Assistance needed getting armor finished.

[Hacky2447]

I had a churburg style breastplate made for me by a local armor guy. The problem is, after i payed him to make it, his one week timeline turned into about 2 months and its still not finished. I went to pick it up and its not completely strapped, rusted in a lot of spots and the straps that are on it are so thin and cheap that i think they will break as soon as I put it on.

Anyone have any idea what it would cost to have it strapped properly and finished to look decent? It's blackend mild steel and was built and left in a corner of a garage. It was supposed to have stainless on the front as well but that was never done either. Any help or ideas would be greatly appreciated.

I say churburg style, cause I think its what it is but not exactly period, and its not pretty at all. lol

*edit- Added photos*

[Ceawlin Alreding]

Pictures always help. This is a visual crowd.

[Hacky2447]

yeah i figured. but I wanted to post this to see if anyone had any ideas. I will post pictures when I can tonight.

[losthelm]

Where are you located?
If your local we can probibly do this in an afternoon.
On the other hand depending on the condition the armourarchive could probibly walk you though sanding, restraping, priming, and paint.

The churburg 13 is usualy linned with leather, a few reproductions are done with strips between the plates or wide straps instead.

[AwP]

At the very least, restrapping it yourself is very easy, probably the easiest armoring project that there it.

[Hacky2447]

added photos. Looking it over in the light as opposed to the dark the other night. It doesnt look too bad. But i am very dissapointed in the straps.

losthelm - I am located in Long Beach California.

[InsaneIrish]

Do you mind telling us how much you paid for it?

The reason I ask is because there is no dishing in the piece, where a segmented churburg should have dishing on most if not all the plates.

[brucer]

Do you mind telling us how much you paid for it?

The reason I ask is because there is no dishing in the piece, where a segmented churburg should have dishing on most if not all the plates.

[quote="InsaneIrish"]Do you mind telling us how much you paid for it?

Totally agree with Insane Irish - I have a very similar breastplate done by AB Hammer - each piece was dished/english rolled so it better fits the curves of the human body. Yours strikes me as very much a novice piece, everything done in flat planes verses the compound curves that a more experienced craftsman would have put in.

You can probably salvage it, I would take it apart, take it to somebody who understands armouring and that period and put it on a stump and put some compound curves into each piece. It will help if they have an english roller as well.

Good luck

[Hacky2447]

Do you mind telling us how much you paid for it?

The reason I ask is because there is no dishing in the piece, where a segmented churburg should have dishing on most if not all the plates.

I paid 100 bucks to have it made. It does have some curve to it. It just doesnt have a whole lot. If its going to cost a ton to get it fixed id rather just trash it and have something made right. Im starting to get very discouraged with this armor and fighting thing.

[Hallbjorn]

Looking at these pictures, the strapping isn't leather. It's fabric backed Naugahyde. That won't last at all. If you got a close-up of the rivets we might be able to let you know how easy they would be to get out. From the picture, they look like they're 2-piece leather "jiffy rivets", but I can't really tell. If they're jiffy rivets, you can probably pull them out as opposed to drilling them.
Cleaning off the rust is easy, especially if you have power tools, like an angle grinder. If you were in WNY, I think we could find people to help, but I don't think I could make it out to Cali. If you shipped it to "hivemind" here on the AA, I'm sure he could restrap it for you, but the shipping wouldn't be cheap.

I'd raise hell and get my money back if I were in your shoes. I could do a better job, and I'm not an armourer; I'm just a blacksmith. There's only about an hour worth of work in that.

[Marco-borromei]

You have about $20 of new steel cut roughly into shape, $4 of buckles, and the rest is waste.

With about 20 min to pull off the leather-ish straps, and hour to dish/planish the plates [assuming you get help from someone with the right tools like an air planisher], and another hour to trim the platees to fit, you'd be ready to put $20 of new leather straps.

If you start from scratch, you'll still need to get steel, cut roughly to shape, and then so all the steps above.

[The Iron Dwarf]

you will not need a lot of skill or tools to improve it and many on here will help.
AND you will have learnt a little about making things yourself which can save you money in the future.
there will probably be people in your area who can help so dont give up yet.



the steel does not look like it has been blackened, it just looks like hot rolled mild steel to me, normally known here as 43A, cold rolled which is normally used for armour would be known as CR4.

[Jan van Nyenrode]

Hacky,

Unless you had seen a breastplate from the local armourer before you bought, I would raise hell and demand a return. The breastplate is just bend steel and the leather isn't real leather. For 90 USD you've got a rough from the hammer breastplate with proper shaping and still need to do the leather work.

