Helmet question, good ways to cover...

Ilia_Caid · Post by **Ilia_Caid** » Mon Mar 31, 2008 3:44 pm

Greetings all,

I do not know if this is the best forum to post this, but at worst I would get redirected.

This past weekend I was gifted a helm on "semi-permanent loan" from a Duke until he has time to assist me in making my own (at least 8+ months). The helm was one of his personal helms (a huge honor for me btw) and it fits great.

However, the helm has Ducal Leaves on it. I am not to remove them, so that leaves me to cover them up somehow.

Does anyone have any good suggestions on how to attach something that wont fall off without modifying the helm too much? I want to be able remove said item and return his helm unchanged.

I thought of using leather to make a headband to cover them, but at the same time don't want it to have the appearance of a coronet. I know I could just tie a headband on it, but I would like to see what others thought before I go around looking like the Karate Kid...

Any suggestions would be much appreciated.

Halberds · Post by **Halberds** » Mon Mar 31, 2008 4:15 pm

Duct tape

Uilleag · Post by **Uilleag** » Mon Mar 31, 2008 4:23 pm

A beautiful braided torse done in your colors. It would look much better than karate kid.

Ingvarr · Post by **Ingvarr** » Mon Mar 31, 2008 4:34 pm

House of the Wolf wrote:A beautiful braided torse done in your colors. It would look much better than karate kid. :P ;)

That was my first thought, but it depends a lot on the helmet. A picture might help.

Blk_jouster · Post by **Blk_jouster** » Mon Mar 31, 2008 6:36 pm

House of the Wolf wrote:A beautiful braided torse done in your colors. It would look much better than karate kid.

I would agree totally on this suggestion. I used to use one on my rattan helm in yellow and black with a red drape.

Konstantin the Red · Post by **Konstantin the Red** » Mon Mar 31, 2008 11:58 pm

This query being from an SCA context, one thing that would help would be to discover if this is indeed a helm helm, or some kind of helmet -- a non-bucket headpiece. Then, Ilia, we'd feel sure we could offer stylistic suggestions that would not be absurd.

If it's a topfhelm, a torse and mantle is very good; if a bascinet, the torse has evolved into an orle, whose appearance was often that of a thick, stuffed wreath, adapting a pointy bascinet to the corners of a helm in a friction fit.

Yes, I say you are very much honored and very much trusted: your Duke is showing that he trusts you not to give the Ducal strawberry leaves a bad name, and so much so that he's quashing any misgivings he might have about a fighter who is not a Duke running around under his coronet. This is your opportunity to behave chivalrously, carefully, virtuously, and truly as a Knight: take that opportunity. It may be the making of you as a Peer.

Ilia_Caid · Post by **Ilia_Caid** » Tue Apr 01, 2008 2:57 am

I apologize for not clarifying the helmet type (work had me distracted

). A few pictures below

Again, thank you all for any suggestions.

Daithi' ua Conri' · Post by **Daithi' ua Conri'** » Tue Apr 01, 2008 5:54 am

Well seeing as it is a Roman cav helm (a really nice one at that) might I suggest a wreath of some sort to pay homage to the Roman nature of the helm. Could be done in either stuffed fabric or leather and attched such that it was easily removable. Just a thought.

Otto von Teich · Post by **Otto von Teich** » Tue Apr 01, 2008 6:54 am

Its not really a coronet though, Just leaf decoration. It might be ok just to leaf it as it is....pun intended... :wink:

Brynjolfr Hrafnsson · Post by **Brynjolfr Hrafnsson** » Tue Apr 01, 2008 7:23 am

I have to agree. I would not have recognized that readily as ducal decoration, to me at first glance it looks just like plain old decoration.

Why dont you see if you can get a pass on it fromt he powers that be in your local group of fighters, then when the time comes to travel abroad (say to Pennsic etc) where you will meet more, then worry about covering it there.

Also, talk to the Duke about it. If he wants you to get them covered, then I guess you had best find a way. But if he says, just fight, then he can help deflect any criticism you get.

