Simple vambrace pattern?

[NeeSayer]

Does anyone have a simple vambrace pattern for leather I could use? My vambraces are on their last legs so might need to build some new ones pretty soon here. Any help is appreciated greatly.

[Ernst]

You could copy an original. Length 22 cm (8 11/16").
http://www.elpenbeen.nl/vambrace.pdf

Dordrecht vambrace.jpg (39.35 KiB) Viewed 405 times

[losthelm]

You may try the pattern archive,
I find things often need adjusting to your size and to accommodate the materials.
Heavy black leather or plastics need a bit more than 16 gauge steel.

[RichLister]

Pittbull does an awesome set of patterns search for pitbull hidden armour on here.

[schreiber]

Does anyone have a simple vambrace pattern for leather I could use? My vambraces are on their last legs so might need to build some new ones pretty soon here. Any help is appreciated greatly.

Vambraces go on your arms.

In seriousness, though, vambraces are pretty easy to pattern, and you're going to want one specific to you. They aren't like knees where if they're a little big they'll kind of work... they have to be fit to you.
Get some construction paper and tape it securely around your arm, wearing your gambeson or whatever fighting garment you have. Move your wrist around. If paper starts folding by your wrist, cut it back bit by bit until you can freely move your wrist without binding.
Look at Ernst's example. This is one piece of leather with a seam going up the ulna side of your arm. So mark a straight seam up the underside of your arm. Don't cut it yet.
First move your forearm all around and do the same look-for-wrinkels-and-cut-back trick.
Look at the line drawing - the line going around the brachioradialis muscle curves down, but forms a right angle with the ulnar seam.
A pattern like this might have a problem with SCA use because you have to have the "points" of your elbow covered. So you may need to extend the pattern out a bit as per:


It wrecks the aesthetic, but it also gets used.

From there, you just need to cut a curved V out of the back end. The easiest way to do this is to find the end point of the V (which will be basically the point of your elbow) and cut a straight line to it. Then overlap the pattern paper until it makes the right cup shape, tape it securely on both sides, then mark and cut another straight line, which will form your "V".

When you make it out of leather it will be a good idea to "dish" it somehow, not just by the elbow but also farther down, including most of the upper half of the forearm. Getting it very wet and stretching it over ball shapes seems to work after a lot of effort and frustration. I've gotten the best results and some fairly complicated shapes by making presses that basically deep draw the leather. If you're only doing one pair then wrestling with it is probably a better idea.

You will probably also benefit from flaring out the wrist cuff a bit.

For reference....

Your arm muscles:


Your arm bones:

[Johann ColdIron]

You could copy an original. Length 22 cm (8 11/16").
http://www.elpenbeen.nl/vambrace.pdf

Dordrecht vambrace.jpg

That is just crazy talk Ernst!

Actually looks a bit like the pattern we use. But do as Schreiber says and extend the edges. Especially over the Upper end of the Brachioradialis. Its attachement point tends to get battered if not protected.

[Konstantin the Red]

Does anyone have a simple vambrace pattern for leather I could use? My vambraces are on their last legs so might need to build some new ones pretty soon here.

Wot they sed about prototyping it around your arm. First attempt in fairly heavy paper -- paper bag is good; next, a more finalized try in 1/8" craft foam, so you're approaching the thickness of your leather also.

Have measurements of the length of your arm from elbow point to ulnar bump, around your wrist, about the elbow joint on those condyles, and also the widest part of your forearm muscles. These measurements will give you a general idea of just how big a vamb must be for you. With the length between elbow and ulnar bump determined, keep the bottom end of the vamb off the ulnar bump -- an inch short. Otherwise the vamb will irritate you there. Rely on your gaunt cuff to cover that bony process.

Or you could unroll and flatten out your old dying vambs and copy these. Perhaps with some measurements for later use next time.

Don't forget you can harden that leather vamb too, and by multiple means where and if desired: not only water hardening, but adding in a hidden plastic splint wherever you want one. Hide it beneath a lining.

In leather, DECORATE. It's easy, dammit, and you're making aristocratic gear anyway. It's okay to be ornate. Fancy is good; you'll like wearing it the more.

Taking as read that this is your first try -- amirite?? -- just how simple do you really need? Chimp stuff or like, a little more ambitious? Which one it is doesn't make much difference at the cutting-out stage. For instance, I don't reckon the bazubands-like layout of the Dordrecht leather vamb illustrated in the thread as the absolute simplest possible vamb, but about one step up from that, in that it encompasses the elbow and doesn't simply enclose the forearm.

Neesayer, you didn't happen to mention whether you wanted your very simple vamb to cover your elbow condyles or not -- so exactly what is your intended elbow coverage? Are you using a cop there? Articulating? That will tell us all a lot about the vamb's top end. How about the era of your harness and its helm? Which century there?

[Ernst]

You could copy an original. Length 22 cm (8 11/16").
http://www.elpenbeen.nl/vambrace.pdf

Dordrecht vambrace.jpg

That is just crazy talk Ernst!

Actually looks a bit like the pattern we use. But do as Schreiber says and extend the edges. Especially over the Upper end of the Brachioradialis. Its attachement point tends to get battered if not protected.

I know. I'm sounding like an ass and an authenti-Nazi.
Why would I even think that men who relied on this to save their arms from sharp weapons would have any idea at all of what they were doing?????

P.S. Good post, schreiber!

[John S.]

Here's what I got playing with posterboard. Like Schreiber suggested, my example extends the extant example Ernst posted into a bazuband-like object that provides SCA required elbow coverage. If I wanted to use a metal elbow cop, I would cut the elbow of my pattern off in a curve.

