The Armour Archive

Hi everyone,

I recently got it into my head to make some coin "armor." More a work of art, less a suit of armor.

I'm thinking that I'm going to use pennies, and I wanna get 'em flat first. What's the best way to flatten a penny that will leave it in a shape that resembles a circle? I was thinking maybe if I just put 'em on an anvil and gave a good hard whack with a mallet. Then I thought, "C'mon, I'm not that strong."

Then the next question was, if I have to drill all these pennies, is there a way to drill a whole bunch at a time?

And finally - do you think riveting them to the leather will keep 'em on securely, or will the leather stretch and fall apart?

If you can answer one or more of these questions, I will be very greatful.

Take care,
Shayyadin

as far as drilling is concerned, if you use a plastic or metal tube the size of the pennies, then you could run em through a drill press fairly well...

G--

when i was a bit younger i used a train
to flatten them they came out with bit of a tear drop shape
once you have them flattened you could probibly punch them with a witney
or a harbor freight knock off

i am not condoning the use of trains in the production of armour or placing things on the track and stuff reading this post releases the reader from any liability that may come from any simalar atempt involving a train and a large amount of coins

------------------
"we can't bury shelly, she's our friend."
(Ash, to Scott after watching him hack off the limbs of his possessed girl friend and then suggest that they bury the remaining parts)

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Shayyadin:
I was thinking maybe if I just put 'em on an anvil and gave a good hard whack with a mallet<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

So I says to myself.. "Self, it's only a penny. What can it hurt?"

I took a penny out to my garage, placed it on my hunk of train rail, and whacked it.

1) I couldn't find any of my heavier hammers, so I started with a light duty hammer. Results: pathetic.
2) If you can't find the right tool... find a sledghammer! I grabbed my 10lb sledge, set it onto the penny (that was already on the anvil), held the handle (played fulcrum) about 20" back from the head, lifted the head off the penny about 12", and let it drop. Results: probably okay. The diameter isn't much larger than a penny, but it's flat, fairly round, and I can't see Abe or the Lincoln Memorial. I'd want a smooth-faced hammer though.

If I were to do however many are needed for a coat, I would rig up some sort of actual fulcrum so the hammer hit flush with the anvil surface each time.

-- jt --

Everytime I come up with a new idea someone else gets the same idea.

They are already flat! Why flatten them more? You will lose any strength they have.

I use my whitney punch to pierce a hole right above the linclon memorial, the plan was to just sew them to heavy canvas, then I thought "hmmm, pop-rivits!"

So far this has been a joke-in-progress, between Lukas and myself.

Odd suggestion here, did you explore the price of copper washers that are about the size of pennies? You may find the reduction in labor justifes the added expense.

Eric

Think alternate currency. Japanese 5 yen coins already have a nice hole premade in them. Of course that is about a nickle a pop which quickly adds up. Try some third world currency were you can get lot of coinage for a buck. You should be able to find something cheaper than pennies to use.

:shaking head: People, we're talking about defacing GOVERNMENT property here!
That IS a federal offense, ya know.
Not trying to say it wouldn't work, I just don't think it's legally safe to use currency.
There was a thread posted on the old .com site about the same idea, only my take on it was to use a very large diameter punch and simply rivet them together.
I believe I came up with the solution of finding a one inch or so steel rod cut to the shape of the scales and a die to match, then whacking the top of the rod really really hard to punch the shape out of some sheet metal. A very low tech hole punch, but it works.

------------------
You stare at me because I'm different.
I stare at you because you aren't.

I was actually thinking of making armour out of beer bottle caps. Just takes one good smack to flatten. The best part is it advertises two loves at once: beer and armour ). As far as cost, they tend to be foraged off of apartment floors )

-severian

Actually, you can drill, smash or otherwise alter U.S. coins without breaking the law. HOWEVER, having altered them, it is then unlawful to try to spend them or otherwise pass them back into the currency stream.

For the straight dope, try: http://www.usmint.gov/

------------------
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Hit</A> hot iron: www.anvilfire.com

Hi there all, and happy new millenium!

Black Prince- No worries! Coins are NOT government property! They are produced by a private company, and do not fall under the aegeis of the treasury dept., so pound away! Of course, do so within reason. And if there is still a question of legality, just remember those machines that make trinkets out of pennies-- if it was illegal, you could bet they would not be around very long.

M.S.

One of my buds made a "brigandine" using aluminum Mardi Gras dubloons. Check with any company that makes tokens for places like Chuck E. Cheeses.

Hmmm "Chuck E. Cheese" armour?

Talk about something for a tacky tourney.

These have been some very helpful feedbacks.

I really want to go with the actual pennies, as well as other "real" materials, because of the nature of the project.

This will be my "senior thesis" for high school - the creation of an article or set of articles of armor-turned-art to reflect the essence of my fascination with the craft.

The focus is on the ability of armor to allow us to transcend the limitations of our frail human frames, giving us attributes that are otherwise reserved for things immortal or built. It is the outward synthesis of man and machine, of machine and art, and this is what fascinates me.