InsaneIrish · Post by **InsaneIrish** » Tue Apr 01, 2008 7:44 am

I like the wreath idea. Also, bear and wolf and fox pelts with the heads were used ontop of roman helms too. Although if you use a real one you may end up spending enough to just buy a new helm.

Eamonn MacCampbell · Post by **Eamonn MacCampbell** » Tue Apr 01, 2008 8:11 am

Would this be Duke Guy of House Silver Oaks helmet? I have seen that helm design a few times... :wink:

lorenzo2 · Post by **lorenzo2** » Tue Apr 01, 2008 9:49 am

Yes, looks like a duke guy helm to me also.

Hospitaller@Acre · Post by **Hospitaller@Acre** » Tue Apr 01, 2008 10:32 am

Looks like a attempt at Strawberry Leaves..as in Ducal..since it is early period...going to be a tough one ..a cloth role won't look right..maybe a weaved multicolored leather band..different shades of brown?
Rannulf

Ilia_Caid · Post by **Ilia_Caid** » Tue Apr 01, 2008 10:53 am

Yes, the helm belongs to Duke Guy of Castle Kirk. I was pretty speechless when he pulled it out for me to use. He mentioned me covering them as to not offend others, although I didn't think too much about it not having the actual coronet, but still I would not want to offend.

I think I will attempt the wreath idea - I'll post more pictures for suggestions/comments when I get it worked out.

Thank you all very much!

Broadway · Post by **Broadway** » Tue Apr 01, 2008 10:57 am

Leave it as is. If anybody says anything to you, say its not your helm.

Its not like you'll be wearing it forever.

Konstantin the Red · Post by **Konstantin the Red** » Wed Apr 02, 2008 2:09 am

Well, hmm. The leaves look less like a broadleaf plant than like something that reminds me of yew... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Yew

Addition of yew berries as in the above entry?

Heath B fraychef · Post by **Heath B fraychef** » Wed Apr 02, 2008 2:23 am

ilia, i believe the best way to get those covered completely and without offending anyone would be to win crown a few times.
then you just dont sweat it.

InsaneIrish · Post by **InsaneIrish** » Wed Apr 02, 2008 7:47 am

something like this might look neat. Especially if you do some repossse and make it out of leather.

Gregoire de Lyon · Post by **Gregoire de Lyon** » Wed Apr 02, 2008 11:10 am

It's clearly mild steel - how about four round pieces of flexible magnet. Make them out of blue/red/whatever and have exchangeable sets. It'll be like duct tape for marking sides but not.

losthelm · Post by **losthelm** » Wed Apr 02, 2008 11:35 am

tooled strip of leather with your personal device local group device or kingdome device perhaps some heraldic animal or roman type would look sweet or my favorite thin strap around the helm in greek "property of Duke Guy of Castle Kirk"

Ilia_Caid · Post by **Ilia_Caid** » Wed Apr 02, 2008 2:29 pm

I like the sounds of the leather tooled with the wreath.

Once again, thanks all!

--P.S. Fraygod - I'll get right on that

Oswyn_de_Wulferton · Post by **Oswyn_de_Wulferton** » Wed Apr 02, 2008 2:39 pm

Would that run afoul of the Laurel "Augmentation"?

Ilia_Caid · Post by **Ilia_Caid** » Wed Apr 02, 2008 3:00 pm

good point.. Oswyn - I've never heard of anything like that, but it would not surprise me.

I will contact a few more people in my Kingdom for advice.

in any case I can post a pic or 2 if anyone is interested down the road.

brunester · Post by **brunester** » Wed Apr 02, 2008 3:55 pm

ooo the magnet idea sounds cool.
some of that magnet tape with your design over them?

Sean Powell · Post by **Sean Powell** » Wed Apr 02, 2008 5:28 pm

OK so the Helmet is Roman but what is the rest of your suit like? If it is generally 14th century then a torse would be keeping with the rest of your suit if not with the helm and it's something you can keep (at least stylisticly for later helms.

Sean

Helmet question, good ways to cover...

Helmet question, good ways to cover...

Gotta cover it