Securing Armour at SCA events

[JvR]

I don't know what section this should go in. Man we really need an SCA event section. Anyway I will put this here as the title more closely relates to SCA activities IMHO.

I am new to SCA fighting and have been building my armor up part by part. Hopefully (but doubtful, life getting in the way) I should be authorized by summer.

How do you guys secure your armor when you are not in your tent? I can hang my on my central pole in my pavilion but I sure as heck don't want to leave it unattended.

I probably wont camp with my Kingdom of I go to Pennsic. They have very limited space and I don't want to be under the trees anyway in a swamp. I think I might prefer the Serengeti. Open and no sap and branches dropping onto my pavilion. Not that I don't want to camp with the people, they are truly great folks. Its just that I know with limited room, I would rather see someone camp there if its important to them when I can make do outside the camp.

So if I don't camp in a regular encampment, what methods do you suggest for locking up armor and such at events? I was thinking a wooden trunk that I can padlock but I don't know if I would even have the room for that. I wish I could use my Rott as a "service animal" somehow.

At Adrian events the parking is always close so I just secure stuff in my Pathfinder but SCA events are much larger and too many unknown folks walking around.

Any ideas are welcome and appreciated. Period methods preferred of course. So far all I can think of is the barter system, I offer a case of booze for a secure location to store my armour.

[allar]

haven't fought at pennsic for a long while but one fo the options I saw a camp mate use last year was to purchase paid parking, i think it is $20 for the whole event, it is right beside the battle field and he stored his armor in his car. This lead to a interesting smelling Prius but it worked for him.

[Malachiuri]

In 20+ years I have never worried about locking up my gear. I rarely even secure my valuables other than tying my tent door shut.

If you are really worried, get insurance. I carry a full replacement policy on mine that runs me $47 a year for $2,700 worth of stuff.

[JvR]

Insurance is an excellent idea and knowing I would be reimbursed is nice, my event would still be ruined.

I am thinking big lock box but maybe I can pay someone in the Kingdom encampment to secure it for me. I wonder if paying their event fee would be ok.

[JvR]

haven't fought at pennsic for a long while but one fo the options I saw a camp mate use last year was to purchase paid parking, i think it is $20 for the whole event, it is right beside the battle field and he stored his armor in his car. This lead to a interesting smelling Prius but it worked for him.

only $20? Hell yeah, that sound like a damn good idea.

[Heath B fraychef]

In 20+ years I have never worried about locking up my gear. I rarely even secure my valuables other than tying my tent door shut.

If you are really worried, get insurance. I carry a full replacement policy on mine that runs me $47 a year for $2,700 worth of stuff.

who do you use for the insurance?
im very interested.

[InsaneIrish]

Insurance is an excellent idea and knowing I would be reimbursed is nice, my event would still be ruined.

I am thinking big lock box but maybe I can pay someone in the Kingdom encampment to secure it for me. I wonder if paying their event fee would be ok.

Seriously, you can only do so much. If someone REALLY wants your gear, they will get it. Just work from this principle: "out of sight, out of mind" If you remove easy temptation, then MOST will not encroatch.

I think you are over thinking this. While there are thieves, the SCA is a pretty honorable place. Don't leave your gear out in the open, don't leave your tent with the flaps up while you are gone, and enlist your camp neighbors to help watch each others camps. If you do significantly more than that, then you might as well role up on site in an armoured truck and stay in it.

[MJBlazek]

All of the stories of things being stolen that I have heard always somewhere include the phrase:
"Tent was broken into"
"Car was broken into"
"Trailer was broken into"

I haven't heard a story of armor that is displayed out in the open being taken.
Which I find odd, and there very well may have been and I have just not heard the stories.

But it also might be a "hidden in plain sight" type of thing. If it is out in the open, more people see it, and more people would see someone messing with it.
When at GNE War I display my armor on my armor stand under the rain fly of my pavilion. Never had anyone touch it.
Though I also don't generally stray to far from camp, and if I do I place the stand just inside the door.

I have never been to Pennsic though, and I tend to know the majority of the people who attend GNE. So your experience is probably different.

[Maeryk]

Pee all over it and take a dump in your helmet before leaving camp.














Seriously though:

1) Keep someone in camp at all times, if at all possible. If not possible, work a deal with your next door neighbor to keep an eye on things.

2) Get a bigassed locking box and use it. Most thefts are of the "easy" sort.. helmet left on the field, wallet left on a table, that sort of thing. If you get a bigassed box that takes two people to carry, put a padlock on it, and paint it bright pink, your chances of having it, or anything in it, stolen are less than nil.

3) Be smart about where you leave stuff. DON'T LEAVE STUFF OVERNIGHT ON THE BATTLEFIELD AT PENNSIC! It is not secured, it's not patrolled by security unless they get a reason to do so, and it's open to anyone driving along currie road.

[Larmer]

The risk of theft at Pennsic of armour is very low especially from your camp.

I have camped there for 20 wars I have never heard of anyone I know getting their stuff lifted from camp (not saying it has never happened but I know of no one).

