great swords (SCA)

Thorstenn · Post by **Thorstenn** » Tue Jan 06, 2004 11:12 pm

Is there any proof that they used 7 1/2 foot great swords, and if not what was the average size

Alcyoneus · Post by **Alcyoneus** » Wed Jan 07, 2004 12:27 am

Most period GS would generally fall in the 5 1/2- 6 1/2' range, and probably 7-12 pounds.

Murdock · Post by **Murdock** » Wed Jan 07, 2004 12:46 am

Egad 7 1/2 feet!

thats bearing sword size afaik!

Winterfell · Post by **Winterfell** » Wed Jan 07, 2004 12:53 am

Most great swords ranged in the 5 to 7 pounds not 7 to 12.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Alcyoneus:
Most period GS would generally fall in the 5 1/2- 6 1/2' range, and probably 7-12 pounds.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

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Alcyoneus · Post by **Alcyoneus** » Thu Jan 08, 2004 3:28 am

Here are two online sources for sword weights:
http://www.pbm.com/~lindahl/cariadoc/shield_and_weapon_weights.html
http://www.palus.demon.co.uk/Sword_Stats.html

Many of these "2 Handed Swords" are about 4' long, so you'll have to add about 50% to their weight to approximate a 6' GS. So, Cariadoc's examples would range from 6-12#, with only 2 of 7 under 7#

The other lists the shortest being at about 5.9#, but only 4'9", so it would go over 7# at 6'. The lightest is 5.4# at 66.3", so it would be just under 6# at 6'. Most are well above that. Also, without seeing the pictures of the swords he used, I can't tell if he is looking at estocs, or true 2 handers. (app 64 examples)

I've gone through some of my other catalogs, and found the approximations I gave earlier. I would really prefer not to be hit with a 14# GS myself, it would take a lot of fun out of this game. :-)

But I think Calontir's 4.5# limit, uh, silly.

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James B. · Post by **James B.** » Thu Jan 08, 2004 11:03 am

Alcyoneus

The second example is a German collection and the lengths indicate Zweihanders to me. Look in Oakshottâ€™s book on swords, Winterfell is right most 2 handed and bastard swords run 5 to 7 pounds.

Flonzy

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Alcyoneus · Post by **Alcyoneus** » Thu Jan 08, 2004 3:40 pm

I'll look, but what you are saying does not agree with the sample presented here of 71 swords. Only 16 of which are under 7#, and all of which are under 6'.

For a proportionate 6' 2 handed sword to weigh between 5-7#, the weight would have to fall in the range of app. 13.3 ounces/foot (1.1ounce/inch) and 18.6 ounces/foot (1.55ounce/inch). Clearly, most of the 14 exceed this as well.

I can pull out this many examples, and more, out of my catalogs. Bastard swords, of course, could be lighter because they were meant to be swung one handed, not so 2 handed or great swords.

Alcyoneus · Post by **Alcyoneus** » Thu Jan 08, 2004 3:43 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by flonzy:
Alcyoneus

the lengths indicate Zweihanders to me. Flonzy

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

They could also be estocs, length alone indicates little besides length.

Gaston de Vieuxchamps · Thu Jan 08, 2004 11:11 pm

To me this side conversation on weight (not that again) just supports the idea that period greatswords just weren't that long which I believe was the original query.

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Alcyoneus · Post by **Alcyoneus** » Thu Jan 08, 2004 11:23 pm

The longest in the second, larger sample was about 6'6". Ansteorra allows 7 1/2' GS, I guess because they also allow 7 1/2' unpadded polearms.

Thorstenn · Post by **Thorstenn** » Thu Jan 08, 2004 11:55 pm

So then why do we allow such a large sword in the SCA? Pole arms were large, from a bearded axe, to a swiss pike, to a glaive,or a yari spear but no real documentation of 7 1/2 foot great swords. Should we ban swords over 6 feet?

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Do or do not, there is no try!

Alcyoneus · Post by **Alcyoneus** » Fri Jan 09, 2004 12:48 am

I guess they saw no practical reason not to allow it. It's a 7 1/2' polearm with quillions.

Calontir allows 6' max, but if I want to build a polearm that looks like a GS, but meets PA reqs, I probably could.

[This message has been edited by Alcyoneus (edited 01-09-2004).]

Alcyoneus · Post by **Alcyoneus** » Sat Jan 10, 2004 2:44 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Thorstenn:
Is there any proof that they used 7 1/2 foot great swords, and if not what was the average size<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Okay, I did find one example in Treasures of the Tower.7'7" and 14# 6oz. 55" blade, and 26" grip. It's a early 15thC bearing sword.