Mounted Cavalry Charge with lances

[Signo]

We usually envision charges as a head to head attack, but for sure the advantage of cavarly was to rapidly move outside the front of the enemy formation.

But is "direct" charge the only kind of attack that cavalry formation made? There weren't "ablative" charges? I mean, instead of going straight into the enemy formation, the horsemen coasted it using their long lances to hit one or more targets, or even just to make the formation wave, to allow a second direct attack. What do youi think? A similar tactics was called "caracollo" or "caracollata" but was employed with trowing spears or guns, now I don't remember. But I think a similar thing could be effective even with handheld lances or spears if you don't want to engage hand to hand.

[Baron Alcyoneus]

A caracole was performed with pistols. A column (2 wide) charges at a formation, and when they get in range they fire their pistols, peel out, and the next two fire.


Wiki:The military caracole as it is usually understood today developed in the mid-16th century in an attempt to integrate gunpowder weapons into cavalry tactics. Equipped with one or two wheellock pistols, cavalrymen would advance on their target at less than a gallop in formation as deep as 12 ranks. As each rank came into range, the soldiers would turn their mount slightly to one side, discharge one pistol, then turn slightly to the other side to discharge the other pistol at their target. Since this involved presenting an almost immobile target to the enemy infantry for some time, the temptation must have been strong to fire the weapons without taking an accurate aim. The horsemen then retired to the back of the formation to reload, and then repeat the manoeuvre. The tactic was accompanied by the increasing popularity of the German Reiter in Western armies from about 1540.

[Arne Koets]

From my experience it is possible to seriously move a man on foot with a lance, even when it breaks. Secondary use would be not expected, and they were expecting to break or lose tge lance in the hit. The hirses will trample and kick and bite and barge the displaced formation and a secondary weapon like a sword would be used asap. If 2000 odd knights hit in several ranks, the pinnball effect is considerable

[Rittmeister Frye]

For a great explanation of this, and why neither pikes nor infantry firearms did NOT wipe the knight off the field, see "Weapons and Warfare in Renaissance Europe," by Bert Hall.

Bingo. It was the Pistolier who drove the mounted knight from the field.

A lance is a single-shot weapon (it was standard practice to try to break your lance on your opponent's chest according to 16th and early 17th Century writers, and the man who returned with an unbroken lance was suspected of having insufficient bravery), and while they have tremendous shock power, they're only good when you're at speed, the lance is unbroken, and you're within the proper range (about 15 feet, no less, no more). However, good armour will defeat a lance (thus the breaking part), and as Francois de la Noue said, "It would be a miracle if any were killed by [it]" That doesn't mean that you wouldn't get dismounted if hit solidly though. That still puts you out of the action, and is sufficient damage for the moment.

One of the jobs of a squire was of course to have spare lances ready for his master for a second, third or more charge. When the French squires picked up the Italian lances (dropped during the precipitous retreat of the Italian Heavy Horse) at the battle of Fornovo in 1494, the French knights were disgusted with how light and useless they were. Interesting commentary on the different attitudes and equipment between the Italians and their trans-montaine adversaries.

Cheers,

Gordon

[Russ Mitchell]

And by that time, the Poles and Hungarians were hollowing out their lances, big-time, in order to put a serious emphasis on length rather than weight -- neither one was anywhere near as heavy as the French lance, and neither of them organized around having the sheer striking power of the French, either. By the end of the 15th, however, the handier and reusable hegyestor/koncerz was becoming much more popular.

[Arne Koets]

The original lances i handled in holland, from the 17th century were very long, but still very capable of delivering a serious strike.