The Armour Archive

Len Parker

Could he be wearing one of these: https://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/E/ ... /Zona.html Reminds me of the Stuttgart Psalter.

Len Parker

Here’s two more that look similar to the cavalry man: https://www.livius.org/pictures/spain/merida-emerita-augusta/merida-museum-pieces/merida-relief-with-a-victorious-emperor/ This one has more detail: https://www.livius.org/pictures/germany/mainz-mogontiacum/mainz-temple-of-isis/mainz-temple-of-is...

Len Parker

The Low Ham mosaic from Somerset: https://www2.uned.es/geo-1-historia-antigua-universal/ROMA%20HISTORIA/LEYENDAS/LEYENDAS_ENEAS_DIDO_VIRGILIO.htm Some info and a nice reconstruction: https://www.academia.edu/36422758/A_putative_portrayal_of_a_5th_century_centenarius_from_Britain_Benjamin_Franckaert_...

Len Parker

This is from the Arch of Constantine, dated 315. I thought about the spikey hair but I didn't know they were still doing that in the 4th century.

Len Parker

Would these be felt caps? https://open.conted.ox.ac.uk/sites/open ... k=0FhJerip and https://open.conted.ox.ac.uk/sites/open ... k=hDh4nQct

Len Parker

It could also be something like the sculpture of mars (not that we’re sure what that is either): https://x-legio.com/en/wiki/subarmalis Scroll down to the bas-relief from Volterra showing a soft subarmalis. I think this is the guy on the left here: https://www.alamy.com/stock-photo-abduction-of-hele...

Len Parker

Here’s a direct link: https://vici.org/image.php?id=20121 This could be just exaggerated folds of a tunic, but I don’t think so. Look at the sleeve. It looks like separate segments (pteruges). Like these: https://historum.com/t/lorica-hamata-vs ... st-1833097

Len Parker

Do we have a Roman cavalry man in padded armour? https://vici.org/vici/80594/

Len Parker

https://archive.org/details/recordofeur ... ew=theater I'm never sure with old armour books whether this stuff is legit or not.

Len Parker

It might be similar to this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ermengol_ ... _of_Urgell If those are plates on the feet I would assume they're plates on the body. I believe the effigy is original and the sarcophagus is restored. I think.

Len Parker

Not that early, but still interesting: https://manuscriptminiatures.com/4170/7886 and https://vk.com/photo-11029306_457275135

Len Parker

Looks like these laws weren't put into writing until the 13th century: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulating

Len Parker

This looks like a paunchy guy from your period: https://armourinart.com/249/403

Len Parker

I wouldn't know how to verify this, but here https://books.google.com/books?id=bkIMAQAAMAAJ&pg=PA257 you have king Haakon ln 940 ordering everyone worth 18 marks to have a bryniu or panzar.

Len Parker

Njal's Saga has: Sigmundur var i pansara. https://is.wikisource.org/wiki/Brennu-N ... ls_saga/45

Len Parker

This might be an 11th century gambeson: http://warfare.6te.net/11/Fatimid_Brind ... _11thC.htm

Len Parker

I think I found what he was trying to show: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_mos ... Ma3457.jpg

Len Parker

Compare https://vk.com/photo-11029306_456244004 to what Henry is wearing https://effigiesandbrasses.com/712/967 I think these were designed for the new slender waist look of the 1340's.
Edit: I meant to compare this https://vk.com/photo-11029306_456261609 to Henry. Particularly the skirt.

Len Parker

I think I found a 1340's COP: https://vk.com/photo-11029306_456261609

Len Parker

Any thoughts on what this could be? https://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vergilius_Vaticanus It's worn throughout the manuscript. Sometimes it almost looks like a musculata. It's a bit strange though.

Len Parker

Sean, thanks for that. I took the incomplete quote from here: Notes [43] https://skookumpete.com/adrianople/ It's still not entirely clear.

Len Parker

Sean, you say the thoracomachus was worn under the armour in de rebus bellicis, but I don't think that's right. Here it only says the thoracomachus was worn: “So when…the soldier has donned this Thoracomachus (which has adopted this name from the Greek because it protects the body), and has put on s...

Len Parker

This was also done in the 18th and 19th century. https://www.alamy.com/stock-photo-male- ... 23057.html https://corset-story.com/blogs/news/cor ... -solutions

Len Parker

I think he was criticizing the entire generation.
Some comparisons:
https://lucycorsetry.com/2013/12/03/whe ... s-for-men/
https://cottesimple.com/wp/wp-content/u ... _large.jpg
https://www.flickr.com/photos/roelipila ... 468647900/

Len Parker

One big danger with waist training is a reduction in lung capacity by 30-60 percent.

Len Parker

Another tiny waist: https://www.facebook.com/ad1410com/post ... 0500519678 What I'm suggesting is that besides being thin there was some shrinking of the muscles around the waist due to the all day wearing of corset type garments.

Len Parker

The farsetto of Pandolfo lll https://yarusa.livejournal.com/photo/album/10279/

Len Parker

I don't think even a 32" waist could squeeze into this one: http://myarmoury.com/talk/files/scan00032_103.jpg

Len Parker

Tasha is right that it's not about padding the chest, it's about a concave stomach. http://cottesimple.com/articles/observations-pourpoint-charles-de-blois/ I don't know if she's right about men sucking in their stomachs all day. I think their stomach muscles would have atrophied from years of waist...

Len Parker

From Geoffroi de Charney: "What is more, it is not enough for them to be as God made them; they are not content with themselves as they are, but they gird themselves up so and so rein themselves in round the middle of the body that they seek to deny the existence of the stomachs which God has given ...

Len Parker

What waist training does to the ribs and internal organs: https://www.doctoroz.com/episode/oz-inv ... ng-it-safe

Len Parker

Look at the waist on this guy: https://wiktenauer.com/wiki/Talhoffer_F ... 15_37r.jpg Jean de Venette gives the year 1340 for when men began wearing disfuguring costumes.

Len Parker

https://books.google.com/books?id=d3_8D ... &q&f=false
[Edit] I should mention for horse amour. Also, I don't know if they're sure neurika means felt or this is just modern guesswork.

Len Parker

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Byzantine_navy "Marines and the upper-bank oarsmen were heavily armoured in preparation for battle (Leo referred to them as "cataphracts") and armed with close-combat arms such as lances and swords, while the other sailors wore padded felt jackets (neurika) for protecti...

Len Parker

You're right. Coats of plates with mail makers doesn't make sense. I'm not totally sold on rivets holding mail to material. Any chance just the backs of these were mail like this https://www.facebook.com/Lembergshop/posts/brigandine-from-sforza-museum-italyduring-our-last-visit-to-milan-we-discovere...

Re: Felt Armour

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Re: Historical source for these knee cops?

Re: Early Pairs of Plates

Re: Early Pairs of Plates

Re: The Panzer Problem

Re: A Paunchy Man's Doublet

Re: The Panzer Problem

Re: The Panzer Problem

Re: Written Sources for Gambesons/Aketons/Pourpoints 1100-1350

Re: Felt Armour

Re: Unknown Breastplate

Re: Unknown Breastplate

Re: Felt Armour

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Re: Is there a treatise on waistlines?

Re: Is there a treatise on waistlines?

Re: Is there a treatise on waistlines?

Re: Is there a treatise on waistlines?

Re: Is there a treatise on waistlines?

Re: Is there a treatise on waistlines?

Re: Is there a treatise on waistlines?

Re: Is there a treatise on waistlines?

Re: Is there a treatise on waistlines?

Re: Is there a treatise on waistlines?

Re: Felt Armour

Re: Felt Armour

Re: Unknown Breastplate