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Posted: Tue Sep 26, 2006 9:23 pm
by Robert P. Norwalt
[quote="Ratslayer
If they can't, then they are in the wrong sport. I'm sorry, if you can't do it, you can't do it. There are a lot of things I can't do. It sucks, but that's life.
*** I'm sorry too. Just as a point of disagrement. When I joined the SCA I had the distinct impression it was a "sport", -in a way, but a sport for everyone. Not one person excluded. Maybe a blind guy might have a hard time, but 99% all inclusive. Why? It was the only fun, sport, for the sake of fun, I ever heard of. Now you'all want to put it in the same catagory as Ultimate fighting? Even Soccer? It just doesn't wash.
Anyone who whats to fight may, and no "body" politic was to say who could or who may not participate so long as they agreed to the rules of the list, and got autherized. No height rules. No weight rules. And NO calibration rules. Not hard and set in stone. If one wished to fight, they also chose thier own calibration. This was made plain to me on day one. And I was told if I didn't like it I could, "take the last trian to Clarksville".
We are not paid huge NFL, NHL, etc, million dollar contracts. No other sport ON EARTH considers SCA as it has stood for 40 years, a "real" sport. We know it is hard. We know it takes skill. We know it can get you bruised, beaten, battered, and busted, just like any "real" sport. But it ain't. It IS a relitive sport like activity, participated in by folks like me, who wish to recreate to some degree the fighting "as it might have been", or "sould" have been in the time before 1600. Not the only relitively based sport in the world mind you. I'm not dogging us. I love SCA fighting, and I even understand the need for the way we approach it. Nevertheless, we fall under the same guildlines as bodybuilding, snyc swimming, ice skating, ball room dancing, and some martial arts. It is a sport, but not a "cut and dry sport" like, ... Baseball.
Rayslayer wrote: "As far as in the meantime comment? Tell them it isn't a good shot and move on. If it discourages them so they don't come back? Well I guess they don't have the warrior spirit.
*** For me that's way too dissmissive an attitude. Its the attitude I displayed most of my life up to about age 42. Then I realized, you don't have to be the biggest, baddest Mo-fo in town to have the "warrior spirit"
Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 2:43 am
by dukelogan
huh? sure people are excluded. part of a proper authorization includes determining whether the person knows the rules of the list, can defend themselves, throw telling blows, comport themselves properly on the field, and at least in atlantia dress appropriately. cant do any of those and you dont get to join the rest of us. pretty simple really. the whole idea that everyone has a "right to fight" has caused more problems than just about anything else to sca sport combat. these problems are varied and abundant and not until we keep the bar steady (i think it needs to be raised substantially myself) will we begin to take control of, and start to eliminate, them.
regards
logan
Robert P. Norwalt wrote:[quote="Ratslayer
If they can't, then they are in the wrong sport. I'm sorry, if you can't do it, you can't do it. There are a lot of things I can't do. It sucks, but that's life.
*** I'm sorry too. Just as a point of disagrement. When I joined the SCA I had the distinct impression it was a "sport", -in a way, but a sport for everyone. Not one person excluded. Maybe a blind guy might have a hard time, but 99% all inclusive. Why? It was the only fun, sport, for the sake of fun, I ever heard of. Now you'all want to put it in the same catagory as Ultimate fighting? Even Soccer? It just doesn't wash.
Anyone who whats to fight may, and no "body" politic was to say who could or who may not participate so long as they agreed to the rules of the list, and got autherized. No height rules. No weight rules. And NO calibration rules. Not hard and set in stone. If one wished to fight, they also chose thier own calibration. This was made plain to me on day one. And I was told if I didn't like it I could, "take the last trian to Clarksville".
We are not paid huge NFL, NHL, etc, million dollar contracts. No other sport ON EARTH considers SCA as it has stood for 40 years, a "real" sport. We know it is hard. We know it takes skill. We know it can get you bruised, beaten, battered, and busted, just like any "real" sport. But it ain't. It IS a relitive sport like activity, participated in by folks like me, who wish to recreate to some degree the fighting "as it might have been", or "sould" have been in the time before 1600. Not the only relitively based sport in the world mind you. I'm not dogging us. I love SCA fighting, and I even understand the need for the way we approach it. Nevertheless, we fall under the same guildlines as bodybuilding, snyc swimming, ice skating, ball room dancing, and some martial arts. It is a sport, but not a "cut and dry sport" like, ... Baseball.
