The Armour Archive

It has been an almost de-facto assumption that all sword belts were made out of leather, or at least all of the better ones.

I was surprised to find that the sword of Sanchi IV, a type XII sword from Spain had a fabric belt stitched to a leather scabbard

http://www.myarmoury.com/view.html?feat ... txii20.jpg

I can't find not a pic of the scabbard.

Can anyone recall other medieval swords with belts that are not made out of leather or are not plaque belts?

Glaukos

Using a fabric "sash" or rope was fairly common among the Landsknechts:

Fernando de la Cerda (Valladolid, 23 de octubre de 1255 - Ciudad Real, 25 de julio de 1275). Infante de Corona de Castilla, Hijo primogénito de Alfonso X y de su esposa, la reina Violante de Aragón, hija de Jaime I el Conquistador, rey de Aragón. Heredero al trono de Castilla hasta su fallecimiento en el año 1275. Le llamaban "el de la Cerda" porque nació con un pelo duro (como una cerda o crin) en el pecho o en la espalda según la versión.

Fernando de la Cerda (Valladolid, October 23, 1255 - Ciudad Real, July 25, 1275). Crown Prince of Castile, eldest son of Alfonso X and his wife, Queen Violante of Aragon, daughter of James I the Conqueror, King of Aragon. Heir to the throne of Castile until his death in the year 1275. They called him "de la Cerda" because he was born with a rough coat (like a pig or horsehair) on the chest or back depending on the version.

Fernando de la Cerda's scabbard is interesting... I haven't seen the back of it to tell how the loop system works, but it seems that it was slid over the fabric belt shown in the picture just posted by Gocauo. Very interesting. As for the Sanchi sword, seeing the scabbard at all would be nifty. I don't believe I have!

-Gerhard

Gerhard von Liebau wrote:Fernando de la Cerda's scabbard is interesting... I haven't seen the back of it to tell how the loop system works, but it seems that it was slid over the fabric belt shown in the picture just posted by Gocauo. Very interesting. As for the Sanchi sword, seeing the scabbard at all would be nifty. I don't believe I have!

-Gerhard

I understand that Fernado de la Cerda's sword had the "classic" or "knightly" sword belt made out of buckskin, but that the belt ends had been cut off.


I understand that the tablewoven girdle above is just a "cingulum" belt, not a sword bearing belt. and that the tab was meant to carry either a purse or a dagger, not a full sized sword,
http://www.guntram.co.za/tabletweaving/ ... lt2003.htm
http://books.google.com/books?id=CY-8T5 ... lt&f=false

Glaukos the Athenian wrote:

I understand that Fernado de la Cerda's sword had the "classic" or "knightly" sword belt made out of buckskin, but that the belt ends had been cut off.

I understand that the tablewoven girdle above is just a "cingulum" belt, not a sword bearing belt. and that the tab was meant to carry either a purse or a dagger, not a full sized sword,

FWIW, the scan I have of a catalogue reads it was worn over the shoulder (moorish style) to hold the sword. I can link it up later when I get home...

Well, I'm still looking for information on the Fernando de la Cerda belt... But here's the scabbard for the initial sword in question. Looks quite leathery to me.



And here's a discussion in German on the Historia Vivens site about a scabbard reproduction they made based primarily on the de la Cerda example... Looks like they may have the right idea.

http://www.historiavivens1300.at/biblio ... tgurt1.htm

http://books.google.com/books?id=HLwnRG ... CBoQ6AEwAA

"....the curious thing is that the belt itself has been cut off...."


The archaeology of weapons: arms and armour from prehistory to the age of Chivalry, By R. Ewart Oakeshott.
pp.242

Oakeshott specifically opines that the belt that accompanied Fernando de la Cerda's sword was NOT a sword belt.

Yes... But that's believable. Your initial question regarded the fabric nature of a particular sword belt... I'm afraid it ain't so! The image definitely shows leather - no fabric could look that convincingly unwoven. So, with your information regarding the Fernando de la Cerda's sword belt it seems there isn't much evidence left to suggest the use of a sword belt in Western European arms.

-Gerhard

Gerhard von Liebau wrote:Yes... But that's believable. Your initial question regarded the fabric nature of a particular sword belt... I'm afraid it ain't so! The image definitely shows leather - no fabric could look that convincingly unwoven. So, with your information regarding the Fernando de la Cerda's sword belt it seems there isn't much evidence left to suggest the use of a sword belt in Western European arms.

-Gerhard

Gerhard,

The reference to de la Cerda's sword was just to clarify that the belt was of the common type of the period but it had been cut off, leaving only the sections laced to the scabbard in place. I am referring to the sword of Sancho IV.


In "Sword in the Age of Chivalry" Oakeshott explicitly states that Sancho's sword belt was fabric, which was sewn to a scabbard with fittings of leather, i.e. the sword belt itself was fabric, and the scabbard and the pieces of the scabbard that attach to the belt are leather. I am looking for the citation.

The best I have until I get home is this, from a thread in "My Armoury"

One of the late 13th c. tomb swords in ROTMS (sword of Sancho IV of Castille) has a scabbard with an interesting and relatively simple suspension. The scabbard attachment consists of two broad bands of leather joined by a separate, diagonal band of leather that keeps the other bands separated. The textile belt is attached to the bands by coarse stitching. There appears to be a small slit in the scabbard covering near the edge of the lower band, but the photo isn't clear. This appears to be a much simpler suspension than the complex arrangement of split belts and slits in the scabbard covering I tend to associate with scabbards of the period. I might try this with my Type XIV project, but I don't know where to find a textile belt.

The belt is described as "galloon," which is a woven, patterned material. Does anybody know of a modern equivalent suitable for this application? In theory, I suppose one could approximate the Sancho IV belt by making a long tube of heavyweight linen or cotton, pressing it flat and applying silk ribbon edging. It would be better, obviously, to have a purpose-made fabric belt of usual construction. Maybe a 2" wide cotton web belt? What about an appropriate buckle and strap end for this type of belt?

http://www.myarmoury.com/mobile/thread. ... c_id=17064

See also
Arms & Armour in Spain: A Short Survey
By Ada Bruhn de Hoffmeyer, M.A., D.PH.
Page 59.
Where the sword belt is also described as being made of "Galoon"
http://books.google.com/books?id=QmQFYZ ... rd&f=false

It is clear that at least in this instance, the sword belt was not leather but fabric. My question is whether there are others either in archaeology or art that can be identified as being made of fabric or textile.

Ah, ha. This is very interesting! It is not hard to see the difference between the fabric and the leather, now that it comes to my attention (I posted the image of the Sancho IV scabbard up a ways). This is a rather odd system... I like it. There are lots of pieces of art showing sword belts hung loosely, but a lot of the fine leather that was used for the application could probably mimic that style fairly well, too. Hmmm...

-Gerhard