Word origins: Poleaxed

[justus]

*NOTE* if the pictures aren't working, click on where they should be and it will take you to my site for the picture.

Word origins, phrases: Poleaxe, Pollaxe, Or to Poleaxe, Pollaxe

To “poleaxeâ€Â

[Alcyoneus]

Thoughts?

-Justus

It works at Estrella.





I think you are right.

[earnest carruthers]

According to Eric Partridge, etymologist extraordinaire, pole-axe itself is a description of an axe on a pole, pole being a derivation from 'pale' stake.
A poleaxe is an axe on a pole.

L palus, stake, becomes Old English Pal, whence Middle english Pol, Pole, English Pole, the Middle english Pollax, polax becomes poleaxe.

The poll is indeed the head of the axe, but poleaxe is coincidental by its sound.

A possible convergence of two terms that apply equally perhaps?

You could also see the term poleaxed if you consider the act of hitting the animal on its poll with an axe, ie axed on its poll.

Also animals were stunned with mauls, ie blunt instrument hence the back of the axe.


Interesting thread an dince pics too.

[Konstantin the Red]

A splitting maul perhaps, but the essential meaning of the maul is simply that it is a heavy hammer or even a heavy club. My Webster's Third lists more spelling variations than I ever expected: maul, mall, mawl. As a hammer it may be distinguished from the modern sort of sledgehammer by having a wooden head and being a lot bigger than its little brother the mallet. Nor do we overdraw the distinction between sledge and maul nowadays, particularly if both are large. You know: Big Boppers.

[justus]

You are correct, mauls were also used to kill/stun animals, but all of the oxen pictures I've found are getting the axe. Maybe the wooden maul wasn't enough to drop an ox?

I also wonder if the maul was used on smaller animals to preserve the head? It seems hogs are most commonly just held down and "stuck" "stabbed" or "bled."

Which I do know is the origin of "Squeal like a stuck pig" as opposed to the pig being "stuck" in somehting like a trap or fence.

Here is a pick of a wooden maul being used on a hog, then the hide is singed in the fire and finally the hog is butchered.

<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/justus1199/179857247/" title="Photo Sharing"><img src="http://static.flickr.com/71/179857247_62796151a4_o.jpg" width="773" height="286" alt="Maul" /></a>

-Justus

[Mike Garrett (Orc)]

Poll is another (more archaic) word for head. Hence a poll in voting etc and it's use as a term for part of the axe. It is often associated with quadrupeds (horses, cattle, swine etc). Interestingly it is also a term meaning to shorten or cut off the horns of animals, mainly cattle.

So, a pole-axe, or poll-axe is literally a head-axe. It does not refer to an axe being mounted on a long pole (althought the term pole-arm is used for these and other weapons).

From the Brandon manuscript (1546), referring to weapons in the Tower...

"Pole axes with gonnes in the endes, xxvii.
Pole axes without gonnes, ii.
Short pole axes playne, c.
Two hand pole axes, iv.
Hand pole axes with a gonne and a case for the same oone.
Poliaxes gilte, the staves covered with crimysyne velvet fringed with silk of golde, iv."

Note the apparent size variations, which indicate to me, at least, double hande and single handed weapons.

[earnest carruthers]

Mike

" It does not refer to an axe being mounted on a long pole (althought the term pole-arm is used for these and other weapons). "

It does according to Partridge. well mounted on a pole (pale) at least, length not specified.

You can have a poll of an axe that is not a pole axe, ie a hatchet which has a poll, etc.

However there are clearly two schools of thought out there with respects to this one. I usually take my lead from Partridge as he was so diligent and well reproduced down the years.

Makes for interesting reading either way though.

[adamstjohn]

Erm, there are three schools, not two.

1. Pole-axe = axe on a long stick

2. Poll-axe = axe where the back or "poll" of the axe is used

3. Poll-axe = axe used to hit or cut off people's heads (or "polls") qv "poll tax"

I suspect the three ideas are thoroughly entwined.

[Steve_A]

A co-worker told me that he worked at a beef slaughtering facility back in his younger days, which I estimate from his age would have been in the 1950's - 1960's. He described that the cattle would be brought in and have its head clinched in a stanchion. Above the animal would be a worker with a sledge hammer that stood on skid plates located on the sides of the chute. Once the animal was secured, another worker walked up to it and would place a .38 revolver that was loaded with blanks to its forehead and pull the trigger. After the animal collapsed, it would be pulled to another part of the line for processing.

Sometimes after falling down, the cattle would come to and try to get back on its feet again. this is where the man with the hammer would come into play, and after a smack or two, the animal would go down.
He also did say that sometimes they would dispense with the pistol altogether and use the hammer exclusively when they had people that were skilled in this particular use of the the sledge hammer and could drop the animal with one blow.

Looking at the medieval illustrations, it seems that the process didn't change much by the 1960's.

[Mike Garrett (Orc)]

Erm, there are three schools, not two.



2. Poll-axe = axe where the back or "poll" of the axe is used

Or, indeed, where the axe is specifically furnished with a poll, as opposed to an awl, spike or second blade.