Rayslayer wrote: "As far as in the meantime comment? Tell them it isn't a good shot and move on. If it discourages them so they don't come back? Well I guess they don't have the warrior spirit.
*** For me that's way too dissmissive an attitude. Its the attitude I displayed most of my life up to about age 42. Then I realized, you don't have to be the biggest, baddest Mo-fo in town to have the "warrior spirit"
Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 10:45 am
by Ratslayer
Robert P. Norwalt wrote:*** For me that's way too dissmissive an attitude. Its the attitude I displayed most of my life up to about age 42. Then I realized, you don't have to be the biggest, baddest Mo-fo in town to have the "warrior spirit"
Having the warrior spirit and being the biggest, baddest mo-fo in town aren't the same thing. When I started fighting I weighed 130 lbs and I'm 5'5" and female. Believe me, I am far from being the biggest, baddest mo-fo in town. The warrior spirit is being able to improve on your skills while taking losses at the same time. I haven't won any big time tourneys nor have I achieved Knighthood but I've been fighting for over 15 years. It's not about victory, it's about the journey. It's about never giving up and always giving it your best. It's about loving what you are doing and not being afraid to lose. That's the warrior spirit.
Kelwin
Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 12:07 pm
by RoaK
Just out of curiosity Duke Logan what is the minimum to meet that requirement?
dukelogan wrote:and at least in atlantia dress appropriately.
Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 4:21 pm
by dukelogan
the law that i wrote (with much help) during my last two reigns can be found at:
http://marshal.atlantia.sca.org/oms/Rul ... odern.html
this was not a new law but rather something i felt needed to be done since the sca charter already demands as much. but people are allowed to get away with being lazy and they ignore the expectations of the organization. new people see their willingness to ignore those expectations and they adopt a lazy stance as well.
so, i put into place a kingdom law that says you will dress the way the charter states or you wont be able to take the field. fighting is not a right. neither is marshalling or waterbearing or anything else. you can still get away with your tennis shoes and blue jeans and crap like that at an event but we wont have to see it on the field. hopefully someone will take the next step and address the coolers, coleman chairs, tennis shoes, etc off the field. anyway, if you have any questions about the rules here in atlantia please dont hesitate to ask. while im not in a position to add any improvements to it i can certainly forward them on to those that can.
regards
logan
RoaK wrote:Just out of curiosity Duke Logan what is the minimum to meet that requirement?
dukelogan wrote:and at least in atlantia dress appropriately.
Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 5:23 pm
by Robert P. Norwalt
Ratslayer wrote:[quote="Robert P. Norwalt ,... It's about never giving up and always giving it your best. It's about loving what you are doing and not being afraid to lose. That's the warrior spirit.
Well. That for me that is part of it. You're preachin' to the chior, but it's good to see what you beleive.
Ya'll have a good one, and I'm done with this thread.
Kelwin
Posted: Thu Sep 28, 2006 11:23 am
by RoaK
Seems fair enough... And it leaves room for guys like me who are wearing the Newcastle lamellar. Mine is burgundy in color to look like lacquered leather plates. I also agree with your statement below about people getting away with being lazy. The simplest surcoat or tabard can do wonders for a fighter.
We should be as concerned with these "lazy people" as rhino hides... as a matter for fact it might even seem that rhino hides are easier to deal with than folks who just can't get rid of the sports armor look.
dukelogan wrote:the law that i wrote (with much help) during my last two reigns can be found at:
http://marshal.atlantia.sca.org/oms/Rul ... odern.htmlthis was not a new law but rather something i felt needed to be done since the sca charter already demands as much. but people are allowed to get away with being lazy and they ignore the expectations of the organization. new people see their willingness to ignore those expectations and they adopt a lazy stance as well.
Posted: Sat Sep 30, 2006 11:20 pm
by Hew
rob(in) wrote:i can respect that arguement. it's still up to the individual how hard they want to be hit.
You can't really mean that.
"Hey, pitcher! See this area the size of a playing card? That's my strike zone -- okay with you?"
