Challenge of Pierre Touremine to Robert de Beaumanoire, 1386

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Sean M
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Challenge of Pierre Touremine to Robert de Beaumanoire, 1386

Post by Sean M »

I have been re-reading Sydney Anglo's Martial Arts of Renaissance Europe. Some of his citations are dead ends (he was working on a very broad topic in the 1990s) but I found this challenge to a duel from 1386 with specifications of all the arms, armour, and clothing: Gui Alexis de Lobineau, Histoire de Bretagne (Paris 1707) II col. 663-677

The good part starts on column 672 and goes on for pages and pages of Middle French https://archive.org/stream/b30455194_00 ... 9/mode/2up There are things like "Item: a chaperon to put inside (souz) my bascinet, of cloth of cendal or of satin, sewed (cosu) & garnished with thread and with silk as is appropriate ..." and information about the silver gilt on the visor. Its on my list of priorities for Armour in Texts, maybe next year?
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Re: Challenge of Pierre Touremine to Robert de Beaumanoire, 1386

Post by Mac »

Sean M wrote: Tue Oct 13, 2020 2:35 am

The good part starts on column 672 and goes on for pages and pages of Middle French https://archive.org/stream/b30455194_00 ... 9/mode/2up There are things like "Item: a chaperon to put inside (souz) my bascinet, of cloth of cendal or of satin, sewed (cosu) & garnished with thread and with silk as is appropriate ..." and information about the silver gilt on the visor. Its on my list of priorities for Armour in Texts, maybe next year?
That sounds exciting!

Mac
Robert MacPherson

The craftsmen of old had their secrets, and those secrets died with them. We are not the better for that, and neither are they.

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Sean M
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Re: Challenge of Pierre Touremine to Robert de Beaumanoire, 1386

Post by Sean M »

Here is a preliminary list of the items with which he shall be armed.
  • chemise and brayes with a brayer de toile (shirt and breeches with breech-belt of linen)
  • estrainte de toille ... pour leer & attacher les pieces & estoffes de mon harnois "a compresser of linen" for fastening and attaching the pieces and stuffs of my harness (added 2021-07-04)
  • une cotte à armer (an arming cote, he means a doublet)
  • une braconniere de maille de haubregerie (a breecher of mail of haubergie)
  • chausses de toile de chanvre ou de drap (hose of hemp cloth or woolen cloth)
  • un solers de cuir fermant o las de fil (a pair of shoes of leather closed or laced with cord)
  • soleres, greves, poulains, & cuissols (solerets, greaves, poleyns, and cuisses)
  • un haubregon estre de maille (a haubergen of mail)
  • une collerette appellée faux camail de maille (a little collar called false camail of mail)
  • plates sur mon haubregeon (plates over my haubergeon)
  • avantbras & gardebras (vambrace and guardebrace, which I am starting to think is like "rerebrace" in England)
  • gantelets (gauntlets)
  • chaperon à mettre souz mon bascinet (a hood to put inside my bascinet)
  • un bacinet & visiere (a bascinet and visor)
  • un camail de fer (camail of iron)
  • sera convert mondit camail d'un cendal doublé de linge de lin & de chanvre, ou de l'un deux (the camail should be covered with a cendal lined with linen or canvas)
  • une cotte de cendal armoiée de mes armes (a coatof cendal armed with my arms) lined with linen or hemp lining and stuffed with cotton or bourre de soie
  • unes chouces par sur mon harnois de cuisses de jambes & de pied (a chouces for over my legharness) of vermillion cloth or of cendal
  • deux espées (two swords, one of which will be attached to the saddle bow)
  • une dague (a dagger)
And then he goes into his horse and its harness and tack and I can't skim it so easily. I do not see a lance or a shield. He is very interested in the various straps and attachments and linings, I see what might be a description of the 'mystery strap.' I can use the section on clothing for one of my incomplete projects and come back to the rest in 2012.

The list ends with some important things:
Item une bouteille de cuir, & / du vin dedans, un pain de froment, & toailles de laine, & une tasse d'argent. Item, un poinçon de fer & d'acier, & plusieurs aiguillettes & tresses de cuir & de chanvre, garnies de fer ou de leton. Item, fil de chanvre ou de lin, aiguillettes de fer ou d'acier.
"Item, a bottle of leather, with wine in it, a wheaten loaf, and towels of wool, and a cup of silver. Item, a pricker of iron and of steel, and many aiguilettes and braids of leather and of hemp, garnished with iron or with brass. Item, cord of hemp or of linen, aiguilletes of iron or steel."
Last edited by Sean M on Sun Jul 04, 2021 4:17 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Ernst
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Re: Challenge of Pierre Touremine to Robert de Beaumanoire, 1386

Post by Ernst »

Another good reference for wearing a mail collar (false camail) beneath the bascinet's aventail/(true) camail.
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Mac
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Re: Challenge of Pierre Touremine to Robert de Beaumanoire, 1386

Post by Mac »

Sean M wrote: Tue Oct 13, 2020 2:28 pm
[*]unes chouces par sur mon harnois de cuisses de jambes & de pied (a chouces for over my legharness)
That's a surprise! Is there any chance that it's "under" rather than "over"?