GrimB - sorry, perhaps should have send "being specifically mounted on a long pole". As you say, Partridge does not specify length, and Brandon refers to Pole-axes, Two-hand pole-axes and hand pole-axes. No lengths, but what say ? 24 - 36 inches, 36 - 60 for pole and 60 plus for two hand? Just guesstimating of course.

Anyhooooooo....as long as I can mash people with 'em...

[Konstantin the Red]

Or maul 'em.

So, have we beaten this to death yet?

[Mike Garrett (Orc)]

I'm just waiting the opportunity for my pointed argument and final, telling blow...

[earnest carruthers]

Adam, I meant two etymological schools of thought for the word 'poleaxe', as the verb poleaxed is derivative of either, but as you say that in itself has options too.


Mike

"Anyhooooooo....as long as I can mash people with 'em... Twisted Evil"

Well of course.

I can imagine two foes of yesteryear squaring up and prior to the kick off discussing the finer points of etymology before laying into each other

[adamstjohn]

I can imagine two foes of yesteryear squaring up and prior to the kick off discussing the finer points of etymology before laying into each other

What I can imagine is two horrible bloodthirsty killer guys squaring off and one saying:

Thug A: "Hold it! Stop! I got my ear all turned inside out in my helmet!"
Thug B: "Oh God, yeah I hate it when that happens! If you sort of twist your helm a bit..."
Thug A: "Ah, much better."
Thug B: "All good?"
Thug A. "Great, thanks. Shall we..."

Really, I am sure this happened.

Sorry for the derail...

[Felix Wang]

You are correct, mauls were also used to kill/stun animals, but all of the oxen pictures I've found are getting the axe. Maybe the wooden maul wasn't enough to drop an ox?

I also wonder if the maul was used on smaller animals to preserve the head? It seems hogs are most commonly just held down and "stuck" "stabbed" or "bled."

Which I do know is the origin of "Squeal like a stuck pig" as opposed to the pig being "stuck" in somehting like a trap or fence.

Here is a pick of a wooden maul being used on a hog, then the hide is singed in the fire and finally the hog is butchered.

<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/justus1199/179857247/"

title="Photo Sharing"><img

src="http://static.flickr.com/71/179857247_62796151a4_o.jpg" width="773" height="286" alt="Maul" /></a>

-Justus

"Pig-sticking" was a sport practiced by British cavalrymen stationed in India - hunting the wild pigs with lance on horseback.

[olivier]

Just for more word origin info, here's the OED entry on 'poleaxe'

1. A kind of axe formerly used as a weapon of war, a battle-axe; also, a form of this retained till the end of the eighteenth century in naval warfare for boarding, resisting boarders, cutting ropes, etc.
It probably varied in form at different times, but originally (and in naval use to the end) it was a short-handled weapon, which could be hung at the saddle-bow or held under the shield, and used in close fighting: in the quot. from Chaucer it is one of the short weapons specially forbidden at the combat. Its use to render L. bipennis two-edged axe, in the Promptorium and Catholicon, and by Sandys, suggests that it had usually a cutting edge or point also on the side opposite the broad face.
13.. Coer de L. (W.) 6870 If the dogge wyl come to me, My pollax schal hys bane be. Ibid. 6972 [cf. 5053 Hys ax on his fore arsoun hyng]. c1386 CHAUCER Knt.'s T. 1686 No man ther fore vp peyne of los of lyf No maner shot polax [v.r. pollax] ne shorte knyf In to the lystes sende ne thider brynge Ne short swerd for to stoke with poynt bitynge. 1399 LANGL. Rich. Redeles III. 328 They..pletid wth pollaxis and poyntis of swerdis. 1422-61 in Cal. Proc. Chanc. Q. Eliz. (1827) I. Introd. 20 [He] woulde haf slayne me with ane polle axe. c1440 Promp. Parv. 407/2 Polax, bipennis. 1465 MARG. PASTON in P. Lett. II. 215 Sum of hem havyng rusty polexis and byllys. 1483 Cath. Angl. 286/1 A Pollaxe, bipennis. 1513 DOUGLAS Æneis XI. xiii. 105 Hyr braid pollax, rasit sa on hie [validam..securim, altior exsurgens]. 1530 PALSGR. 179 Bec de faulcon, a poll~ax. a1548 HALL Chron., Hen. IV 14b, Sir Piers..with a strooke of his Pollax felled hym to the ground. 1551 ROBINSON More's Utopia II. (1895) 262 At hande strokes they vse not swordes but pollaxes. 1561 Burgh Rec. Prestwick (Maitl. Cl.) 66 Ane slot staf, or ane pow ax. 1567 Lanc. Wills (1857) II. 86 My pulaxe..ij bills or pulaxes. 1604 in Pitcairn Crim. Trials II. II. 432 With hagbuttis, pistolettis,..pow-aixes. 1621 G. SANDYS Ovid's Met. VIII. (1626) 160 Behold, Ancæus with a polax [bipennifer Arcas]. Ibid., In both his hands Aduanc't his polax [Ancipitemque manu tollens utraque securim]. 1625 K. LONG tr. Barclay's Argenis IV. xxii. 320 Snatching their Pole axes which hung by their saddle-bowes, they fell afresh to the combat. 1644 VICARS God in Mount 164 They presently fell to it pell mell with their Swords and Pole-axes. 1688 R. HOLME Armoury III. 291/2 Their Cutting Knife..many would rather take to be a Poll-ax. 1715-20 POPE Iliad XIII. 766 His right [arm], beneath, the cover'd pole-ax held. 1769-76 FALCONER Dict. Marine, Pole-axe, a sort of hatchet..having an handle about 15 inches in length, and being furnished with a sharp point, or claw, bending downwards from the back of it's head... It is principally employed to cut away..the rigging of any adversary who endeavours to board. 1819 W. TENNANT Papistry Storm'd (1827) 45 His henchman..Wi' ane pow-axe intill his hand. 1850 PRESCOTT Peru II. 211 To deal furious blows with their pole-axes and war-clubs.