Cheers,

Jan

[InsaneIrish]

Honestly, this is what you wanted:
http://www.medievalrepro.com/Images/Chu ... %20001.jpg

But did not receive. I would return it and demand a refund.
I am sorry your having issues getting gear. But, you found the AA, so that is a good thing We can help steer you to reputable armourers and even help you build your own stuff.

[EnderPC]

Hey Hacky,
I'm local in OC. If your going to try and salvage it I got enough scrap leather that we could prolly restrap it in an hour or so. Can't help with the dishing though we might be able to polish it up a bit. I would try and get my money back though and look for something else.

[Hacky2447]

Hallbjorn - The rivits are ball peaned roofing nails not the jiffy rivits. Thats about as much as I know about it. lol

The Iron Dwarf - He told me it was blackend steel, so i had to go with what he said. I dont know about steel.

Jan van Nyenrode - What makes me mad is that i was going to buy one from RFH, but i decided to go with a local guy. Unfortuantely he didnt give me as nice of looking armor as he made the arm and leg armor i got from him.

InsaneIrish - The armor at that link is beautiful. I would love to have something like that someday. However, i would have just been happy with useable. HAHAHA..

EnderPC - If I can get it strapped and "useable" i will be happy. I want to replace my whole kit with stainless eventaully anyways. So useable is good enough for me now. Please let me know if your when you are avialable. As i have not a clue how to do this stuff. Working on computers and cars im good. Armor not so much. HAHAHAHA.. So please let me know the cost of the leather and the tools or what is needed, and Ill bring the elbow grease and beer.

As far as returning it or getting my money back. I am not going to persue it. I am not going to try and get my money back due to a possible PR situation that it may cause. I am just going to chalk this up to a learning experience. I feel that this is just an issue of "You get what you pay for".

He made a set of leg and arm armor that looks reallyt nice and performs really well. Unfortuantely the breastplate armor wasnt as such. I think ultimately what happend was that he rushed doing it, didnt care and had other things that were more important to him. So he made it the way it is, and I just have to deal with it. Im not upset, just disapointed, and want a working usable piece of armor. LOL.

[The Iron Dwarf]

if in doubt ask here first, there are many here who can and will help wether it is a 'should I buy this' or not post or is this guy any good type of thing.
there may be people here who are good on armour but not on cars or computers and you could trade skills.
I dont know much about armour but I make tools

[Hacky2447]

anyone know of an armorer that makes a nice looking mild or stainless proper cherberg breastplate.

[EnderPC]

Hey hacky,

I'm thinking after the holidays maybe saturady the 7th. I have about a 50gl plastic tub full of leather scraps we can use what need from that, you bring any 6pack of ale and we'll call it even. Home Depot is across the street, and tandy is about 15 mins if we need anything. We'll see if we can get it working.

To the other AA guys - some expert advice needed. Being mostly a DIY'er doing leather belts, pouches and whatnot I don't have a lot of expertise in this type of armour. I'm thinking to restrap the joints I have some 3-4oz chap weight, then 5-8oz tooling for the straps.

I like Icefalcons for chernbourgs. This is his really nice one, but he has a economy brushed finish for 295$ just no pic up yet.
http://store.fastcommerce.com/icefalcon ... 35f-p.html

[Hacky2447]

Hey hacky,

I'm thinking after the holidays maybe saturady the 7th. I have about a 50gl plastic tub full of leather scraps we can use what need from that, you bring any 6pack of ale and we'll call it even. Home Depot is across the street, and tandy is about 15 mins if we need anything. We'll see if we can get it working.

To the other AA guys - some expert advice needed. Being mostly a DIY'er doing leather belts, pouches and whatnot I don't have a lot of expertise in this type of armour. I'm thinking to restrap the joints I have some 3-4oz chap weight, then 5-8oz tooling for the straps.

I like Icefalcons for chernbourgs. This is his really nice one, but he has a economy brushed finish for 295$ just no pic up yet.
http://store.fastcommerce.com/icefalcon ... 35f-p.html

Saturday the 7th is good for me. Just let me know if you are availble.

Im hoping I can possibly put a little curve into it as well, but i will see what i can do with it. I saw Ice Flacons list. I would like to see a picture of his "economy" one. I definately dont want to get anything really pretty like his 800 buck one. lol

[VikingLeather]

Hacky,

Do some measuring on the straps and send me a list of them and I can ship them out to you.

EnderPC, if you help him, go a little heavier than the chap leather, get a latigo about a 6/7 ounce or something with a little strength and give to it, as it will be flexing quite a bit in the joints. For the straps, go with at least a 7/8 ounce leather, 8/9 ounce is better. Get rid of the jiffy rivets and put some copper rivets and burrs or get some steel rivets and washers to attach the leather with.