The most likely way to lose armour is on the battle field either taken accidently or intentionally. There is a lot of armour lying around and it is easy to be away from your kit during battle breaks.

[Diglach Mac Cein]

Never had anything go missing from camp.

Last time I heard of such by someone I consider a reliable source, it wasn't an SCA person (one of the port-a-john guys, a temp - who was arrested).

I have heard of people missing gear that was left on the field. Don't do it. Even in a group sunshade/pavillion.

Other than that, use common sense for cash, cell, camera, etc.

[Kilkenny]

As a general rule, you are much more likely to misplace a piece of your armour than to have it stolen. Some time when you are at Pennsic, take a look in the battlefield Lost & Found tent. Astonishing how much gear people leave out there.

When back in camp, if you don't leave your stuff laying about looking like no one cares about it (and scattered such that not even you can keep track of what is there), it's not likely to wander off.

Now, I confess I'm terrible about following my own advice on organizing my gear back in camp. But I've got a pretty good camp, with someone almost always around and decent/good overall "security precautions".

[Maeryk]

Theft's DO happen. But oddly, most of the ones I know of that were "out of camps" were people known to the victim. And many of them get solved. While "spite theft" and the like isn't unheard of, people keeping their mouths shut about it is.

[James B.]

All of the stories of things being stolen that I have heard always somewhere include the phrase:
"Tent was broken into"
"Car was broken into"
"Trailer was broken into"

I rarely hear about event theft; I don't know that I have even heard such a story in over 5 years.

Now a trailer stolen, car broken into, or bag lifted from an open truck bed I have heard but these are not cases of theft by an SCA person but by some random ahole thief. Trailers are stolen all the time and the SCA gear in it has nothing to do with it; they just want the trailer and hope to score with its contents.

I have always been more concerned with leaving my van loaded on the street when I was in the city way more than I have ever worried about my stuff at an SCA event.

[Maeryk]

All of the stories of things being stolen that I have heard always somewhere include the phrase:
"Tent was broken into"
"Car was broken into"
"Trailer was broken into"

I rarely hear about event theft; I don't know that I have even heard such a story in over 5 years.

Now a trailer stolen, car broken into, or bag lifted from an open truck bed I have heard but these are not cases of theft by an SCA person but by some random ahole thief. Trailers are stolen all the time and the SCA gear in it has nothing to do with it; they just want the trailer and hope to score with its contents.

I have always been more concerned with leaving my van loaded on the street when I was in the city way more than I have ever worried about my stuff at an SCA event.

Hmm.. I know of three actual honest to god thefts out of camps and merchant tents (while closed) at Pennsic last year, as well as several off the battlefield over night.

I have also seen armor lifted from the field at local events and demos.. though it's almost ALWAYS someone "not one of our group" in those instances.

[Aaron]

Make three wooden chests you can lock. Ship your armour and whatnot in them.

At the event, the three wood chests become your bed, with an air-mattress on top, with sheets hiding the airmattress. Secured and out of sight. And few people look under the mattress.

-Aaron

[Ceadda]

1) Photograph and document all your equipment

2) Label all equipment somewhere with name and sigil, inside, outside, your choice but something not easily removable

3) Large lock box

4) chain or bolt large lockbox to tent pole

5) camp with people you trust.

[Aaron]

And "daisy chain" the handles to the boxes together. Now a group will have to try and carry three heavy boxes, daisy chained together. They'll be easily seen and it's darn hard to move them.

Now, they could cut their way in, but I think most thefts are "smash and grab".

-Aaron

[InsaneIrish]

And "daisy chain" the handles to the boxes together. Now a group will have to try and carry three heavy boxes, daisy chained together. They'll be easily seen and it's darn hard to move them.

Now, they could cut their way in, but I think most thefts are "smash and grab".

-Aaron

Ok, look, if you guys are REALLY going to go to all that trouble to "keep" you stuff in your tent do this.



Make your box, then drill 2 holes in the bottom, one on each end. Then take 2 of those spiral dog lead stakes and screw them through the holes into the ground. Tighten them down so there is not "play" when picking up the box. Then lock up the box and it is secure.

Anyone that wants to lift your gear, box and all, will damn near need a winch to pull those dog stakes out of the ground, if the handles of the box don't give first.

[Ceadda]

Aaron and Irish, both brilliant ideas.

[MJBlazek]

Hire a thug... might be cheaper in the long run

[JvR]

Ok, look, if you guys are REALLY going to go to all that trouble to "keep" you stuff in your tent do this.



Make your box, then drill 2 holes in the bottom, one on each end. Then take 2 of those spiral dog lead stakes and screw them through the holes into the ground. Tighten them down so there is not "play" when picking up the box. Then lock up the box and it is secure.

Anyone that wants to lift your gear, box and all, will damn near need a winch to pull those dog stakes out of the ground, if the handles of the box don't give first.

I must say that is a damn fine idea. If I end up in singles camping, I will do that.

If in a group, I will probably just store it under my bed..

with a claymore.

Seriously though. I am not worried about fellow Scadians as much as the others who attend.

Great ideas everyone. thanks

[Gregoire de Lyon]

We "stole" a trailer at Pennsic once.