{dag}b. (?) Applied to an industrial implement. Obs.
Mentioned along with an iron hammer and 3 quarry wedges.
1356-7 Durham Acc. Rolls (Surtees) 557 Marescalcia. In uno malleo ferreo et 1 poleax, 3 Wharelwegges faciendis de proprio ferro.

2. A halbert or similar long-handled weapon carried by the body-guard of a king or great personage. (In quot. 1585 applied (as shown by the accompanying plate) to a small axe-blade on a long lance.)
The original pollax of the body-guard may have been the same weapon as in sense 1, mounted on a long staff or pole; but it became mainly an ornamental weapon, often gilt and of various fanciful shapes.
a1562 G. CAVENDISH Wolsey (1893) 31, iiij footmen with gylt pollaxes in ther hands. 1585 T. WASHINGTON tr. Nicholay's Voy. IV. xiii. 126b, His right hand bare a long launce, the poleaxe at the point being well steeled. 1598 FLORIO, Mazziére,..a halbardier or poleaxe man, such as the Queene of Englands gentlemen pencioners are. ?a1600 Bk. Precedence in Q. Eliz. Acad., etc. 22 (MS. 1604) Then the Pentioners with ther poleaxes on each side of her maiestie. [1611 COTGR., Bec de faulcon, a fashion of Pollax borne by the Peeres of France, and by the French kings Pensioners.] 1849 MACAULAY Hist. Eng. iii. I. 326 His [Wolsey's] palaces..and body guards with gilded pole axes.

3. An axe with a hammer at the back, used to fell or stun animals; a butcher's axe.
1719 DE FOE Crusoe (1840) II. iii. 53 An ox is felled with a pole-axe. 1837 M. DONOVAN Dom. Econ. II. 7 The ox is first stunned by a violent blow on the head with a pole-axe.

Hence {sm}poleaxe v. trans., to fell with a pole-axe; also fig.; whence {sm}poleaxed ppl. a.; {sm}pole{smm}axer, one who uses a pole-axe; {sm}pole{smm}axing vbl. n.
1882 Pall Mall G. 15 Nov. 5/1 By the Christian mode of poleaxing, sensibility was almost instantaneously destroyed. 1898 Daily News 27 July 8/6 She ought to be poleaxed. 1904 Daily Chron. 30 Aug. 3/3 Your valiant poleaxer has returned to the fray. 1906 Blackw. Mag. May 701/1 The s

[justus]

I was hoping Olsk would drop in with the great book .


Here is a picture from an earlier period, late 13th century maybe? Sorry it's so small, I enlarged it as much as I could.

Notice that the axe is just a regular axe, no specialized hammer poll.

<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/justus1199/181230719/" title="Photo Sharing"><img src="http://static.flickr.com/62/181230719_25085628a9_o.jpg" width="250" height="376" alt="Hog slaughter" /></a>

[Kilkenny]

Following up on the previous post regarding 20th century slaughter house practice, I've a friend whose veterinary training involved a stint working in a slaughter house (don't ask me why, I don't know). He described the method of slaughter with a "captive bolt" rather than blanks.

It would seem that the preferred method for killing cattle has been, for quite some time, a powerful blow to a particular spot on the head with a blunt object.

As for the etymology, I suspect that one need not try to pick a single source. The animal drops as though it was poleaxed (pollaxed?) probably can be thought of as derived from the slaughtering of animals, while in context of describing a fight among men it might well refer to the devastating blows that could be (and were) dealt with a poleaxe.

I can rather easily see where the two trails might have joined together and obscured the possibility that in fact they had distinct and separate beginnings.

Gavin

[earnest carruthers]

I suspect the term 'poleaxed' is relatively modern, relating to Poleaxe for sure, but it doesn't seem to exist as a verb in the medieval period.

[Andrew Jackson]

I have always understood the etymology to be from "Poll-axed" - the beast hit in the head with an axe (reversed) for slaughter.

From this we get "poll-axe" as the implement; and from a combination of that word, erratic spelling in earlier years, modern unfamiliarity with "poll", and the (false?) analogy of "pole-arm" we get "pole-axe".