15th C. Thugz! Show us your kit!

Black Swan Designs · Post by **Black Swan Designs** » Sat Dec 12, 2009 12:48 pm

Less time talking, more time making cool things! More pictures please!!!

Black Swan Designs · Post by **Black Swan Designs** » Sat Dec 12, 2009 1:28 pm

(Couldn't wait for more!!)

I have have almost nothing but images from our events, and people mostly take pictures of armour! I did find a couple that are 15th C. 'stuff', not specifically armour-

Lady of Honour and Lady judges.

'Still life with crests'

Petter Ellingsen

I love these pictures of Jeff-

(Hehehe- Jeff looks like a kid on a pony next to Arne!!)

d-farrell2 · Post by **d-farrell2** » Sat Dec 12, 2009 5:41 pm

chef de chambre wrote:15th century latin would be medieval Latin rather than classical, and it would be something on the order of, translated into English 1400and whatever years since the advent of our Lord.

Not sure about the latin, but I know it is common to find the term 'Quattrocento' in Italian to refer to the 1400s. Though given the relation between the, it may not be all that different.

chef de chambre · Post by **chef de chambre** » Sat Dec 12, 2009 6:47 pm

That is modern Italian for the term, I don;t see any indication it was used as a descriptive for people living during the era. They thought in term of reigns of kings, popes, and the number of years since the Advent.

Like, in late medieval English, you will see people refer to the date sometimes as being 'the six year of the reign of king Edward', and the like.

Kaos · Post by **Kaos** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 3:35 am

Black Swan Designs wrote:Less time talking, more time making cool things! More pictures please!!!

Alrighty then! These aren't pictures of me, but I consider myself a 15th C. thug and these are my photo's, so there.. Just keep filling this thread with cool pics!

These are some of the photo's I took at yesterday's Midwinterfair in Archeon, The Netherlands, featuring my friends Arne, Matthijs, Bart, Alix & Cor:

Somehow this photo is very Durer to me.

Plenty of thugs where I come from..
All these photo's are copyright 2009 by Ben van Koert.

Carnifex- · Post by **Carnifex-** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 3:19 pm

Fantastic pictures and kits everyone. Is there something comparable for 14th cent Man at Arms too?

Bleddyn De Caldicot · Post by **Bleddyn De Caldicot** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 4:45 pm

Carnifex- wrote:Fantastic pictures and kits everyone. Is there something comparable for 14th cent Man at Arms too?

The one true century

http://forums.armourarchive.org/phpBB2/ ... 4e4d3aef32

http://forums.armourarchive.org/phpBB2/ ... hp?t=85680

MJBlazek · Post by **MJBlazek** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 5:32 pm

Bleddyn De Caldicot wrote:
Carnifex- wrote:Fantastic pictures and kits everyone. Is there something comparable for 14th cent Man at Arms too?
The one true century

http://forums.armourarchive.org/phpBB2/ ... 4e4d3aef32

http://forums.armourarchive.org/phpBB2/ ... hp?t=85680

Pish.. the One True Century... bah... we are the Yakuza to your Mafia...

Bleddyn De Caldicot · Post by **Bleddyn De Caldicot** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 5:47 pm

MJBlazek wrote:
Bleddyn De Caldicot wrote:
Carnifex- wrote:Fantastic pictures and kits everyone. Is there something comparable for 14th cent Man at Arms too?
The one true century

http://forums.armourarchive.org/phpBB2/ ... 4e4d3aef32

http://forums.armourarchive.org/phpBB2/ ... hp?t=85680
Pish.. the One True Century... bah... we are the Yakuza to your Mafia...

Have fun losing your finger

Anon001 · Post by **Anon001** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 7:19 pm

deleted

Lloyd · Post by **Lloyd** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 9:34 pm

Ingrid wrote:All these sallets... *wistful sigh*

Actually, all those kits. Currently all I've got is my arming cote/gambeson -- I'll post some pics after it is 100% finished... right now it is at 99%. I changed my mind and am switching it from ties to buttons.

