Need real genuine armour

Khochinsky · Post by **Khochinsky** » Sun Dec 30, 2001 4:25 am

please supply me with an information - where in London (or in other
part of UK, France and Europe) I could find a real genuine Knightly (Knight's) armours for
purchasing?

Can I export this item outside UK (Europe)?

--
Best regards,
Alexander Khochinsky
Moscow, Russia

Richard Blackmoore · Post by **Richard Blackmoore** » Sun Dec 30, 2001 10:29 am

There are several sources if you are looking for partial armours or individual components. If you mean full harnesses without missing pieces, they are harder to come by. On full harnesses, most are not homogenous, most are composite harnesses (mixed pieces from multiple suits, mostly from different periods) rather than extant complete originals. If by knightly armours you mean armours from the medieval or later periods where a knight would have worn them, you limit the choices further. If you mean a a piece or complete harness with a known provenence that can be directly linked to a specific historical knight, the choices narrow further (most of these are either off the market in museums or come up for sale only as an expensive purchase from a private collection, often as an estate sale).

Medieval/Early Renn (pre 1500) suits are rare, usually composite if for sale and the ones you can buy are exceedingly expensive or of questionable provenance.

The expensive ones with known provenance will often show up in auction at Sotheby's or Christie's. You can participate in these remote or by proxy and have items shipped to you. My squire went to one of these in an attempt to buy halbards and the prices were not out of a normal humans reach, the armours were.

William Fagan (sp?) often has lessor pieces, especially post 1500 available.

There used to be arms and armour sales in London, I don't have my resources handy, I can't recall the name.

There are many other sources, especially if you simply want pieces, not full harnesses. Post 1500 the pieces, especially weaponry becomes more commonplace.

I will try to post some when I get home.

Be VERY careful about forgeries, the market is full of them and the experts get fooled all the time. Helmut Nickel, the former NYC Met curator of arms and armour was given a piece when he retired, he even picked it out and it turned out to be a forgery. It is very, very difficult to avoid getting ripped off.

I have seen what appear to be "real" pieces, especially weaponry for sale at places like Pennsic. I have seen a lot of ad's from former Soviet "Sattelite" nations selling off arms and armour that was alledgedly hidden or protected during the occupation of those lands, but I would not trust the dealers unless you can find someone you trust to vouch for them. Recently a lot of maille and brig like armor from asia was on sale, I believe through Fagan, I think it was 17th century, non-knightly stuff, I don't remember for sure, but the prices were reasonable.

Ken Trottman's Richard Brown might be able to recommend some reputable dealers too.

Severian · Post by **Severian** » Sun Dec 30, 2001 11:45 am

February 17, 2002 - The Nineteenth Park Lane Arms Fair. The Marriott Hotel Grosvenor Square, London, England; open to public 10:00 am - 4:30 pm. Contact David Oliver; Pennystane; Church Lane; Thropton nr. Morpeth; Northumberland NE65 7JB; UNITED KINGDOM; telephone 01669 620618.

Something I found listed under events at vikingsword.com... if there isn't armour for sale, I suspect there will be some dealers there with info on how to find some.

-severian

Brodir · Post by **Brodir** » Sun Dec 30, 2001 6:54 pm

http://www.liongate-armsandarmour.com/

These guys have a bit of stuff, more weapons thatn armour, whatever armour they have is usually 1500-1600. Check the site about once a month for updates.

I've been drooling over those two 10th century spearheads for sometime now... *sigh*

BroÃ°ir

[This message has been edited by Brodir (edited 12-30-2001).]

Richard Blackmoore · Post by **Richard Blackmoore** » Sun Dec 30, 2001 10:12 pm

Beat me to it. Park Lane is the one I was thinking of.

wcallen · Post by **wcallen** » Mon Dec 31, 2001 8:20 pm

The real answer will really depend on how much money you have to spend (isn't that always the problem...).

Pieces do come up for sale. Composed harnesses (usually with significant restoration) are available from time to time.

I bought some pieces at the Park Lane arms Fair. The selection was a lot better in 1982 (when I had no money) than it was in 1992. I have only been there twice.

Auction houses like Sotheby's, Christies, Butterfield&Butterfield and Hermann Historica all sell armour. Some have catalogs on line.

I know of some dealers (depending on what you are looking for), and I have a few small pieces of late stuff if you are interested in them - I have Morions, Burgonets, Crossbows, Knives, Spurs and some other things if you are really interested. You can see what I have by looking at:

http://www.allenantiques.com

If you have a specific interest, I can check with some people I know....

Wade Allen

Khochinsky · Post by **Khochinsky** » Tue Jan 01, 2002 2:12 pm

Thank to all of you for a very valuable information for me.
I use absolutely all your advicies and spent all this week at my PC.
Special thanks to Mr Severian
, Mr Richard BlackmooreÃ¡ Mr Brodir
and wcallen.

Now I need myself to decide - what really I need.
I know, that I need to buy as good suit of armour as it should be REAL GENUINE OLD one or... seems like such one absolutely.
On 4th of January I'll fly to London and shall try to see somthing.
Than I'll do my choice.

Anyway I'll appreciate you for your next advice for the best choice.

As about money, which I can to spend for it - it's enough to buy 15th century armours, but...

Richard Blackmoore · Post by **Richard Blackmoore** » Tue Jan 01, 2002 9:20 pm

You are welcome.

For what it is worth, Wade has probably forgotten more about armour than I ever knew in the first place. He can give you good advice.

I am curious however. What do you plan to do with the armor, put it on display or do you actually want to wear it? If you want to wear it, finding a genuine suit from the period (other than maille) is hard enough without having to worry about it fitting you.

Either way, good luck and let us know if you bought anything interesting!

-Richard

Erik Schmidt · Post by **Erik Schmidt** » Wed Jan 02, 2002 6:25 pm

Try this place;
http://www.fischerauktionen.ch/

It's an antiques auction house in Luzern Switzerland. They have an arms and armour auction every 6-12 months. They have near complete suits sometimes and recently sold a mid 14th century greathelm (authenticated by C14 testing).

Erik