Butt hurt Driven, How ya been? Not doing much with your life I see. Yes, I happen to now be signed to the world's biggest record label. Yes, I think I'll be on Ozzfest since I'm not as cool
meaning that it plays a key role in energy metabolism. The name Sweet potato, baked 1 medium 130 what areas they primarily target. They?ve also been grouped by
Great scenery, almost makes me home-sick, well second homesick, worked in Seattle for four years Like the auto rental wash area, nice touch Only problem is a log jam when you start up the scenery
cellular organelles has been examined concentration) give the values of the O2 equilibrium levels of modified and misfolded proteins
future vs daltons
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Patrick
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future vs daltons
Last edited by Patrick on Tue Sep 07, 2010 1:44 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Johann ColdIron
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You have given this alot of good thought an I agree with most of what you said. You have not mentioed a helm type that she is currently fighting in so it might be difficult for us to problem solve it's adaptation. It is very difficult to make a helm work with only a under the chin strap. The people I know do it in the good custom helms that were made to fit there heads. Most have an coif that spreads the shock load across a whole helm/coif system.
Bevors do limit side to side movement unless the articulation is perfect. They also go with a set of specific helms that you may or may not have. If it is a strap back gorget style it will not take the place of a chin strap as it is not part of the helm.
I have seen several SCA Sallets that have the bevor built into the base of the helm and when padded could keep it on her head. Marshals might still want some sort of chin strap.
Some helms like Barbutes can be made close so that padded cheeks do most of the holding. My Knight Thorbrandr has TMJ and it worked for him. Done right you can't have it driven into your face and a bottom loop holds it on the head. It does put much more strain on the neck as there is no give in the helm/face area.
In Rapier combat I fight in a Burgonet that has a closed face/faux bevor with no real chinstrap. Just a cord. The gorget prevents it from being driven into my face. I plan to do the same with a heavy helm soon. You can see pics here for the basic idea. http://forums.armourarchive.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=55389
I'm no expert but I would suggest saving up for a helm that will work. It will be an intricate job making sure the helm/gorget/coif system takes the energy and does not transfer it to the jaw. A padded bevor that can contact her chin can still transfer the blow if hit by a 10.
The real question it how much is her jaw worth? If she is serious about fighting it is worth the helmet that will make it possible.
Hope that helps
Bevors do limit side to side movement unless the articulation is perfect. They also go with a set of specific helms that you may or may not have. If it is a strap back gorget style it will not take the place of a chin strap as it is not part of the helm.
I have seen several SCA Sallets that have the bevor built into the base of the helm and when padded could keep it on her head. Marshals might still want some sort of chin strap.
Some helms like Barbutes can be made close so that padded cheeks do most of the holding. My Knight Thorbrandr has TMJ and it worked for him. Done right you can't have it driven into your face and a bottom loop holds it on the head. It does put much more strain on the neck as there is no give in the helm/face area.
In Rapier combat I fight in a Burgonet that has a closed face/faux bevor with no real chinstrap. Just a cord. The gorget prevents it from being driven into my face. I plan to do the same with a heavy helm soon. You can see pics here for the basic idea. http://forums.armourarchive.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=55389
I'm no expert but I would suggest saving up for a helm that will work. It will be an intricate job making sure the helm/gorget/coif system takes the energy and does not transfer it to the jaw. A padded bevor that can contact her chin can still transfer the blow if hit by a 10.
The real question it how much is her jaw worth? If she is serious about fighting it is worth the helmet that will make it possible.
Hope that helps
John Cope/ Sir Johann ColdIron/ Don Juan Calderon
I'm not dead yet!
I'm not dead yet!
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Mad Matt
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I might be wrong but far as I know a chin strap that just goes under the chin is legal too. Don't take my word for it though.
The budding mid 14th century German Transitional guy.
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gmandragora
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Hi,
I just finished having a boatload of expensive dental work done. My dentist wanted me (at first) to wear a TMJ mouth guard while fighting. While these are expensive (about $50.00) they are cheaper than a new helm.
For me, after careful examination, they determined that a standard "contact sport" mouthguard was better ($2.00) due to my unusual bite (shoulda had braces)
As they explained it to me, the TMJ mouthguard is made of hard clear plastic and fits suggly to the top teeth it is more comfortable and easier to breath around than the usual kind.
After explaing to my dentist what we do, and showing my helm -- he was shocked to learn that mouth guards aren't common.
By the way my detal problems are not from SCA fighting, but from previous bad dentistry...