(going to go find a corner to sit in and feel sorry for myself....)

Hey Ingrid, we are still working on a 15th century LH group, if you are interested....

Leo Medii · Post by **Leo Medii** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 9:54 pm

Charlotte J · Post by **Charlotte J** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 10:08 pm

MJBlazek wrote:
Pish.. the One True Century... bah... we are the Yakuza to your Mafia...

The Fifteenth Century... Not your grandfather's mafia...

Although, my next two big projects will be fourteenth century, and THEN early 15th. I LOVE the early fifteenth - so often grouped in with it's earlier cousin, and overshadowed by the latter part of the century...

Baron Eirik · Post by **Baron Eirik** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 10:14 pm

Leo Medii wrote:

I see you borrowed some of Vitus' kit.

His squire, Eldric.

James Arlen Gillaspie · Sun Dec 13, 2009 10:24 pm

It's a twelve year old piece of crap, but here's my 'band of brothers' harness. The thing I like about this style, is that it has everything I like about the 'Black Prince' style but replaces mail with plate (the One True Armour!

). The action shot shows, though, that you still need the pesky stuff in places.

Anon001 · Post by **Anon001** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 10:50 pm

deleted

Black Swan Designs · Post by **Black Swan Designs** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 1:43 am

Do you *really* want to joust in a sallet????

zachos · Post by **zachos** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 2:54 am

A link for those who want to joust in a sallet:

link

Similar things happen if you use cheap close helms or armets, so go as expensive as you can on the helmet.

Kaos · Post by **Kaos** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 5:13 am

Great minds think alike Zachos, I wanted to post that photo of Arne as well, along with one I couldn't find of Toby recieving a lance on his bevor. (or it could be Steve, can't remember it very well.)

The sallet is a war helmet, not a sports helmet. It allows improved mobility, but at the expense of safety. It's more suited for a melee than a frogmouth, but even then there are better alternatives to be found.

It's better than nothing, I guess, but even when choosing a sallet for jousting, buy the very best you can afford, because your life WILL depend on it, someday. I've heard and seen plenty of tales involving splinters in eyes, lances in eyes, fractured faces and other general unpleasantness.

Anon001 · Post by **Anon001** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 8:28 am

deleted

MJBlazek · Post by **MJBlazek** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 9:43 am

Black Swan Designs wrote:Do you *really* want to joust in a sallet????

Hey Gwen.. aren't those your boys jousting in sallets in the link zachos put up?

Jeffrey Hedgecock · Post by **Jeffrey Hedgecock** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 10:38 am

That is Toby and Arne, before they both got better helmets. Stuff like this taught us that this crowd has gotten good enough that sallets aren't good enough protection for the jousting we're doing these days.

MJBlazek · Post by **MJBlazek** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 11:12 am

Jeffrey Hedgecock wrote:That is Toby and Arne, before they both got better helmets. Stuff like this taught us that this crowd has gotten good enough that sallets aren't good enough protection for the jousting we're doing these days.

I bet that woke Arne up really quick....

Lloyd · Post by **Lloyd** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 11:59 am

Really not doing much of the jousting (I was forced to retire), but we are working on getting a good LH educational group together again.

If you want to joust in a sallet, get this one from Cory Hurt: http://www.ageofarmour.com/instock/closesallet.html

Mostly we are working on WMA and doing school shows (yes, I do still TEACH jousting).[/img]

Black Swan Designs · Post by **Black Swan Designs** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 12:49 pm

@zachos- I was there when Arne took that shot, which is why I posed the question.

@mBlazek- What Kaos and Jeff said

@Lloyd- I know that helmet, it now belongs to Steve Mallet. Knowing the helmet on a first name basis, I still pose the question - 'Do you *really* want to joust in a sallet???"