If you need some leather strapping, give me a shout and I will ship you some out your way.

Frank

[Ironbadger]

Unfortunately, it looks like I won't be able to help out on the 7th after all.
My apologies, but I have been asked to help a friend on another project thats going to take some time.

-Badger-

[Hacky2447]

Hacky,

Do some measuring on the straps and send me a list of them and I can ship them out to you.

EnderPC, if you help him, go a little heavier than the chap leather, get a latigo about a 6/7 ounce or something with a little strength and give to it, as it will be flexing quite a bit in the joints. For the straps, go with at least a 7/8 ounce leather, 8/9 ounce is better. Get rid of the jiffy rivets and put some copper rivets and burrs or get some steel rivets and washers to attach the leather with.

If you need some leather strapping, give me a shout and I will ship you some out your way.

Frank

Thank you very much Frank. I will do some measuring and figure out what i need and contact you. I would like to get some heavy leather straps for it. I may just trash the thing and get one that is made right. lol

[Mad Matt]

You're gonna want to learn to strap armor anyway because you will need to replace straps.

Those roofing nails are going to take a while to take out. Just wear the thing for now and fix stuff as it breaks.

The rough from the hammer Churburg #13 breastplates are great they're properly shaped and will be made to fit you. Assembling one is simple and easy. Polishing isn't too much of a difficult thing to figure out just a wire wheel will give you a decent satin finish on them. You can skip rolling the edges or you can decide you want to learn to do that too. If you're going to skip the rolled edges let Dave know when you order so the material for the rolls isn't on the breastplate.

Best bet for straps is 8 oz latigo. Best for the inside leather that holds it together is chrome tanned 6-7oz leather. The chrome tan stuff will work for straps ok too. A side of leather and a strap cutter and leather punch is a good thing to have around even if it's just for replacing straps and repairs. When you beat on things with sticks stuff wears out.

I prefer to use the two piece rivets on stuff where leather attaches to metal. They're not as strong as a solid rivet which means the rivet will fail before the leather does. That means to pain in the ass solid rivet to get out and no giant hole torn in your leather. Replacing a 2 piece rivet once in a while is easier than replacing the whole leather part. It's a built in failure point.

[Hacky2447]

You're gonna want to learn to strap armor anyway because you will need to replace straps.

Those roofing nails are going to take a while to take out. Just wear the thing for now and fix stuff as it breaks.

The rough from the hammer Churburg #13 breastplates are great they're properly shaped and will be made to fit you. Assembling one is simple and easy. Polishing isn't too much of a difficult thing to figure out just a wire wheel will give you a decent satin finish on them. You can skip rolling the edges or you can decide you want to learn to do that too. If you're going to skip the rolled edges let Dave know when you order so the material for the rolls isn't on the breastplate.

Best bet for straps is 8 oz latigo. Best for the inside leather that holds it together is chrome tanned 6-7oz leather. The chrome tan stuff will work for straps ok too. A side of leather and a strap cutter and leather punch is a good thing to have around even if it's just for replacing straps and repairs. When you beat on things with sticks stuff wears out.

I prefer to use the two piece rivets on stuff where leather attaches to metal. They're not as strong as a solid rivet which means the rivet will fail before the leather does. That means to pain in the ass solid rivet to get out and no giant hole torn in your leather. Replacing a 2 piece rivet once in a while is easier than replacing the whole leather part. It's a built in failure point.

Fantastic information Mad Matt. Thank you so much. I was also thinking that if i just wear it. When I get hit it will eventually form to the shape it needs to be. lol... However this is just a theory. lol... I will have to look at his site again, as I dont recal seeing the #13 as an option. Thank you all again for the information and assistance.

I am assuming on his site its the 7 piece breastplate?

[Jan van Nyenrode]

hi,

yes, the 7-piece.

cheers,
jan

[Hacky2447]

hi,

yes, the 7-piece.

cheers,
jan

Thank you I will look into that. I would have to put that together and strap it right? Or is that already put together and riveted just no straps. Sorry for so many questions.

[Payn]

you would have to strap it. That should be dead simple once you are taught some basic leather strapping skills.

Frankly, it's a good starter project since it would be hard to foul up too badly to fix easily.

[Hacky2447]

you would have to strap it. That should be dead simple once you are taught some basic leather strapping skills.

Frankly, it's a good starter project since it would be hard to foul up too badly to fix easily.

Fantastic. Thank you!