SCA pump action combat crossbow design

[freiman the minstrel]

Dreadlord,

This is the simplified Job Worksheet.

I am still fuzzy on the tubular bolt holding thingy. It looks like it is a thin piece of sheet brass or copper, riveted to a long piece of metal tube, that has been bent with a tubing bender, or maybe just around a dowel, maybe.

The goatsfoot arm is a similar thing.

Is the goatsfoot arm made from tubing, or solid metal? It seems like it would have to stand up to considerable force.

Also, I hope this doesn't seem blasphemous, but if you took a piece of piece of bungee cord, and stapled it to the bottom of the tiller (in the middle of the cord) and fastened the ends to each side of the goatsfoot lever, it would automatically return the lever to the firing position, upping the rate of fire. This would not complicate the construction process very much, but it might give the weapon greater utility. It would, however, put an ugly bungee cord on side of the weapon.

Can you think of any way that the construction process could be simplified further?

*********************************
Second Job worksheet, The Equalizer Crossbow, Dreadlord Nissan’s munitions grade, single shot, cho ko nu.

Sunday, August 24, 2008

Materials list.
2 Pieces wood 1X4. Twenty four inch long
One Crossbow prod, available from Alchem
One Tubular bolt holder thingy, available from McMaster Carr
One goatsfoot cocking lever, available from McMaster Carr
One Tickler, available from McMaster Carr
four screws, 1/8 “ X ¾â€

[Grimr Hvitulfsson Ulfhamr]

That one you are thinking of is a Chinese design. Very light draw weights in the originals, and I can't really imagine the box working well with SCA combat bolts...

A friend of mine made two of those Chinese repeaters. One that fired regular bolts and the other that fired bolts with SCA blunts. Both had a clip of five. He could fire five bolts in five seconds.

GrimR

[Nissan Maxima]

The goatsfoot andbolt holder are tubes. You know, you couls skip the bolt holder and acconplish the same thing with a hold down sping made fom a piece of bent thin sheet metal.

I will draw one today.

[Kilkenny]

That one you are thinking of is a Chinese design. Very light draw weights in the originals, and I can't really imagine the box working well with SCA combat bolts...

A friend of mine made two of those Chinese repeaters. One that fired regular bolts and the other that fired bolts with SCA blunts. Both had a clip of five. He could fire five bolts in five seconds.

GrimR

What style SCA combat Bolts ? I would think that a magazine for 5 of the siloflex/golf tube style would be unwieldy. I would also expect that due to the heads on any SCA combat style bolt, the shafts would align poorly.

I'm curious as to how these issues were dealt with - including the simple answer of "they weren't issues in practice"

[Mac Thamhais]

With a Fellwalker style bolt, at least, the head and the APD are the same size, so while the shaft itself is smaller the clip shouldn't have a problem handling them.

[Grimr Hvitulfsson Ulfhamr]

He used Baldar blunts on the bolts. Those seemed to work pretty well. With maximum rate of fire, accuracy wasn't that great though, and the maximum range wasn't superb either. But both sure were fast.

He just made those out of curiosity, never actually used the
SCA legal one on the battlefield. He did have grand plans of making a repeating ballista but that never got beyond the drawing board.

GrimR

[Koredono]

I've always wondered how that mechanism worked. Are yours the bows with the box magazines on top as well?

That one you are thinking of is a Chinese design. Very light draw weights in the originals, and I can't really imagine the box working well with SCA combat bolts...

IIRC, Tanaka built one some years ago, with an 8 bolt magazine, and it was shortly thereafter disallowed for being 'too effective', even though it was, for all intents and purposes, completely authentic, and within the existing rules structure. I don't recall whether he was using fiberglass shafts or golf tubes, not that that would make much of a difference except that the gulf tubes might load more smoothly because of the more consistent diameter of the ammo overall.

[Kilkenny]

I've always wondered how that mechanism worked. Are yours the bows with the box magazines on top as well?

That one you are thinking of is a Chinese design. Very light draw weights in the originals, and I can't really imagine the box working well with SCA combat bolts...

