Hey anyone do Live Steele?

The Nuetered Knight · Post by **The Nuetered Knight** » Tue Jun 05, 2001 7:31 am

Hey everyone. I was running through the mashall handbook, and found out there was live steel? Why was i never informed of such a great thing? Heh, well, is there any reference sites that could help me learn bout live steele combat? I know im in the Teen Boffer division, but hell, never to young to learn somethin new, and it might come in handy. As always, thanks

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John Casius Hawke
AKA The Nuetered Knight
Underwear Inspector #28
John's Page

Willing Pell · Post by **Willing Pell** » Tue Jun 05, 2001 12:41 pm

The group I belong to is a live steel group. We don't do any role playing, just serious swordsmanship. We operate under AEMMA rules which means we play very hard. Depending on where you live there might be a group near you. We're in Rochester NY, theres a group in Texas known as HACA and another group in Chicago. If you want to know more check out the AEMMA site or the HACA site.

Roscoe · Post by **Roscoe** » Tue Jun 05, 2001 1:13 pm

I do some suicidal live steel with a few friends, really fun, have a few cool scars too! Like Willing Pell said, there's the Historical Armoured Combat Association (HACA), and the Medieval Armoured Combat Association (MACA), these two are mostly just swordsmanship like Willing Pell said, but if you just search for "Live Steel" on a browser you'll probably get a few Live Steel LARPing websites!

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Roscoe Hallsteinn,
Avacal, An Tir

[This message has been edited by Roscoe (edited 06-05-2001).]

Norman · Post by **Norman** » Tue Jun 05, 2001 2:12 pm

The Red Kaganate encompasses any legit mode of reenactor combat we'll find.

If you're around Brooklyn area, I'm building a local practice.

For some reason, the SCA is alergic to real swords.

BTW: "Live Steel" - is that like the opposite of "Dead Steel"?

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Norman J. Finkelshteyn
Armour of the Silk Road - http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Olympus/3505
The Silk Road Designs Armoury - http://www.enteract.com/~silkroad
Jewish Warriors - http://www.geocities.com/jewishwarriors
The Red Kaganate - http://www.geocities.com/kaganate
silkroad@spam.operamail.com (remove "spam" from e-mail to make it work)

The Nuetered Knight · Post by **The Nuetered Knight** » Tue Jun 05, 2001 2:42 pm

Norman-
lol

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John Casius Hawke
AKA The Nuetered Knight
Underwear Inspector #28
John's Page

jgalak · Post by **jgalak** » Tue Jun 05, 2001 3:00 pm

In the MSR we do some live steel but only for show. It's non-competitive, and either choreographed or 3/4 speed with all shots being aimed in such a way as to be easily parried. We even do this from horseback...

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Yehuda ben Moshe
mka Juliean Galak

James the Baker · Post by **James the Baker** » Wed Jun 06, 2001 12:19 am

My goup does live steel as well.We go full speed and a few of our folks are involved with the Chicago group mentioned earlier and we strenuously promote skill.Well,skill and bbq-our practices usually involve a bbq and alot of palling around.I personally am in Chicago and we have folks in MI and OH.If interested,give me a holler-James WWWhitlock,Calcopenca@AOL.com

woodwose · Post by **woodwose** » Wed Jun 06, 2001 1:21 am

I do live steel..
this here's second or third hand information so it might not be worth anything... but from what I heard, the mention of live steel in the marshals handbook is for choreographed live steel combat and only for use at things like demos.. again, I could be wrong about that.

The live steel group I'm with (I don't think it has an official name but I've heard the name Thommas Hill Blade Society mentioned when we needed a name) was started by the SCA's former East Kingdom expiremental weapons marshal but I guess once they didn't want him to be marshal for that anymore, we broke off and started our own group.

we do pretty much full speed fighting but pull the blows a little. A lot of emphasis on safety because most of us don't wear much more armour than is required by SCA rapier combat.. although I use to wear a full suit of maille. Now I'm working on plate. Even with the heavy emphasis on safety, some of us do play really rough... lots of kicking and buckler punching. onetime I got sort of picked up and thrown, then stomped on. but it was a pulled stomp. we're a little like a medieval WWF.
we mostly do demos for schools or libraries and did a demo for a little renn faire in maine once...
I've blabbered enough and am going away now.

woodwose · Post by **woodwose** » Wed Jun 06, 2001 1:31 am

oh, just thought I should mention.. the group I'm with uses dulled or rebated weapons.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed Jun 06, 2001 6:42 am

Markland's been at it since 1969. We refer to our live steel demonstrations as "Fake fighting with real weapons." as opposed to our fratricidal combat which is "Real fighting with fake weapons." Both inform each other. Markland steel rules may be found at: http://www.markland.org/rulesrec.html .

Now in England, with state sponsored medical care, they don't bother with fake weapons. I understand that they really enjoy their scars and brag about their injuries. Well there's always a faster gun and a tougher hombre. Our system works for us, and it may work for you.

Hastings XXXII is coming up the weekend of October 13-14. If you're interested in Viking, Anglo-Saxon or Norman reenactment, mark it down on your calendar. It will be held at Marietta Mansion in Price George's County, Maryland, outside of Washington, DC.
There should be ore information on the Markland website as the date draws nigh.

