Basket hilts hitting the wielder's hand?

[Tibbie Croser]

The problem of basket hilts hitting the user's own hand was mentioned in another thread. I'm not familiar with rattan weapons. Why would this happen? Is it because the rattan is much more flexible than the steel? Do fighters have ways to stiffen the hilts so that the hilts don't move so much within the basket?

[Diglach Mac Cein]

More likely, the wrist flexes/bends for a shot, and the edge of the basket hilt hits the wrist. A lot of fighters use very snug basket hilts.


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[Aaron]

I think the problem is that the wrist can bend easily and the hand will twist on the grip, bringing the basket into the wrist/forearm.

-Aaron

[Amanda M]

With mine it's not because there's something wrong with the weapon or it's improperly made. A standard basket is like a half a sphere and the side on the 'outside' by the wrist bangs into the back of my hand with certain shots unless I offset it a little bit. The Armored Rose mentions it as a common problem with women due to physiological differences but I don't know how true that is in terms of gender specifics. One way to fix that is offsetting the basket, but you could also design a slimmer basket or wear a rigid demi gauntlet. A basket hilt has to be firmly attached to the rattan and it depends on the design of the basket as to how it's attached.

It happens to me with a variety of different basket hilts, even the bigger ones.

[Aaron]

When I do use basket hilts, I use full gauntlets and don't seem to have a problem with the basket hilt.

I wear full guantlets with basket hilts because the hand, while not a target, can easily get hit by accident. And as the sword twists in my hand, my hand never becomes exposed.

-Aaron

[Amanda M]

I cut an oval shaped grip in my swords so that it doesn't twist. Plus I find it to be less fatiguing on my hand.

[TakedaSanjuichiro]

...The Armored Rose mentions it as a common problem with women due to physiological differences but I don't know how true that is in terms of gender specifics...

I'm a guy and have had this problem as well, but then again I have small hands.

I think it is a matter of basket hilts being of honking big design in order to provide protection. There have only been a couple of minimalist examples that have done me well. I feel it comes down that most basket hilt patterns are for the normative sizes of SCA warriors, and many women (or guys with smaller hands) fall outside this "norm" and thus suffer.

As a side note cutting off the outer bars, or bending them in to follow more historical basket shapes typically solves it. Only takes a torch and a hammer.

-Takeda

[InsaneIrish]

When I do use basket hilts, I use full gauntlets and don't seem to have a problem with the basket hilt.

I wear full guantlets with basket hilts because the hand, while not a target, can easily get hit by accident. And as the sword twists in my hand, my hand never becomes exposed.

-Aaron

If you use a properly made demi gauntlet with a properly made Basket hilt your hand should never become exposed either.

[Aaron]

A properly made suit of armour for me would have thrusters, repulsors and a uni-beam...all with thrusting tips. "Properly made" is an odd term.

With fun,

-Aaron

[Tibbie Croser]

So it's the type of shot thrown, then, and not the weapon material? Would a WMA swordsman using a steel sword with a historical basket hilt have the same problems?

[Kilkenny]

The problem of basket hilts hitting the user's own hand was mentioned in another thread. I'm not familiar with rattan weapons. Why would this happen? Is it because the rattan is much more flexible than the steel? Do fighters have ways to stiffen the hilts so that the hilts don't move so much within the basket?

Most of the time it is not a matter of the basket moving, but of the wrist/forearm shifting position. Consider holding the hilt in a "handshake" fashion, with the arm, wrist, hand, hilt and sword essentially in a straight line.

Now cock your wrist sharply to the outside and note the way the wrist is now much closer to the edge of the basket.

Sometimes the fit is such that simply cocking the wrist will result in the basket hitting the back of the hand, the wrist, the forearm. This is a bad fit

The mechanics of throwing some shots will roll your hand and wrist through ranges that can challenge the fit of a baskethilt. Taking impact out on the blade can lever the grip around and cause impact of the hilt on the wrist.

Sometimes the basket won't be mounted as firmly as it should be, and then it can get spun by an impact and driven into the wrist. This is not all that common, because it's a pretty obvious problem that can be fixed pretty easily in most cases.

Another problem area can be the top edge over the thumb, which can impact the hand/thumb when the sword rocks back in the person's grip. Again, the problem can appear in the course of throwing certain shots, or as a result of impact on the blade.

In all cases, the basic solution is to make sure the basket size and shape fits you properly.

[Peikko]

So it's the type of shot thrown, then, and not the weapon material? Would a WMA swordsman using a steel sword with a historical basket hilt have the same problems?

As a HEMAist I can say I've never had this happen...or it was never so bad that I ever noticed. Probably poor blade alignment.

[Joseph]

I fight with a plastic basket hilt and a leather demi. I've never had any of these problems, nor did I at any point during singles or melee think that a gauntlet would better protect my hand.
I shave my handles so they feel nice and are tapered to my hand. I don't use grip tape and I also don't squeeze the hand on the sword until I am close to landing the shot.
I think its probably a matter of your hand size and the angle of the shots you throw.

[kenrickb]

With various basket hilts I've used in the past what would happen when I threw a hard wrap was that my hand would slide down the rattan, hitting my hand against the bars at the bottom of the basket. Some times I would bruise the a good part of the back of my hand from the force of the impact. So, I stopped used baskets and use cup hilts now. The slide thing still happens but the force is spread out over more area. If I ever get a stealth type finger gauntlet, I'll probably try going with cross hilted swords.

Kenric, East

[FrauHirsch]

I have custom very small basket hilts made for my very small hands.

I also pad the inside with quilted fabric like a cuff.

[Vitus von Atzinger]

You must find the right half-g combined with the right basket. This can take years.

[Ogedei]

For what it is worth, I pad the inside of my basket hilts. I am a larger human, so my hand doesn't fit perfectly well into most hilts I guess. Again a sizing thing, however I do not care to put a monster hilt on my sword.

I am using an aluminum hilt now, I have used various plastics as well. With the current one, if I do not have padding and I take a direct shot into the cup it transfers enough force into my hand to not be a fun time. With the padding I have no issues. I had similar issues with the previous plastic hilt and I assume a Baldar type cup hilt would have the same issues for me.

Ogedei

[herrhauptmann]

The first basket hilt I put on my sword I noticed that if I sword blocked, or got hit in the basket, I'd actually end up punching the inside of the basket. Left some interesting bruise lines on my knuckles, I can tell you that.
After a few months of it, I got around to asking the shire Marshall if I could swap my baskethilt with the one off a sword in the loaner pile. (The sword I always used when I had to resort to loaner gear).

After the swap, I can honestly say I haven't had a problem with punching the inside of the basket.

I think the issue was that opening on my first basket was just too wide for my skinny hand and demi to properly ground out.