IIRC, Tanaka built one some years ago, with an 8 bolt magazine, and it was shortly thereafter disallowed for being 'too effective', even though it was, for all intents and purposes, completely authentic, and within the existing rules structure. I don't recall whether he was using fiberglass shafts or golf tubes, not that that would make much of a difference except that the gulf tubes might load more smoothly because of the more consistent diameter of the ammo overall.

"Too effective" - barf! Reminds me of the time I was chastised for sending a visitor from Lochac out with a combat crossbow and golftube arrows. The arrows - which had been approved for several years and were incapable of doing any bodily harm, no matter what you did with them - were determined to "not be of an approved design".

The arrows had been approved by the EK Kingdom archery marshall several years prior to this incident. They were a stupid simple and utterly harmless design. Unlike various approved designs that have been going through people's face plates.

dumb with a capital UM.

[freiman the minstrel]

I have enlisted the aid of my friend, who is a carpenter, to help make the templates. I will have more after I have talked with her about it.

f

[Oswyn_de_Wulferton]

So you going to post the step by step pictures along with the directions Frieman? For some reason, I have having trouble visualizing the building.

[Baron Alejandro]

I have enlisted the aid of my friend, who is a carpenter, to help make the templates. I will have more after I have talked with her about it.

f

Oh god. You are arming Omega company with repeaters, aren't you. I am now either going to have to kill you all outright, or take up a shield.

Possibly both.

[freiman the minstrel]

So you going to post the step by step pictures along with the directions Frieman? For some reason, I have having trouble visualizing the building.

If I can, yes, that was the plan. I was thinking of something like the "How to make an anglo-saxon lyre" tutorial I did a few years ago.

f

[freiman the minstrel]

I have enlisted the aid of my friend, who is a carpenter, to help make the templates. I will have more after I have talked with her about it.

f

Oh god. You are arming Omega company with repeaters, aren't you. I am now either going to have to kill you all outright, or take up a shield.

Possibly both.

Well, yeah, sort of.

I WAS planning on equipping all of Omega Company's fighters with a repeater, but that means I have to make one repeater.

f

[freiman the minstrel]

Things are still moving on this.

I made a deal with a guy named Seamoose of Scum Clan for a prod. This will be the one that I learn on. He seemed amused by the idea. It's aluminum, so it has a definite shelf life. Later versions (if there are any) will use either steel or fibreglass.

Alchem still has prods for sixty bucks, and hightower crossbows has instructions for making prods. I will be checking with my local metalbau for the possibility of having them fabbed up locally.

Sorry this is taking so long. I really appreciate all the work you are doing.

f

[Eirikr the Eager]

What style SCA combat Bolts ? I would think that a magazine for 5 of the siloflex/golf tube style would be unwieldy. I would also expect that due to the heads on any SCA combat style bolt, the shafts would align poorly.

Not so for Lochac - just a 3/4 inch bird blunt on an arrow shaft. Hmmm...these could work out quite well.....

[Magnus of Red Hammer]

Can someone confirm my this for me:

I seem to recall that somewhere I came across plans for a more or less true "pump" action crossbow. You would literally pump (think modern shotgun style pump) a mechanism that pulls the bowstring backwards and is locked in place by a mechanism of some sort (a ratchet comes to my mind). The trigger would then release the mechanism allowing it to fire. I want to say that it was originally found in a manuscript on weapons from Germany during the late middle ages or possibly the Renaissance. Has anyone heard about this?

[Nissan Maxima]

bumped up at the request of keegan and cuan

[flyinggobbo]

Maghnus there is something similar to what you are describing in an old popular science magazine. It's here http://www.vintageprojects.com/archery/ ... plans.html in an PDF file.
Its an interesting design and a repeater, but the magazine is impractical to make for SCA blunts. but the mechanism is still viable.

[Cuan]

Thanks, Nissan. I appreciate the posting and the subsequent discussions. Hope to see you at Aethelmearc war practice in April.

In that regard, I would encourage any influential Aethelmearcers (?) to try to set up war practice to test scenarios in the new woods. I think that would draw a lot of folks.

Thanks again for the crossbow design. It really is quite clever and effective.