The Armour Archive

Just thought I'd share this. I have been working on a couple of belts for someone, and this is the first one I finished. The customer supplied the design and color scheme and is attaching his own hardware.

Specs - 1" wide, 72" long (originally - took a small section off for a test piece). Tooled, painted, and waxed. Took forever.

Cat

Ps. The design messes with your eyes - ye 'ave been warned - not responsible for blindness caused by looking at the pics.

Wow
I see it but will not call attention to it cus it's backwards...

Nice leather work Girl....

Wow how much did that end up costing them?

Hal - what's backwards? Did I miss something? I hate it when I miss stuff...makes me feel stoopid.

As for price. well.....I couldn't find anything on the web to compare prices to. Most tooled belts (tooled, not stamped) are of western design and are alot more intricate and VERY very professional. This is only my second attempt at tooling, so I guess it was done for the experience. If I had to do it again, and it took as long as this one did, I probably wouldn't charge less than $75 (without the belt fittings). Now, would someone pay me to do that with my current skills? I don't know, but I DO know it took forever and I would HAVE to charge that much to make it worth it. Of course, being new at this is probably what made it take so long, but I just can't see how to speed up the process.

Now with the second one I am making for him, I got the tooling done in a day. This one is 3/4" wide, and the pattern is done in sections instead of the whole way down. Fortunately, Tandy had a stamp just like part of the design I was doing, (the "Y" shaped stamp), so I stamped those and then hand drew the rest of the pattern onto the leather with the stylus. The design was too small to trace because the stylus is too thick (it's the smallest one Tandy sells), but the hand drawing actually worked out ok.

Here's a pic of the second belt.

Cat

That second belt is very nice....
Are you giving up your metal pounding?
I think you should blend the two.

Oh... the backwards thing was the old American Indian sign tooled in the centers. JuJu runes.... The client is always right I always say...
_______________________________________
Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain.

Ahhh I see. That's why I didn;t get it. I don;t know anything about JuJu runes. The tooling in the middle is where the "ribbons" cross over each other. The original design has a tighter weave, so maybe that would have made it look better.

No, I haven't given up on the steel. It's just that I am out of money, and since I have tons of leather here I figured I would work on some leather projects to earn some cash and buy some steel. I do find leather working to be a little more up my alley than steel though. I don't have to use scary power tools to make my stuff, and leather is more forgiving as far as shaping goes. I think my experience with leather will help me to become a better metal worker too....at least I hope.

Thanks again,
Cat

I think so too.

Would you like me to cut up some nice 18 or 16ga. splints punch some holes and add a bag of rivets?
If you added some metal strips, know what I mean.... to the leather.
I have access to a power shear that will cut strips up to 11ga. any width by 4 feet long.
Well it might have a bit of trouble cutting very thin ones like 1/8"
I think 1/2" 5/8" and 3/4" would be nice; any bigger and we would be making spangen bands. No?

I was thinking of splints how ever long fits in the bulk rate box.
A healthy supply of various widths. A plethora of splints... and rivets....
You cut to your length. A hack saw and the bench vice works quite well.
Don't smash your knuckles into the vice on the last cut.
Slow down and take it easy when the metal is almost cut thru.
Also the bull dog snips, and my favorite the B-2...


In return.... my sweet...

**wrings hands together in a sinister faction**

I want you... to make me... a plain short sword leather sheath... for a fantasy sword, that is not made yet.
An over the shoulder strap would be nice.
Sam Browne belt style and low slung..
Rings and buckles are fine. I could supply.
Something like the "Hobbit Sting" sword would belong in....
I am not historical....I want you to do it for the art.
If you feel it needs some tooling I will trust you.
The sword will be made to fit your scabbard from virgin spring steel. .2 thick by 2.4" wide at the hilt.

Hal

Ps: Remember the brass on your dagger's scabbard?
I was thinking of adding that to your leather work on this fantasy sheath...

Ok.. This sounds like a lot of work. Yes?
So... I will add a nice spaulder pre cut kit... which is not a good idea?... cus you are doing leather now...

Oh well... disregard this post.....

Hmmm...splint...leather.....BUT No washers on the outside!! AHHH the pain of the realization that what you just spent forever on will not hold up well although you thought you had planned oh so carefully...

Sorry, recent project memories....painful ones, too...

I would love to give it a shot, but I know NOTHING about making a scabbard. Nothing at all. I wouldn't even know where to begin. Is there a "How to make a scabbard for Dummies" tutorial out there somewhere?

Oh, and here's the (painful) pics of the aforementioned project..

Cat

For those of us who where about to put rivets directly into leather...where are we putting these washers again??

Tooling interlace takes me about forever too.

Draw the pattern on the transfer film, figuring out the over- and underlapping.
Transfer the pattern to the grain of the leather with the stylus.
Go over the stylus lines with the swivel knife.
Stamp down the outsides of the knife cuts with that beveled stamp.
Smooth the bevel-stamped outsides with the deerfoot or spade-ended tool.
Stamp the ground, usually with a textured stamp.

Then you get to color! Then you get to apply sealer!

Lots of labor cost in swivel knife cut and tooled interlace.

I like that splinted work you posted.
What is the matter with it?
Did you make the crusader knees?