Gwen

Jeffrey Hedgecock · Post by **Jeffrey Hedgecock** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 12:51 pm

Close Sallets.......

while they can be an option for jousting, remember sallets are a field helmet...not for jousting. For jousting, these helmets have to be built in a very specific way and special attention needs to be paid to all three catches-- the bevor lock, the bevor lame and the visor. If they don't work well and lock positively, the helmet can be quite difficult to use and bordering on unsafe.

My teammate Steve Mallett purchased the very helmet from Cory shown above. You can see him in the background of the photo of Toby and Arne. He's had quite a bit of trouble with the helmet's latches, which have needed rework and adjustment. I think some of this is that his liner isn't done very well (he got that made independently) and since it wasn't made for him it doesn't fit too well. He also rides in a way that puts some extra upward stress on the bevor. That said, the helmet was available at the time Steve needed one.

I wasn't aware that Cory was still taking armour orders. Perhaps this has changed.

In any case, there are several helmets that are better suited and more appropriate for jousting than sallets of any type. If you really want to have a sallet, it would probably be best to get a different helmet for jousting.

As a side note, Arne got a minor concussion and whiplash from that strike. I was a little worried about him, but he seemed ok the next day when he took Gwen and me to Manchester airport. He's a tough cookie.

Jeffrey Hedgecock · Post by **Jeffrey Hedgecock** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 12:57 pm

Here's Steve:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/jonathanho ... 256848681/

MJBlazek · Post by **MJBlazek** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 1:02 pm

Gwen,

I love that cotte/gown (educate me!

) that Petter Ellingsen is wearing in that pic.

Did you make it?

Black Swan Designs · Post by **Black Swan Designs** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 1:12 pm

it's a pleated coat over a mahoitred doublet. Yes, I made his outfit. Here are other pleated coats/outfits I've made-

Jeffrey

My brother Dom

Here's a tutorial if you want to take a stab at making your own (photo is a link)-

Gwen

MJBlazek · Post by **MJBlazek** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 1:16 pm

Make one myself! You're a riot Gwen! a riot!

The last thin I successfully sewed was a pillow case, that was bout 16 years ago.
My sewing talent kind of peeked at pillow cases.

Black Swan Designs · Post by **Black Swan Designs** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 1:24 pm

'sOK, people who can't sew keep me in business.

Gwen

Catarina · Post by **Catarina** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 1:51 pm

Black Swan Designs wrote:it's a pleated coat over a mahoitred doublet. Yes, I made his outfit. Here are other pleated coats/outfits I've made-

Here's a tutorial if you want to take a stab at making your own (photo is a link)

I heart you more than I heart hearty things.

Definitely bookmarked for future use, thank you!

Lloyd · Post by **Lloyd** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 6:20 pm

Black Swan Designs wrote:@
@Lloyd- I know that helmet, it now belongs to Steve Mallet. Knowing the helmet on a first name basis, I still pose the question - 'Do you *really* want to joust in a sallet???"

Gwen

Oh hell no, Gwen! If you look at the helm that Leo is wearing, it is one that I had made for me for my last joust (yes, I would have preferred a tilt visor, but there were severe time constraints). But, since folks were asking, I knew that Cory did one which was basically a close helm formed to look like a sallet (didn't know that Steve was the owner, though).

After 12 concussions, I may be slow some days, but I am not suicidal!

d-farrell2 · Post by **d-farrell2** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 6:33 pm

Charlotte J wrote:
MJBlazek wrote:
Pish.. the One True Century... bah... we are the Yakuza to your Mafia...
The Fifteenth Century... Not your grandfather's mafia...

Although, my next two big projects will be fourteenth century, and THEN early 15th. I LOVE the early fifteenth - so often grouped in with it's earlier cousin, and overshadowed by the latter part of the century...

Indeed, this is why us brave few must show the unique character of the early 15th!

zachos · Post by **zachos** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 6:36 pm

@Gwen: I know you were there. I actually originally found that picture after following a link in and old thread where you were explaining it. Just thought it would be a good photo to add weight to your words.

Back to photos!

From when we decided to get some "acting" shots:

and one in camp with some other "Thugs". (I can't bring myself to abuse the word with a z).