See also Rules for
Calvinball -
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calvinball#Calvinball
Posted: Sun Oct 01, 2006 1:25 am
by Aaron
We really do play Calvinball.
But that isn't a negative. It's a positive.
It allows Atlantia and Merdiaes to have their own distinct flavor as well as allow those of us who travel through many kingdoms to experience something different each time.
What would the reaction be in Atlantia if suddently the Society Earl Marshall stated that all kingdoms would adopt Merdiases calibration immediately?
And what if the reverse happened and Merdiases had to go to the Atlantia standard overnight.
And there are regional differences within kingdoms as well. Not just for calibration, but appearance on the field as well. I would be horrified if we got rid of the Tuchux on the SCA field and it was only armour like Josh and I wear. We're all on this field together, and my eyesight stinks and I'll accept a shot as long as you tell me about it at the very least.
We all enjoy our game of Calivinball as long as we don't point fingers at each other.
Posted: Sun Oct 01, 2006 7:15 pm
by rob(in)
exactly what i meant. Aaron nailed it. and i believe the way the new rules are stated, it's entirely up to the receiver of the blow to determine it's effectiveness....
Hew wrote:rob(in) wrote:i can respect that arguement. it's still up to the individual how hard they want to be hit.
You can't really mean that.
"Hey, pitcher! See this area the size of a playing card? That's my strike zone -- okay with you?"
See also Rules for
Calvinball -
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calvinball#Calvinball
Posted: Sun Oct 01, 2006 9:25 pm
by dukelogan
it was always up to the receiver to call the blow. the rules have always stated that. some retards decided it made sense to jabber in the middle of a fight and say crap like "well, what about that blow??". i watched some video of a fight like that not too long ago. wow, talk about vomit inducing!!!!!
now, at least, in the retarded backwater areas that still do that silly crap, someone has an out to protect the sca sport combat system from those watching others compete.
but this is not new, just better defined.
regards
logan
rob(in) wrote:exactly what i meant. Aaron nailed it. and i believe the way the new rules are stated, it's entirely up to the receiver of the blow to determine it's effectiveness....
Hew wrote:rob(in) wrote:i can respect that arguement. it's still up to the individual how hard they want to be hit.
You can't really mean that.
"Hey, pitcher! See this area the size of a playing card? That's my strike zone -- okay with you?"
See also Rules for
Calvinball -
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calvinball#Calvinball
Posted: Sun Oct 01, 2006 9:40 pm
by rob(in)
agreed...hate the 'talkey-talk' in a fight. i once had someone decline a head shot, but went on to elaborate by announcing "the top of my helm has been sheared off, that area now has a touch calibration"....
gotta be the all time cheese award.
Posted: Sun Oct 01, 2006 10:17 pm
by Wulf
Tasha McG wrote:dukelogan wrote:its just as bad as the guy who takes a ligth shot from a girl.
I am a girl who would not take light shots from other girls when I was fighting and one took very great offense. After a particular fight I went up to her and said that I was sorry the fight had lasted so long because she was clearly the better fighter, but that her shots had all been too light, right up 'til the last one (which in my mind was actually still kinda light, but I was too damn tired to keep my arms up anymore and I kept that thought to myself). She looked at me coldly and said that perhaps I should get my armour checked because parts of it were clearly causing numbness. I walked away rather than further challenge her, but I was angry for a long time about it. Maybe I still am.
Maybe too many men like you describe, Logan, were taking her tappy but well-aimed shots because she was better than the average woman in her area and they wanted to encourage her in some misguided way, I don't know. All I know is that I got very used to fighting at a particular calibration in the Southern Region of the East Kingdom, and wasn't going to take anything that wasn't landed with authority. People like Duke Ron and Duke Darius and Sir Stephan were the types of fighters I measured blow calibration by.
I came away from that confrontation actually feeling GUILTY for not taking her tappy shots. Guilty. That's eff'ed up, IMO.
-Tasha
I feel for you Tasha. My fiancee fought in the novice tourney at pennsic. It was her 1st tourney. She complained that the male fighters gave her some decent shots. The shots from the other women fighets she felt bad because she just couldnt take them. Hell some of the other male fighters were hitting way to light. What is going to happen when these people go up against someone in a melee that doesnt know they are new?
I think that whoever is teaching them is doing them a great disservice.