Need some help with late-14th century gown

[Strongbow]

OK, being a fat guy, a tightly fitted cotehardie would look... ummm... not so good. So I'm think gown... the medieval mu-mu... with style!

I've looked at james' images, but can't make out cut or shape. What type of fabric would be appropriate for someone of the gentry, but not high nobility?

What would be worn under it?

[James B.]

Which gown style do you want to do out of my images?

Do you have a copy of the Medieval Tailors Assistant? The patterns are laid out in there and I think they are quite good.

[Agnarr]

OK, being a fat guy, a tightly fitted cotehardie would look... ummm... not so good. So I'm think gown... the medieval mu-mu... with style!

I've looked at james' images, but can't make out cut or shape. What type of fabric would be appropriate for someone of the gentry, but not high nobility?

What would be worn under it?

poly blend.

you will some experts on the 17th

[Strongbow]

OK, being a fat guy, a tightly fitted cotehardie would look... ummm... not so good. So I'm think gown... the medieval mu-mu... with style!

I've looked at james' images, but can't make out cut or shape. What type of fabric would be appropriate for someone of the gentry, but not high nobility?

What would be worn under it?

poly blend.

you will some experts on the 17th

Dude... you're EVIL

[Strongbow]

Which gown style do you want to do out of my images?

For everyday wear... something like this:

http://www.historiclife.com/images/Research/Houppelands/1380_1390PaduanBiblePictureBook/Full/3673_2.jpg

or this:

http://www.historiclife.com/images/Research/Houppelands/1390/Full/MIMI_71A17_005R_MIN_DET_B1.jpg (the guy just to the left of the guy in blue)


For court wear, something like this:

http://www.historiclife.com/images/Research/Houppelands/1390/Full/MIMI_71A17_140V_MIN.jpg

a longer gown, made of richer fabric.

Do you have a copy of the Medieval Tailors Assistant? The patterns are laid out in there and I think they are quite good.

I don't, but I heard from a little bird that I'm getting it for my birthday this Sunday.

Thanks... you're a great source of research assistance![/url]

[James B.]

Strongbow

You asked about materials; I would suggest using wool or silk. I know it is tempting to use brocade to be fancy but it never quite looks right to me. Modern materials don't hang right and the finishes look odd.

Don't use linen; linen gowns wrinkle like crazy and look bad after a hour or two. A light weight wool would do better in this case.

[Strongbow]

Strongbow

You asked about materials; I would suggest using wool or silk. I know it is tempting to use brocade to be fancy but it never quite looks right to me. Modern materials don't hang right and the finishes look odd.

Don't use linen; linen gowns wrinkle like crazy and look bad after a hour or two. A light weight wool would do better in this case.

Thanks again James.... so a light-weight wool twill, or maybe a heavier silk twill?

I assume such a garment would always be lined?

Would there usually be a coat underneath, or could I get away with just a shirt (thinking hot days here)

[James B.]

You would likely have a fitted garment under it; a pourpoint of some sorts. If no one can see it then who cares . A good option is to make both garments out of light wool.

As to lining it I feel it can go either way but I would line any silk gown if you go that root. I have seen images of gowns that clearly look lined and some that clearly are not. The Duc De Berry gown/houppeland (1415) I am planning to do is not lined and dagged all over; looking at the image you can see it is blue both inside and outside on the large open sleeve: http://www.historiclife.com/images/Rese ... anuary.jpg. As far as I can tell all the lined gowns in those images are lined with fur.

BTW you and I are near the same size as I recall and I can tell you a fitted garment looks better even on a big guy than a loose one. A rule in fashion, modern and historical, is that loose clothing on a big person makes them bigger and it is 100% true.

[Strongbow]

You would likely have a fitted garment under it; a pourpoint of some sorts. If no one can see it then who cares . A good option is to make both garments out of light wool.

As to lining it I feel it can go either way but I would line any silk gown if you go that root. I have seen images of gowns that clearly look lined and some that clearly are not. The Duc De Berry gown/houppeland (1415) I am planning to do is not lined and dagged all over; looking at the image you can see it is blue both inside and outside on the large open sleeve: http://www.historiclife.com/images/Rese ... anuary.jpg. As far as I can tell all the lined gowns in those images are lined with fur.

BTW you and I are near the same size as I recall and I can tell you a fitted garment looks better even on a big guy than a loose one. A rule in fashion, modern and historical, is that loose clothing on a big person makes them bigger and it is 100% true.

Thanks for your help James. I'm not going fro a hugely baggy look, just something that itisn't entirely form fitting... more than looks, I'm considering comfort here. I also intend to do a proper cote for this period. My current cote is really more 1350, and my hard suit is really more 1380-1390 (1375 at the very earliest).