Cut the leather bigger than your pattern, leather responds differently than posterboard and you can always trim it later.

Your vambraces should open on the inside of your arm between the radius and ulna.

You can cut the pattern and put a soft leather hinge on the outside of your arm between the radius and ulna, but isn't necessary if your hardened leather flexes enough to slip your arm in.

Like Konstantin suggested, decorate! Leather is an expensive media, spend a little extra time to dress it up. Tool some ivy or oak leaves onto it or (even easier) use a sewing awl to incise some crosshatched lines. Use artist acrylics to paint the tooling a contrasting color to your dyed background.

[wcallen]

You could copy an original. Length 22 cm (8 11/16").
http://www.elpenbeen.nl/vambrace.pdf

Dordrecht vambrace.jpg

That is just crazy talk Ernst!

Actually looks a bit like the pattern we use. But do as Schreiber says and extend the edges. Especially over the Upper end of the Brachioradialis. Its attachement point tends to get battered if not protected.

I know. I'm sounding like an ass and an authenti-Nazi.
Why would I even think that men who relied on this to save their arms from sharp weapons would have any idea at all of what they were doing?????

P.S. Good post, schreiber!

I tend to go that way too. What a shock.
I guess the fact that (many) are at least theoretically working on recreating something medieval, and they had to do basically what we want to do (but to protect from real people trying to kill them, not just club them into submission) should indicate that starting from what they did would seem like a reasonable ... starting point - at least.

I don't necessarily go as far in that direction as John has recently. But I have enjoyed his recent projects which actually tried to recreate specific extant pieces. Strangely enough (at least so far) they end up working.

Wade

[Ernst]

I think some of the extra additions being recommended were originally covered (though a bit more forward) by a roundel pointed to the paired holes towards the interior of the elbow.
http://mis.historiska.se/mis/sok/fid.asp?fid=538409

[wcallen]

I think the rondel on the outside of the elbow would add to the early 14th c. look of the piece nicely. And it would help keep the marshals happy.

Now that we have these vambraces and the recent rerebrace, sounds like time for someone to build a nice germanic looking pair of arms. It would go nicely with a shaped coat of plates and similar legs. A cool look.

Wade

[Ernst]

Rough idea -
The vambrace is 22 cm long, and the Wisby elbow roundel looks to be about 10 cm diameter, so my rendition is probably too small. For SCA requirements, you'd probably have to move the holes towards the elbow a bit.

[Ernst]

So the paired holes at the elbow are presumably for pointing to the rerebrace. Any ideas on the paired holes at the wrist?

[John S.]

I like the idea of the rondel to cover the outside of the elbow. Would you add another (maybe smaller diameter) rondel to the inside of the elbow for an SCA piece?

The holes at the wrist could be for pointing the cuff of hand protection to the vambrace. C. 1250 to C. 1350 it could be anything from mail gloves, to one of the Wisby gauntlets, to some weird transitional thing from an effigy.

[Konstantin the Red]

The pair of holes at the extreme elbow end suggest suspension points to a sleeve beneath. The piece would need something like that to hold it up off the ulnar bump positively. A lining of light suede or other rough finish leather glued in with Barge, or nappy cloth with the lay of the nap pointing down towards the wrist, will also help by enhancing friction throughout the piece upon the sleeve.

Shorter vambraces of this general layout but without the elbow-canoe would be teamed with elbow cops of either metal or cuir. These had their enthusiasts, especially among those putting cuir reinforcements on a mail shirt.

[Will Phillips]

Helpful info here, guys.

What's going to be the most low-profile material option for vambraces? Kydex? Steel?

[wcallen]

Helpful info here, guys.

What's going to be the most low-profile material option for vambraces? Kydex? Steel?

Lowest profile. Nothing. Not required, so could go without (at least in most kingdoms, for SCA).
Next would be steel, but I am assuming we are looking with low profile for equivalent protection. If you are just looking for "some help", pick what you want that is thin and give it a try.

I do know that if I were going to get hit, the lowest profile solution would be tempered spring steel of some form. Not the cheapest. Not the easiest for a normal person to make, but definitely protective and low profile.

Wade

[Konstantin the Red]

Helpful info here, guys.

What's going to be the most low-profile material option for vambraces? Kydex? Steel?

How about glue and canvas laminate, formed to your forearm? (It's like making something in papier-maché.) Low profile generally means fitting your personal contours closely.

[Johann ColdIron]

I do know that if I were going to get hit, the lowest profile solution would be tempered spring steel of some form. Not the cheapest. Not the easiest for a normal person to make, but definitely protective and low profile.

Wade

Yep! Spring steel rules the day in terms of rigidity and thin profile. Lightest weight too.

I went through my Leather phase which if you get thick sole bend can be used without padding. Heavy and Bulky.

1/8 Kydex really needs some padding or a really heavy gambeson because it will flex under impact. 3/16-1/4" Kydex can be used with less but then you are looking at .25" on your arm rather than .050 with 18ga spring.

We in the SCA make a lot of armour out of non armour materials out of expediency or frugality but when it really comes down to it- making armour that is made out the same materials they used in the same shapes is the best way to get them to work.

[Konstantin the Red]

Neesayer told me he is doing a late 12th-c. harness, w/visible mail and tunic beneath it, hiding his anachronisms. He's laid hold of an aventail already, and has a new helm on the way.

So I'd expect it's a pot that is styled like a 3/4 helm, a skull and a faceplate/ventail, w/concealed nape. Saltshaker pot? Round, gumdrop pot? (and that's a neglected style) Pre-Maciejowski buckethat? Inquiring minds...