Through armor, we can have the sinews and bodies of the gods of old, complete with gleaming bodies of silver and gold. We can be beautiful and splendid to behold, or horrifying, striking terror into the beholder.

The variety of armor that existed in each period, and the amount of effort armorers put toward the aesthetics of armor, are proof that in addition to protection, armor has served as the highest form of costume - unlike costumes that create the illusion of superhuman abilities, the armor we don allows us to survive and, indeed, utterly ignore assaults that would normally incapacitate, maim or even kill a mortal man.

We become what we are not.

My challenge to myself was to boil this down into a representation of armor that can be constructed using mundane things - turning them into what they are not, as well.

A good armor-sculptor can create muscled greaves. A good armor-smith can make a fine bascinet.

The goal here is to see what an armor-art-nerd can churn out. We have yet to see whether I can call myself "good" at anything aside from chainmaille, which I'm decent at. (I made a shirt of Cross pattern king's maille a little while back.)

Coins, electronic parts (can't wait to tear into the scrap heap), beercaps, wire nets (mail and otherwise) made of high-cap electric wire...

Sort of a cross between the "Borg" from Star Trek and a Harley Jacket - scrap heap meets black leather, you know?

Shayyadin

[This message has been edited by Shayyadin (edited 01-01-2001).]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by The Black Prince:
<B>:shaking head: People, we're talking about defacing GOVERNMENT property here!
That IS a federal offense, ya know.
Not trying to say it wouldn't work, I just don't think it's legally safe to use currency.
There was a thread posted on the old .com site about the same idea, only my take on it was to use a very large diameter punch and simply rivet them together.
I believe I came up with the solution of finding a one inch or so steel rod cut to the shape of the scales and a die to match, then whacking the top of the rod really really hard to punch the shape out of some sheet metal. A very low tech hole punch, but it works.

</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Actually no it is not a federal offense to deface currency... It IS a federal offense to deface and attempt to SPEND said currency, otherwise how would state fairs and carnivals be able to run those machines that smoosh and stamp the pennies into little trinkets?

G--
(Amateur coin collector)

You probably already know this, but you will have to watch what year pennies you use, too. Pre 1980-ish they are copper, after that they are mostly zinc with a copper coating.

> The focus is on the ability of armor to allow us to transcend the limitations of our frail human frames, giving us attributes that are otherwise reserved for things immortal or built... We become what we are not.

Well said! And, if I may add, wise for your tender years.

Many of the same things can be said of money. So, from an artistic point of view, an armor coat of coins makes perfect sense. Good luck!

-BT

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Troy:
<B>You probably already know this, but you will have to watch what year pennies you use, too. Pre 1980-ish they are copper, after that they are mostly zinc with a copper coating.

</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

1982 is the first year that they started making em from zinc. Some 82s are all copper, but you can't really tell by looking at them which is which.

G--

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Galileo:
Some 82s are all copper, but you can't really tell by looking at them which is which.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You can, though, tell by sound. Copper pennies will ring "brightly" when dropped on a hard surface. The cheap ones will "click" more than they ring. Just find a pre-80s penny, and use it as a reference.

FWIW, the penny I test-smashed was a cheap one. It stayed copper-color. Don't know how it would wear, though.

-- jt --

a while ago I was working on a lamelar byrnie sort of thing out of pennies... I just used a hammer to flatten them on a metal block, flattening them just enough to smooth out the faces but not deform them... the faces of the coin were still noticable for a while... copper was darker in what was the low areas of the faces, and more polished in what was the high areas... but that went away after a while...
heh, one hole's not bad... the lamelar I was working on needed eight holes in each pennie, placed very precisly so the 1/8"ID 18ga stainless links could properly link them together.. used a cheap whitney handpunch nockoff to punch the holes until someone broke my smallest punch which was the one I used for that... also center punched the location of each hole before punching... I have the shoulder doubling of the armor done but I've been trying to find a place that sells replacement punches.. when it's done, if ever, it'll look sort of like a waist length lorica hamata made from copper lamelar discs.. the shoulder doubling is the greek design... but I've always thought that learning how to do expanding lamelar for something like the "celtic" style doubling would be interesting.. even though it prolly never existed..
good luck with your project Shayyadin...
oh, one other thing to consider with coins from other countries... even if you can't find ones with holes already in them for a resonable exchange rate, you could prolly get a lot more coins than 100 if you changed your dollar for coins from some third world country...

shayydin: wow. can we get that permanently posted somewhere. I think I will hang that statement in my armoury!

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"I'm not fast,
I'm Caffinated!"

I'll tell you what. I have to write my "official" senior grant "Statement of Purpose," which explains (and justifies) my use of school time for this purpose.

So I will have a very carefully crafted version of that, much better written. I'll post it to the Armour Archive and onto Sihaya.net when I've written it.

By the way - if you liked that, you might like this (cynical) story I wrote about a crusader, called "Hero." Read it here

I'd love to hear what you think.

Shayyadin

[This message has been edited by Shayyadin (edited 01-03-2001).]