The Armour Archive

ok guys, broad title i know, but u r lookin arent u?

n e way,
i am looking for an authentic 14-15th century torch, what to make it from, n e home-made recipes, that kind of thing. jst an interest, to use in my venturer charter night(Australian scouts, in queenslan) they're getting me and a freind to bash eachother up with the bits of steal we call swords, wearing the crap we call armour, should be fun, but i was hoping to take it further with "true" lighting!

oh and i might be able to use it in my re-enacting club, in the future.

any help would be appreciated,
Kind regards,
Matthias

I know some medieval lighting sites with good documentation are out there. Believe it ot not, Markland has a decent article on the subject.

The only thing that concerns me is, aside from lanthorns with real horn panels, the only things I can think of are resin-soaked pine torches and rushlights soaked in animal fat. Both would be an extreme fire hazard to say the least.

Granted, I'm refering to light that can be carried. Stable light sources such as oil lamps are period. Historicenterprises.com has a nice replica ceramic oil lap with a rimmed dish base that could be carried, hung from chain or set on a flat surface. Used with olive oil, it will spill if treated carelessly, but olive oil does not flash like paraffin.

~Finnacan

1. Click on "Search"

2. Search the term "Lighting" in the "Research & Authenticity" forum

3. Find useful threads like http://forums.armourarchive.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=41200&highlight=lighting

4. Kindly stop embarrassing Queenslanders by using phrases like "u r lookin arent u"

Michael B

thanks guys,

soz big fella 4 th short words, we aint so smart down 'ere u no! But truly, sometimes it is really embarrasing how our fellow Aussies talk. Off the topic though.

Thanks again, any one with a home made recipe, i remember doing one some time ago.
Hemp Rope soaked in beeswax, coiled around a pole, wired on, lit at one end(bottom) and well worked 'till my hand caught fire!!! My mate Ryan put me out though(after the usual lafter).

Matthias

Finnacan wrote:Used with olive oil, it will spill if treated carelessly, but olive oil does not flash like paraffin.

~Finnacan

Not only that, but the olive oil will generally self-extinguish. It's safer than a candle.

No help on torches though - sorry!

Matthew,

Are you aware of History Alive, coming up in Brisbane on the Queen's Birthday Weekend, 11 and 12 June?

See http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Sparta/7135/ha.html

That's my smiling mug at the top right.

Michael B

Michael B wrote:Are you aware of History Alive, coming up in Brisbane on the Queen's Birthday Weekend, 11 and 12 June?

See http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Sparta/7135/ha.html

Or even better: http://www.qlhf.org.au, where you will discover, despite the evidence, that there are more than two people in South East Queensland who are pre-industrial re-enactors who can spell and speak English.

Dragon Number 8 has an article on rushlights, but I've not tried to implement the suggested construction.

rhook wrote: Or even better: http://www.qlhf.org.au, where you will discover, despite the evidence, that there are more than two people in South East Queensland who are pre-industrial re-enactors who can spell and speak English.

... And not to forget Caithlinn, who has just left us to return to Europe (temporarily, we hope), and who is actually German ...

A bunch of links on lighting of various sorts (including candles, lamps, lanterns, and rushlights) at http://moas.atlantia.sca.org/wsnlinks/index.php?action=displaycat&catid=567

Michael B wrote:... And not to forget Caithlinn, who has just left us to return to Europe (temporarily, we hope), and who is actually German ...

...but still includes all requisite consonants and vowels, although some of the latter have added umlauts...

ouch, seem to have hit a vain! sorry to offend, but truly i was not speaking of re-enactors, rather the general populace! thanks for that extra info, following it all up now. I cant make History alive, or abbey, or sBMF. My senior year this year, and for those who have done it themselves that really explains itself. op of 4 i hope!

Kind regards to any of the offended, truly not intended. and thanks for the help.
Regards,
Matthias

Charlotte J wrote:

Finnacan wrote:Used with olive oil, it will spill if treated carelessly, but olive oil does not flash like paraffin.

~Finnacan

Not only that, but the olive oil will generally self-extinguish. It's safer than a candle.

The Romans added salt to the olive oil. Apparently it dried the oil a little and when it burned it produced a more yellow colour.

Do tell, that's kinda keen. I gotta try that.

~Finnacan

Put a little water at the bottom of the oil lamp, and the lamp will burn out without overheating. A little trick I learnt from a Greek Orthodox person, experienced with oil lamps . . .

thanks for all that advice, as soon as school work alows i will be back at my group to try some of that out. the group has a potter so i shall buy something for the olive oil lamp. now another set of questions, what types of lamps did different cultures use? how were they shaped? were they open top, closed, a jar kind of thing? any one have any picture? what would i use for a wick?

again thank you.
Matt

http://users.bigpond.net.au/quarfwa/miklagard/Articles/Pottery.htm

- features some early medieval oil lamps.

Pottery lamps from Lund, Sweden 11-12th century:
http://web.telia.com/~u60000007/lampor/lamp1.jpg

Lime- and sandstone, 12-13th century:
http://web.telia.com/~u60000007/lampor/lamp4.jpg
http://web.telia.com/~u60000007/lampor/lamp3.jpg

(Pictures from 'Kulturen 1983 Ljus och Lykta', 1983 Lund)

/R

Raymund - very nice.

Michael B

I was wondering how much light (how many hours) you would get for a specific amount of oil using these ceramic lamps. I know it varies a lot, I was just after some approximations.

thank you again,
i will do some experimenting with different amounts of oil, and different recipes and will put up the results. That wont be for a while though.
Kind regards,
Matt

The exhibit on Byzantium that was on in Munich had a number of hanging oil lamps that consisted of a highly pierced bronze plate that held connical glass oil lamps. They ranged from things the size of a desert plate to one from a cathedral that was 16?? feet accross.

I have the exhibit book and plan to make a couple myself.

Thomas

Dan Howard wrote:I was wondering how much light (how many hours) you would get for a specific amount of oil using these ceramic lamps. I know it varies a lot, I was just after some approximations.

That would depend some on the type of oil, and alot on the number diameter, height and composition of the wick(s). Also it depends on the airflow and distance between wicks.

wicks? what to use what to use?

Braided linen cord, braided linen cord...

Or to be really hardcore, twisted moss.

~Finnacan

For Byzantine lighting, see: http://www.levantia.com.au/dailylife/lighting.html

(Note that this is a direct link to a frame from www.levantia.com.au)

Dan can you tell me where you found out about the salt trick?

Sounds neat, I want to try it out!

Thomas

I've found that on a Sutton Hoo style bowl lamp, basically a small bowl or cup filled with beeswax, you can use one or several dried moss wicks depending on the level of light vs. fuel consumption desired.

Some more on lighting (in case you missed it) at:

http://www.markland.org/lettherebelight.php

Thomas Powers wrote:Dan can you tell me where you found out about the salt trick?

Sounds neat, I want to try it out!

Hi Thomas. I can't remember where I originally read about salted olive oil but I did a quick google search and found this citing Cooke 1972, p. 16.
http://www.unc.edu/courses/rometech/pub ... _rome.html

The main type of fuel the Romans used was olive oil with salt added. Salt functioned to dry the oil and gave the light more of a yellow color. The salt may also have helped keep the oil from getting overheated.

Thanks! It's at least one step along the chain.

Thomas