I just finished having a boatload of expensive dental work done. My dentist wanted me (at first) to wear a TMJ mouth guard while fighting. While these are expensive (about $50.00) they are cheaper than a new helm.
For me, after careful examination, they determined that a standard "contact sport" mouthguard was better ($2.00) due to my unusual bite (shoulda had braces)
As they explained it to me, the TMJ mouthguard is made of hard clear plastic and fits suggly to the top teeth it is more comfortable and easier to breath around than the usual kind.
After explaing to my dentist what we do, and showing my helm -- he was shocked to learn that mouth guards aren't common.
By the way my detal problems are not from SCA fighting, but from previous bad dentistry...
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Johann ColdIron
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Mad Matt wrote:I might be wrong but far as I know a chin strap that just goes under the chin is legal too.
They are legal. It is just hard to negate the horizontal force of a thrown blow with it alone. The cupping of the chin helps keep it it place. Most helms want to pivot when the bar grill in pushed in towards the face. It is one of the standard marshal helm tests and should be considered if you want to pass
John Cope/ Sir Johann ColdIron/ Don Juan Calderon
I'm not dead yet!
I'm not dead yet!
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Patrick
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Thanks for the suggestions, so far.
Regarding saving up for a helm, that's definitely a very effective way to go. However, we are talking about the difference between fighting comfortably in a year or more (save, order, wait for helm to be built, then be able to use it) and being able to fight in something that can be worked out sooner.
Right now, she is wearing a fairly basic closed-face spangenhelm. The sort of thing most garage armorers (me) can bang out in a couple of weekends. I can make a great helm, a spangenhelm, a basic spuntop helm, and so on, but only with riveted construction. I do not have the welding equipment and skills to make a grill. I've seen riveted grills, even made a couple, but I don't really trust them, since there's a lot of metal removed when drilling for the rivet hole.
I guess what I was really looking for was something like "oh, that's easy, just do this simple thing you never thought of before and it will work fine!" Well, I guess we need to work out a tack to take with what we have on hand. The money for a better helm will acrue slowly (there's always that one bill waiting to be paid, you know...), but it will acrue.
Currently, I think the strategy will be to get her into a grilled helm with a lot of face room and use an under-chin strap and careful padding. The idea is to avoid any possibilty of the helm being driven far enough back to actually contact the lovely face of my wife. I'm not exactly thrilled with this method, but I can't think what else to do. Any and every suggestion about how to make this work feasibly will be highly appreciated.
And thanks again for the input so far.
-Patrick
Regarding saving up for a helm, that's definitely a very effective way to go. However, we are talking about the difference between fighting comfortably in a year or more (save, order, wait for helm to be built, then be able to use it) and being able to fight in something that can be worked out sooner.
Right now, she is wearing a fairly basic closed-face spangenhelm. The sort of thing most garage armorers (me) can bang out in a couple of weekends. I can make a great helm, a spangenhelm, a basic spuntop helm, and so on, but only with riveted construction. I do not have the welding equipment and skills to make a grill. I've seen riveted grills, even made a couple, but I don't really trust them, since there's a lot of metal removed when drilling for the rivet hole.
I guess what I was really looking for was something like "oh, that's easy, just do this simple thing you never thought of before and it will work fine!" Well, I guess we need to work out a tack to take with what we have on hand. The money for a better helm will acrue slowly (there's always that one bill waiting to be paid, you know...), but it will acrue.
Currently, I think the strategy will be to get her into a grilled helm with a lot of face room and use an under-chin strap and careful padding. The idea is to avoid any possibilty of the helm being driven far enough back to actually contact the lovely face of my wife. I'm not exactly thrilled with this method, but I can't think what else to do. Any and every suggestion about how to make this work feasibly will be highly appreciated.
And thanks again for the input so far.
-Patrick
Johann ColdIron wrote:Mad Matt wrote:I might be wrong but far as I know a chin strap that just goes under the chin is legal too.
They are legal. It is just hard to negate the horizontal force of a thrown blow with it alone. The cupping of the chin helps keep it it place. Most helms want to pivot when the bar grill in pushed in towards the face. It is one of the standard marshal helm tests and should be considered if you want to pass
If you pad the brow band, backplate, and bowl to get a very "snug" fit it will hold the helm in place, you can then set the chinstrap just forward of the ears, to under the jaw. You do have to wear the strap tight, but it will pull the helm down onto your head, and hold it firm against hits into the faceplate.
I hate chin cups since I feel they put too much impace into the jaw
Sweat in the tiltyard, or bleed on the field.