My friend had gone home sick with a horrific infection and left us his trailer for use in bringing the communal stuff home since we had used it to get everything there in the first place.

We sent a guy with a hitch up to the parking lot with a description of the trailer and the location.

When the trailer arrived at camp we couldn't get the lock open. After about five minutes of struggling and trying to figure out what was going on, I realized that the plates were from the wrong state...

We promptly "un-stole" the trailer.

[JvR]

javascript:emoticon(':lol:')

[JvR]

double tap

[Baron Alcyoneus]

I had a flex dagger with ring&quillions walk away from my gear (out of the bag) at Gulf Wars a number of years ago, and it never turned up in L&F either.

Haven't we read here about a fancy helmet disappearing from an event in Atenveldt? (Estrella?) a few years ago?

Yes, there are thieves in the SCA, but they are rare. Mostly stuff (weapons) gets picked up by mistake rather than actually being stolen. Stuff in the open is probably more likely to 'walk off' than other stuff because while there may be people nearby, they aren't necessarily going to think that it isn't being borrowed with permission, even if they know the owner.

[Guy Dawkins]

My wife took off her wedding and engagement rings to wash up and forgot them on the sink in the bathhouse at the bottom of Runestone Way. Of course she realized her mistake when she got back to camp (which is right across the road.) She ran back to the bathhouse to find them gone!

She was heartbroken. Someone suggested that she check up the hill at lost and found. So later that day we went up there with little hope. She described where she had left the rings and what they looked like. The woman at lost and found opened a drawer, took out an envelope and handed the rings to my wife. They had been turned in that morning. Someone who had come in right after my wife left the bathhouse had taken them up to lost and found.

Nothin' to do with armour...just sayin'.

[allar]

Aye i would imagine most cases of stolen equipment or items at pennsic are a simple case of forgetfulness. Not to say there are no thieves but i rarely hear of a theft at pennsic. To be honest only really ever heard of one and that perp was from an external source (nonscaian) and it was dealt with promptly

[Milan H]

Make your box, then drill 2 holes in the bottom, one on each end. Then take 2 of those spiral dog lead stakes and screw them through the holes into the ground. Tighten them down so there is not "play" when picking up the box. Then lock up the box and it is secure.

Anyone that wants to lift your gear, box and all, will damn near need a winch to pull those dog stakes out of the ground, if the handles of the box don't give first.

QFT I was going to recommend this as well, but Irish beat me to it. I use those to hold the tongue of my trailer down when I roll motorcycles on and off. Two of them hooked to the safety chains works quite well, and is plenty strong to hold a harley and my 200+ pound dad when he put his bike on.

Cheers,

[Malachiuri]

In 20+ years I have never worried about locking up my gear. I rarely even secure my valuables other than tying my tent door shut.

If you are really worried, get insurance. I carry a full replacement policy on mine that runs me $47 a year for $2,700 worth of stuff.

who do you use for the insurance?
im very interested.[/quote

We have our home owners insurance through State Farm so we went with them.

Did it all over the phone and email in about 20 minutes.

[losthelm]

The best tool to help keep track of things is lables and camp mates.
Names and Heraldry work well.
Even if its just a group of randome strangers in singles camping to keep an eye on things can help. Paticularly if you share a cup of coffee or pancakes.
Use the buddy system to keep track of your gear incase something happens.
Lost and Found has all sorts of things turn up due to injury or dehydration on the field.

Don't leave things on the field at Pennsic. This past year was paticularly bad with things walking off or stolen property showing up at Pennsic.
Use the buddy system to keep track of your gear incase something happens. There was a Penske truck that turned up in the parking lot recovered thanks to lowjack. And everyone rembers the calontir trim helm that went missing for a few days before showing up minus the avintail.

[Bob H]

If I was going to Pennsic by myself I'd send Animal an email and see if I could pay the Tuchux for their protection of my stuff (and a place to camp with them or nearby, if possible, to make that easier). I'd pretty much guarantee you won't have a problem if they'll take you in for pay, as they post guard and THEY MEAN IT!

[Bernhart von Bruck]

Hire a thug... might be cheaper in the long run

Now there's a period solution for ya'!

"I'm on the Brute Squad."
"You are the Brute Squad!"

[Kilkenny]

I'll make a wager that none of us posting here live in a place where the rate of theft per capita is less than it is at Pennsic. And that includes you folks who live out in Big Sky country with no neighbors for miles and miles and all

Pennsic is a town of 10-12,000 people. In that many people there will be some bad apples, some unpleasant incidents, some criminal behaviour. I believe that theft, as a particular kind of misdeed, is less common at Pennsic than in pretty much any equivalent "permanent" population (read town, city, county, whatever )

[Donal Mac Ruiseart]

I use those [spiral dog lead stakes] to hold the tongue of my trailer down when I roll motorcycles on and off. Two of them hooked to the safety chains works quite well, and is plenty strong to hold a Harley and my 200+ pound dad when he put his bike on.

Now that is an EXCELLENT idea. I always have trouble with keeping my trailer from "see-sawing" when I load or unload it while not hitched. You've shown me a solution! Thanks!