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Full time civil servant, part time blacksmith, and seasonal Viking ship captain.

Visit your National Parks: www.nps.gov

Go viking: www.wam.umd.edu/~eowyn/Longship/

Hit hot iron: www.anvilfire.com

Gaston · Post by **Gaston** » Sat Jun 09, 2001 7:11 pm

Dweezle,

Are you using Starfires, or something else?

Destichado · Post by **Destichado** » Mon Jun 11, 2001 5:02 pm

Me 'n my buddies used to do that -we had starfires, made our shields and bucklers (way too heavy) and had fun.
But, then my buddies grew up, so I had to find the SCA. (infinately more gratafying, I might add -I don't have to pull my blows, I can fight full speed, and I have armour now!)

Vitus von Atzinger · Post by **Vitus von Atzinger** » Mon Jun 11, 2001 5:29 pm

Thatta boy, Destichado! Lay on!
-V

woodwose · Post by **woodwose** » Wed Jun 13, 2001 8:39 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Gaston:
Dweezle,

Are you using Starfires, or something else?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

we mostly use blades made by Popinjay's (cause he's the guy that runs the practice). we also use a few of Gypsie Madblade's blades, and still have a few of france lames' longsword and great sword blades from before their stuff started to really suck... but most of our stuff is from Popinjay's. If I can find time between armor projects I want to try forging some of my own blades sometime this summer

Gaston · Post by **Gaston** » Thu Jun 14, 2001 3:58 pm

Thanks, Dweezle.

The Starfires seem too heavy for what we do, that's why I'm looking for something else.

Lighter, thinner blades should be fine for us, we're not a theatre group and there should be very little hard blade-to-blade contact, mostly sliding and redirection done at an angle. And of course, as Mr. Miyagi said, "best defense - not be there".

I found Popinjay's site at www.popinj.com for those interested.

Haven't found a Gypsy Madblade site yet, Medieval Menagerie carries a few but nothing really useful to me.

Again, thank you.

[This message has been edited by Gaston (edited 06-14-2001).]

jgalak · Post by **jgalak** » Fri Jun 15, 2001 11:29 am

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Gaston:
The Starfires seem too heavy for what we do, that's why I'm looking for something else.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not sure what you are doing with them, but we've used DelTin practice rapiers (also known as diamond-crossection schlaegers) for partly-choreographed live steel. The blade is 40" long, and has similair stiffness/weight to a schlaeger. DelTin also makes a bated rapier that is 42" long, and is similair in weight/stiffness to a real rapier. I've never used these, so can't comment.

Both are available (with extremely well made hilts), from Darkwood Armory:

http://www.darkwoodarmory.com/main.htm

There is no way to buy the blades without a hilt. This is a DelTin policy designed to prevent their blades being mounted on inadequate hilts. There are only 3-4 armories in the US that DelTin has approved for their blades (and sells only to them), and Darkwood is the only one I'm familiar with.

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Yehuda ben Moshe
mka Juliean Galak

Gaston · Post by **Gaston** » Fri Jun 15, 2001 9:07 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by jgalak:
Not sure what you are doing with them, <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Sorry, I should have said - "live steel" armoured fighting, moderate to brisk contact. At least that's the plan right now, we'll see how it works out.

FrauHirsch · Post by **FrauHirsch** » Fri Jun 22, 2001 1:27 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Gaston:
Thanks, Dweezle.

The Starfires seem too heavy for what we do, that's why I'm looking for something else.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I just use my Atar broadsword, unsharpened (which is how you get it), with the sharpness ground off the very end of the point (though there is still very much a point to it) and the square edges of the blade edge buffed to round. Its lightweight, but still very much a real sword. I have one ding in it so far made by a Starfire. The rest of my blocks have all made the area just below the guard or the flat. What I like is that it is a real sword, not a hunk of bar stock with a handle.

Juliana

Norman · Post by **Norman** » Fri Jun 22, 2001 2:18 pm

Who's Atar?
Is there a Web Address?

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Norman J. Finkelshteyn
Armour of the Silk Road - http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Olympus/3505
The Silk Road Designs Armoury - http://www.enteract.com/~silkroad
Jewish Warriors - http://www.geocities.com/jewishwarriors
The Red Kaganate - http://www.geocities.com/kaganate
silkroad@spam.operamail.com (remove "spam" from e-mail to make it work)

Severian · Post by **Severian** » Fri Jun 22, 2001 2:23 pm

atar is Jim Hrisoulas of "complete bladesmith" fame.

www.atar.com

-severian

Alcyoneus · Post by **Alcyoneus** » Fri Jun 22, 2001 3:15 pm

I kinda doubt that anyone is actually doing "live steel" since I assume that would involve sharp pointy things that could really cause injury.

jgalak · Post by **jgalak** » Fri Jun 22, 2001 3:31 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Gaston:
Sorry, I should have said - "live steel" armoured fighting, moderate to brisk contact. At least that's the plan right now, we'll see how it works out.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

The rapiers should work fine for that, assuming the period is right for you. They are very well made and sturdy, so if you want to do 16-17 C. armored live steel, they would be perfect. Of course if you are doing 14-15 C. stuff, this isn't any help.

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Yehuda ben Moshe
mka Juliean Galak