiral wind a heavy duty cotton twine down the hilt. I then
cover the twine with a relavtively slow setting clear two part epoxy
(between 45 minutes to an hour setup time), and "push" the epoxy into
the twine with a popsicle stick.

Once the epoxy has set up, I drill a 3/16" hole down the hilt for the lag
bolt to hold on the pommel and use a 1/4" x 4 1/2" lag bolt.

A picture of the result is available here:

http://www.midrealm.org/rokkehealden/artsci/sword.JPG

I have had these swords in service for nearly four years without the
cross guard or pommel significantly loosening - a couple of times during
the first few months, I have had to tighten up the pommel.

-Keith/Austin.

Chadwick wrote:For the space on the hilt between the cross guard and the pommel, I start
at the top and spiral wind a heavy duty cotton twine down the hilt. I then
cover the twine with a relavtively slow setting clear two part epoxy
(between 45 minutes to an hour setup time), and "push" the epoxy into
the twine with a popsicle stick.

Once the epoxy has set up, I drill a 3/16" hole down the hilt for the lag
bolt to hold on the pommel and use a 1/4" x 4 1/2" lag bolt.

A picture of the result is available here:

http://www.midrealm.org/rokkehealden/artsci/sword.JPG

I have had these swords in service for nearly four years without the
cross guard or pommel significantly loosening - a couple of times during
the first few months, I have had to tighten up the pommel.

-Keith/Austin.

Austin, thanks.
I would not have thought of the epoxy on the cord wrapped grip.

Guy,

You are welcome.

I orginally came up with this system over 27 years ago to prevent the
hilt from being chewed up by steel clamshell gauntlets.

It has the fortunate secondary advantage that it prevents the rattan hilt
splitting (and thereby keeps the lag bolt securely fastened).

-Keith/Austin.

Hi!

I just got my two quillion/pommel sets for a pair of matched longswords from the postman.

Only question, though: The rattan staves I've chosen are quite a bit thinner than the quillion hole. I know that His Grace recommends automotive putty to fill the gap. Does anybody know how much of a build-up I can do with this? Or are there any other methods of closing the gaps for a good fit? The staves are perfect - good weight, perfect diameter on the blade, extremele straight, no skin damage - so I really want to use them.

Any help is most highly appreciated!


Cheers,
William
*polishing hilts and pommels for the final spiffyness *

Servus!


William, I use cloth tape (like the ACE brand stuff) until I have got enough in there to fill the gap.

Honestly, I have had one on since Christmas that is held on with nothing but the tape "wedge". I fight with a pretty enthusiastic crowd of knights and block heavily with my quillion and have not yet had the quillion slip. As for the pommel, I used a 3 inch wood screw and countersunkthe end of the pommel so the screw sits flush. A dab of wood glue on the threads before insertion and voilá!

YMMV...

First I ground down the rattan to as near a fit as I could. Then I hammered in little rattan shims until I couldn't fit anymore.
I do not recommend drilling through the rattan for a bolt through the quillions. This weakens the rattan too much in my opinion. I do use a small nail to help keep it from spinning/sliding. I have seen too many split at the quillions where a bolt has been.
Lastly, I build up a little tape above & below the quillions to further keep it from moving. It is fairly simple, as has been holding up good for me.

Mandrake quillions & rubber thrusting tips rock for those of you considering getting some, and their service is top notch.

Uric

After initially installing the quillions I noticed that they loosened up with use. I used the shims sold to lock in the hammer head to the wood handle. I cut them down, coated them with wood glue and drove them into the gap. It has not failed .

Olaf Haraldson wrote:And... it didn't hold. I guess I'm going to have to order a taping fork from Mandrake, and see if that works any better than what I fabricated.

The taping fork is the way to go. I had one of Mandrakes first generation Taping forks (wash with 2 welding pieces of sheet steel on it.) It lasted me 3 years before going south on me. His NEW generation of taping forks are WAY better.

Basically I attach it like this.

After making/cutting/drawknifing/sanding down the sword and handle like I want it, I then sand down the end of the handle to a tapper.

I seat the taping fork into the pommel and attach with a lag bolt and nut. I have pre-cut the length of the bolt to just clear the nut when the nut is screwed on. I tighten the assembly down and add a bit of bar cement or lock tight to keep it from working loose.