Cat I am not unterschtent! How you are make so much beautifuls armours an' t'ing like dat? is'a preety.

Cat,

If you need any help I would gladly give you some tips on what not to do when making a scabbard.

Keep up the good work.

Tangent

shameless plug

Thanks so much guys.

Hal, the problem with the splinted legs is that I did not use washers on the outside of the cuisse and apparently the rivets will eventually pull through. I had mistakenly thought that since they were peened against the splints in the back that they would be secure. The painful part was that it took a while to make the pattern (but that can be re used), and I went to the extra expense of using stainless steel splints, knees, and rivets. The SS rivets were a pain to cut and peen, and after all of that peening, I find out they will pull through because I didn't put the washers on the outside.

Oh, and no, I didn't make the knees. They were actually GIVEN to me by an archive member, along with the matching elbows.

Tangent, I would LOVE any tips you could give me, even if it's what not to do.

Thanks again,
Cat

Cat,
Had you put washers on the outside, those legs would not look as good. I myself would fight in those legs. And if some of the rivets pulled out, well there are so many that would be left still holding it all together.

The problem isn't in your work or design, so much as the unavailibility of the proper type of rivet. (Hmmm, wonder if I should step up and start making large headed brass and copper dome head rivets...)

I might suggest putting the splints on the outside if you make another pair. As a steel fighter, I'd rather that the steel helped protect the leather anyway.

And, as to the subject at hand,
DAMN GIRL! You are so good with the leather work. If I wasn't a cheap bugger, I'd be asking to get on your que list.

Jason

Thank you so much.

And you're not "cheap", you're "price conscious". Not a bad way to be - keeps you from being broke. Now me - I'm broke. Why? 'Cause I can't seem to stop spending money on materials to make things I have no use for. When I don't have the money, I get it from my hubby so I can feed my addiction even more. (I "owe" him quite a bit as a matter of fact, and since he doesn't have a use for any of this stuff either, I can't trade him anything to get rid of the debt.)

Ya know.....I need shop monkeys. Other people have shop monkeys and I want some too. They can make the stuff for me, and I can sell it and not be broke. I would just need to feed them occasionally. Where does one get such things? I tried turning my kids into shop monkeys, but I lack the scientific background to complete the transformation. I had one nearly converted, but the process quickly reversed......bummer....

Ah well....I just need to stick to my original plan. Find the ONE thing that I can make REALLY well....something that no one else makes so it can't be bought anywhere else. Once people see it, they will realize that they can't live without it, and will buy it from me like their survival depends on it. Of course, this thing will only take minutes to produce and will only cost pennies to manufacture, but will yield hundreds in profit per unit. Yes, I think I will stick with that plan. It's very simple you see, and I'm sure it will be easy to accomplish. I just need more time.....

Wow, I think I have been staying up WAY too late errrr lately....

Cat

M. Eversberg II wrote:For those of us who where about to put rivets directly into leather...where are we putting these washers again??

On the end of the shank, opposite the head of the copper rivet, making a capital T into a capital I. Just one of two or three kinds of leather rivet, the others being the speed rivet and the Chicago screw. Speed rivets are cheap, Chicagos rather expensive but demountable, and copper rivets with burrs between the two.

Cat,

Those legs look really nice. Well done!

Tim

Thank you. I will eventually get back to these and finish the other one. I've just been a bit busy lately.


Thanks again,
Cat

Hey Cat,

None of these are formal "How-to's" but there are some really good threads over at MyArmoury.com.

http://www.myarmoury.com/talk/viewtopic ... ard+making
http://www.myarmoury.com/talk/viewtopic ... ard+making
http://www.myarmoury.com/talk/viewtopic ... ard+making
http://www.myarmoury.com/talk/viewtopic ... ard+making


Hope that helps,
Joe

Thanks for those links! That dark brown scabbard with the cords under the leather is awesome! I wondered how they did that. I guess I thought they were hammering the leather out from the back to get that effect.

Well Hal, from looking at those threads, it looks like you will need to make the sword first. After I clear up some things and earn some cash, I would be willing to give this a go. Don't know if I can do it, but I would love to try. Let me know whatcha think.

Cat

Here's more pics of belt number 2. Color shceme and design provided by customer.

Cat

Ok... one fantasy sword comming up....

That tooling sure is nice Cat.

Hal

Thank 'ee sir. I will email you in a bit about this project. Hey, how do you like midnight blue and silver for a possible color combination for the scabbard? I don't know if I can get midnight blue dye or not, but I thought I would run it past you first and then go a lookin'. I REALLY wish I could do some metal casting (magic casting would be nice too, but unfortunately I'm not a PC game character ). I have alot of ideas for realistic pale silver vines (not real silver of course ) wrapping around the scabbard.....The image in my head is gorgeous, but applying it to real life is the durn trouble spot...

Oh, and what kind of wood do you want the base of the scabbard to be made from? I have no idea what you're supposed to use...

Cat

Ps. The color scheme is just a suggestion. You, of course, can choose what you like, or what goes best with the sword itself. I suppose I should see the sword first before I start thinkin' up designs for the scabbard....but I just can't help it.

From reading those threads I sent you it seems that Poplar is the standard. Buuuuuuuut since I've never made one myself I could be ENTIRELY wrong . You've been warned.