Greetings all,
I know I asked this ages ago, but like a dumbass I forgot to save the information I was given. When does a hand and half/bastard sword show up in Europe? I remember some references to "spike hilted swords" in Scandanavia. Books or links would be appreciated.
Thanks!
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Slainte,
Fearghus
How long will we fight? We will fight until Hell freezes over; then we fight on the ice.
Fearghus' Homepage
Earliest hand and half swords?
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Fearghus Macildubh
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The spike hilt wasn't a bastard sword, though. Just a regular one-handed Type X with long quillons ending in points of sorts.
There are a couple of Viking period swords with grips long enought to fit both hands, I believe, but these are probably not examples of a "type", but idiosyncratic ones...
You might try Oakeshott's "European Weapons and Armour".
There are a couple of Viking period swords with grips long enought to fit both hands, I believe, but these are probably not examples of a "type", but idiosyncratic ones...
You might try Oakeshott's "European Weapons and Armour".
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Winterfell
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The hand and half or Bastard Sword started showing up in circa 1280, give or take a bit. Oakeshott catogorizes them as Type XIII swords.
While the "hand and half" term is more accurate, the contempory terms were "Epees de Guerre" or Swords of War in the 14th century and "Bastard Swords" in the 15th. By the mid 1300's the majority of swords in use, nine out of every ten, were hand and a half swords.
<u>The Archaeology of Weapons</u> Ewart Oakeshott
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"As long as there are fanatics there will always be heretics"
http://www.caerdubh.com
While the "hand and half" term is more accurate, the contempory terms were "Epees de Guerre" or Swords of War in the 14th century and "Bastard Swords" in the 15th. By the mid 1300's the majority of swords in use, nine out of every ten, were hand and a half swords.
<u>The Archaeology of Weapons</u> Ewart Oakeshott
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"As long as there are fanatics there will always be heretics"
http://www.caerdubh.com
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Winterfell
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The only reference that I have seen concerning spiked swords is Fillipo Vadi's work.
http://www.thehaca.com/Manuals/VadiNewImages/Untitled-jv3B.jpg
He not only depicts the sword but does describe the advantages of pointed quillions and pommel.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Fearghus:
<B>Greetings all,
I know I asked this ages ago, but like a dumbass I forgot to save the information I was given. When does a hand and half/bastard sword show up in Europe? I remember some references to "spike hilted swords" in Scandanavia. Books or links would be appreciated.
Thanks!
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
------------------
"As long as there are fanatics there will always be heretics"
http://www.caerdubh.com
http://www.thehaca.com/Manuals/VadiNewImages/Untitled-jv3B.jpg
He not only depicts the sword but does describe the advantages of pointed quillions and pommel.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Fearghus:
<B>Greetings all,
I know I asked this ages ago, but like a dumbass I forgot to save the information I was given. When does a hand and half/bastard sword show up in Europe? I remember some references to "spike hilted swords" in Scandanavia. Books or links would be appreciated.
Thanks!
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
------------------
"As long as there are fanatics there will always be heretics"
http://www.caerdubh.com
-
Fearghus Macildubh
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- Joined: Fri Aug 11, 2000 1:01 am
- Location: Bellevue, WA. USA
If I remember right, the spike handled sword was a translation of the Norse, as in the handle was long and skinny, not spikey like the stuff in Codex Wallerstein.
------------------
Slainte,
Fearghus
How long will we fight? We will fight until Hell freezes over; then we fight on the ice.
Fearghus' Homepage
------------------
Slainte,
Fearghus
How long will we fight? We will fight until Hell freezes over; then we fight on the ice.
Fearghus' Homepage
-
Winterfell
- Archive Member
- Posts: 12345
- Joined: Fri Feb 15, 2002 2:01 am
- Location: Reston
Interesting,
I have never come across that type of sword yet. Like I have seen every sword made, not.
I am interested to see it.
Is it suppsed to be a single hander?
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"As long as there are fanatics there will always be heretics"
http://www.caerdubh.com
I have never come across that type of sword yet. Like I have seen every sword made, not.
I am interested to see it.
Is it suppsed to be a single hander?
------------------
"As long as there are fanatics there will always be heretics"
http://www.caerdubh.com
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Fearghus:
<B>If I remember right, the spike handled sword was a translation of the Norse, as in the handle was long and skinny, not spikey like the stuff in Codex Wallerstein.
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
From the ON gaddhjalt, yes. If you look at page 30 of Oakeshott's "Records", that is a gaddhjalt. In SAC he iterates a typology for crosses, and the "spikehilt" is type 1. Definitely the cross, not the whole hilt or grip.
Oakeshott says this about the Type XIII "Grete Swords", the first which were hand-and-a-halfs by birth as opposed to occasional large examples of a given type:
"Those shown in art are generally dateable between say c.1250 and 1370; the German and Spanish effigies between 1320-70. There is, however, archaeological evidence to suggest very strongly that these big, hand-and-a-half gripped swords were not uncommon as early as the 12th century." This from "Records".
Given how much he revised his datings over the years to reflect new finds and new dating techniques, even this may not be the final word...
<B>If I remember right, the spike handled sword was a translation of the Norse, as in the handle was long and skinny, not spikey like the stuff in Codex Wallerstein.
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
From the ON gaddhjalt, yes. If you look at page 30 of Oakeshott's "Records", that is a gaddhjalt. In SAC he iterates a typology for crosses, and the "spikehilt" is type 1. Definitely the cross, not the whole hilt or grip.
Oakeshott says this about the Type XIII "Grete Swords", the first which were hand-and-a-halfs by birth as opposed to occasional large examples of a given type:
"Those shown in art are generally dateable between say c.1250 and 1370; the German and Spanish effigies between 1320-70. There is, however, archaeological evidence to suggest very strongly that these big, hand-and-a-half gripped swords were not uncommon as early as the 12th century." This from "Records".
Given how much he revised his datings over the years to reflect new finds and new dating techniques, even this may not be the final word...