I also have predrilled 2 holes in the upper taper flanges.

I then seat the whole assembly around the tapered end of the handle and add a couple pieces of tap to hold it. I then take my drill and drill a hole through my predrilled holes on the upper flanges. I take a cut to length roofing nail, seat it through the hole and peen it over. I then wrap the flanges in strapping tape and then the whole handle in black athletic tape.

When the sword breaks simply cut the pommel assembly out, cut off the rivet, drill the hole in your next sword, attach and go.

I have yet had a pommel come off (accept after the tapping fork broke one of the welds, and this was after 3 years of use. AND Mandrake has fixed that problem with Gen 2.

I solved the stripping out of lag bolts from the rattan, and splitting my handle problems.

I need to re-attach my pommel to a sword this week, I will take pictures.

I had a buddy do his while visiting, downstairs in my shop. He lives in the barracks and he doesn't have any place to work.

He rasped the rattan down to almost small enough, and then hammered it in place with a rubber mallet. Then he used the drill press to punch a hole through the cross guard and ran a single six inch nail through it. He cut the nail off, and then peened both the nail end and the nail head. looked fine.

Haven't had any problems with the rattan weakening, That was over six months ago, and the sword is still fine.

freiman

Keith, that twine/epoxy grip is a great idea - and looks reasonably-period. Gonna have to try that when I mount my new Mandrake cross-guard & pommel. What kind of epoxy did you use?

Hi all,

here's the reason why I asked my question. As Drachenwald's Kingdom University this Saturday features a German Longsword class I've made two matching swords of this type:



Both are a little longer than 4 feet with a 1 foot handle (quillion included). For the handle I've shaved down the rattan, covered it in PVA glue, wrapped in hemp packaging cord, added a piece of thick hemp rope for the riser, brushed on another layer of PVA and wrapped the handle in calfskin. The whole thing was then again wrapped in thread and set aside to dry. After dying and waxing I'm pleased with the design (as well as covered in dust, glue and leather dye).

Oh, and the quillion was attached after wrapping the respective section of the rattan with thick cotton cloth (from my girlfriend's tent project) soaked in PVA. The quillion was then hammered on and secured with a brass rod peened over.


Cheers,
William
*now rushing on to the next pre-University project*

Chadwick wrote:Guy,

You are welcome.

I orginally came up with this system over 27 years ago to prevent the
hilt from being chewed up by steel clamshell gauntlets.

It has the fortunate secondary advantage that it prevents the rattan hilt
splitting (and thereby keeps the lag bolt securely fastened).

-Keith/Austin.

But to get an elegant look use glue to hold the cording down, stain it (oak seems to work nicely), then use marine varnish on the grip - pretty as all hell.
How've you been - it's been quite a while?

william wrote:Hi all,

here's the reason why I asked my question. As Drachenwald's Kingdom University this Saturday features a German Longsword class I've made two matching swords of this type:



Both are a little longer than 4 feet with a 1 foot handle (quillion included). For the handle I've shaved down the rattan, covered it in PVA glue, wrapped in hemp packaging cord, added a piece of thick hemp rope for the riser, brushed on another layer of PVA and wrapped the handle in calfskin. The whole thing was then again wrapped in thread and set aside to dry. After dying and waxing I'm pleased with the design (as well as covered in dust, glue and leather dye).

Oh, and the quillion was attached after wrapping the respective section of the rattan with thick cotton cloth (from my girlfriend's tent project) soaked in PVA. The quillion was then hammered on and secured with a brass rod peened over.


Cheers,
William
*now rushing on to the next pre-University project*

I officaly hate you, thanks for setting the bar so high , just kidding that looks awsome, almost too pritty for a disposable sword, great job. I just got my mandrake aluminum set yesterday hopefully it will look half that good when im done with it.

Amos,

thank you for your kind words. If this swords lives through one season (I guess it does) it was worth the effort.

But first of all I hope that bringing two of these to D'wald University will entice some of the fine gentles in attendance to help me rlieve the burden of a quest ...

Cheers,
William
*19 hours and only one project to finish - besides packing, a few hours of sleep and then a final 1/2 day of work ... *