Mac
Robert MacPherson

The craftsmen of old had their secrets, and those secrets died with them. We are not the better for that, and neither are they.

http://www.lightlink.com/armory/
http://www.billyandcharlie.com
https://www.facebook.com/BillyAndCharlie
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Re: Challenge of Pierre Touremine to Robert de Beaumanoire, 1386

Post by Bertus Brokamp »

I've translated this text a few years ago and been meaning to turn it into an article, maybe for Waffen & Kostumkunde. But sadly I have not gotten round to fleshing it further out yet. :sad:
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Sean M
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Re: Challenge of Pierre Touremine to Robert de Beaumanoire, 1386

Post by Sean M »

Bertus, feel free to chip in if you get to this before I do!

This text also has a urisoun (hourson) in column 674, and a quilted coat of arms which I missed in the first quick look. The urisoun is part of the long and complicated description of the bascinet and all its garnishings.
Mac wrote: Wed Oct 14, 2020 10:46 am That's a surprise! Is there any chance that it's "under" rather than "over"?

Mac
I checked that transcription was correct, and I am pretty sure that the word always means "over." But I don't know what this means either :(
DIS MANIBUS GUILLELMI GENTIS MCLEANUM FAMILIARITER GALLERON DICTI
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Check out Age of Datini: European Material Culture 1360-1410
Sean M
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Re: Challenge of Pierre Touremine to Robert de Beaumanoire, 1386

Post by Sean M »

There is at least one chronicle account of this duel, by Jean Juvénal des Ursins:
Michaud and Poujoulat (eds.), Nouvelle collection des mémoires pour servir à l'histoire de France, prémiere serie, vol. II pp. 371, 372 wrote: En Bretagne audit temps avoit un chevalier nommé messire Robert de Beaumanoir, qui fit appeller devant la duc un autre chevalier nommé Pierre de Tournemine, en gage de bataille. Et disoit qu'il avoit un sien parent de son nom et armes, lequel on chargeoit d'entretenir la fille d'un laboureur, devers lequel vint ledit de Tournemine, et luy dit, qu'il estoit bien meschant, qu'il ne tuoit, ou faisoit mourir le parent dudit de Beaumanoir, veu la cause dessus dite, et luy conseilloit qu'il le fist; et tellement il enhorta ledit laboureur, qu'il se mit en aguet de la tuer par plusieurs fois, et le trouva une fois à son advantage, et le tua. Et disoit ledit de Beaumanoir, que le meurtre avoit esté fait [p. 372 starts here] par l'induction dudit Tournemine, et que faussement et mauvaisement il l'avoit fait; et s'il le vouloit nier, il estoit prest de l'en combatre, et jetta son gage. Tournemine respondit, en niant tout ce que disoit Beaumanoir. Et finalement veue la matière, et tout consideré, le gage fut adjugé, et dit qu'il y avoit gage de bataille. Et y eut jour et lieu assigné, auquel les parties comparurent en la presence du duc, et furent les sermons faits en la maniere accoustumée. Et aprés cry fait, que chacun fist son devoir, ils s'approcherent l'un de l'autre, et combatirent bien longuement, et ne sçavoit-on à peine lequel avoit le meilleur; et finalement de Tournemine fut desconfit, sans recognoistre le cas, et comme mort fut mis hors du champ.
In Britany at that time (the year 1386) there was a knight named Monsieur Robert de Beaumanoir, who called before the duke another knight named Pierre de Tournemine, on pledge (gage) of battle. And he said that he had a relative of his name and arms, who was obliged to maintain the daughter of a worker (laboureur), whom the aforesaid de Tournemine approached and told that he would be a real no-good, if he did not kill or put to death the relative of the said de Beaumanoir, in view of the cause mentioned above, and advised him that he could do it; and so he encouraged the aforesaid worker, who got ready to kill him on many occasions, and one day he found him at a disadvantage, and killed him. And the aforesaid de Beaumanoir said that the killing had been done on the encouragement of the aforesaid Tournemine, and that he had done this falsely and wickedly, and if he wanted to deny this, he was ready to fight, and threw down his pledge. Tournemine replied by denying everything which Beaumanoir had said. And in the end, in view of the situation, and all things considered, the gage was approved, and he said that it was a pledge of battle. And the chosen day and place arrived, on which the parties appeared in the presence of the duke, and speeches were given in the customary fashion. And after the cry had been given, that each should do his duty, they approached each other, and fought for a really long time, and we hardly know which of the two had the better. In the end de Tournemine was overcome, without retracting the case, and was brought out of the field as if he were dead.
I found the reference in Steve Muhlberger / Duke Finnvarr, Deeds of Arms, p. 50. I may edit this post to include the original French.
DIS MANIBUS GUILLELMI GENTIS MCLEANUM FAMILIARITER GALLERON DICTI
VIR OMNIBUS ARTIBUS PERITUS
Check out Age of Datini: European Material Culture 1360-1410
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