I want to be an Elizabethan Knight/Officer/Soldier/Gentleman

[Greywind]

Hi! I'm looking for information on portraying an Elizabethan Persona. In particular, I am looking for information on being a knight or officer during this time period (Late Mary Rose-ish to about 1600). If possible, I am also searching for informatin on an Elizabethan militia-man/soldier/trayned bands man. Thanks for all your help!!!!


Sir Francis Drake, 1577

[Jon Barber]

Hi! I'm looking for information on portraying an Elizabethan Persona. In particular, I am looking for information on being a knight or officer during this time period (Late Mary Rose-ish to about 1600). If possible, I am also searching for informatin on an Elizabethan militia-man/soldier/trayned bands man. Thanks for all your help!!!!

Short on time, but here's some reading you'll want to do.

Henry J. Webb, "Elizabethan Military Science - The Books and the Practice"

C.G. Cruikshank, "Elizabeth's Armies"

L. Boynton, "The Elizabethan Militia; Procter, Of the Knowledge and
Conducte of Warres"

John S. Nolan, "Sir John Norreys and the Elizabethan World"

Jacob De Gheyn, "The Exercise of Arms"

J.H. Leslie, "A Survey of Muster of the Armed and Trayned
Companies in London"

Barnaby Rich, "A Pathway to Military Practice"

Matthew Sutcliffe, "The Right Practice, Proceedings, and Laws of Arms"

Sir William Segar, "The Booke of Honor and Armes"

Sir John Smythe, "Certain Discourses"

Osprey-E15 - The Armada Campaign 1588

Osprey E70 - Elizabethan Sea Dogs

OspreyW44 - Ironsides - English Cavalry 1588-1688

Osprey C86 - Armada Campaign 1588

Jeff Morgan and Jeffrey L. Singman, "The Elizabethan Trained Bands: An Introduction"

Jeffrey L. Singman, "The Tudor-Stuart Sourcebook: Materials for Living History c1585- 1645"

Jeffrey L. Singman , "Ye Englishe Breviat: A Concise Guide to Elizabethan and Stuart Living History"

Rather than list all the Caliver Books things you might want, here's a linK
http://www.caliverbooks.com/

Look around the site- they have a *lot* of good resources.

That should get you started

Jon Barber

[Maredudd]

Try and narrow your time period. The mens fashions change dramatically during this time period. That said there is a picture in Osprey Military - Men-at-Arms Series, 191 Henry VIII'S Army of a Halberdier, London Trained Bands, 1539 that would not look out of place in early to mid Elizabethan London. If you want fashion advice for a particular Tudor/Elizabethan year then PM me.
Maredudd

[Rittmeister Frye]

Below is the Light Horse armour of Sir John Smythe ("Certain Discourses", above), part of a garniture made for him at Greenwich, and presently on display at Leeds. A fine example of a high-quality Gentleman's armour from the late 16th Century, should that be what you are aiming for (it would also, in much plainer form, be suitable for a Schwartz Reiter impression, but as shown would be unsuitable for any SCA heavy combat, without the addition to/replacement of the maille sleeves with pauldrons and vambraces with couters & rerebraces).

Cheers,

Gordon

[DavidEvans]

Hi! I'm looking for information on portraying an Elizabethan Persona. In particular, I am looking for information on being a knight or officer during this time period (Late Mary Rose-ish to about 1600). If possible, I am also searching for informatin on an Elizabethan militia-man/soldier/trayned bands man. Thanks for all your help!!!!

Try here http://www.lib.ed.ac.uk/about/bgallery/ ... eland.html for John Derrick from a book that he supplied woodcuts for in 1581. The woodcuts show the Elizabethen army in Ireland including mail clad Borderers and armoured pikeman.

[Rittmeister Frye]

Sorry for the blatant self-promotion, but I thought that you might enjoy a photo of an "Elizabethan Gentleman riding with his page"... a few details are wrong of course, but overall I think it's fairly close to the mark.

http://www.jeffress.net/ALC2/images/img_2639.jpg

And one of said Gentleman riding at the head of his Troop of Horse;

http://www.jeffress.net/ALC2/images/img_2631.jpg

We're not kitted out to the fullest or best degree, but hey, for a first try, I flatter myself to think it's not bad.

Allons!

Gordon

[Jonny Deuteronomy]

Outstanding!

[Rittmeister Frye]

Thank You, Sir! For your enjoyment, another photo, this time of Horse and Foote on the march:

[img]http://www.jeffress.net/ALC2/images/img_2644.jpg[/img]

Allons!

Gordon

[sha-ul]

I have 3 threads going that might fit into this dinosaur
http://forums.armourarchive.org/phpBB2/ ... ?p=1352982

http://forums.armourarchive.org/phpBB2/ ... ?p=1355913

http://forums.armourarchive.org/phpBB2/ ... ?p=1357062

[sha-ul]

I had a most excellent response

hrm, a subject I can speak about at length....


shall I go from the outside in, or inside out? inside.

soft kit, first off for 1570 england you will be needing shirts. Linen, of course. those will be of the long variety, almost nightshirt in proportions. those will likely consist of a very fine linen, with not lace, but cutwork detailing - although some may be cleanly hemmed with figure-of-eight pleating (reference the Nils Sture shirt).
when not in harness, almost any social class will aim to be the owner of at least one fine shirt, with blackwork embroidery. Technically, of course, blackwork is'nt always black, there are a few extant shirts in deep blue or red (reference the warwick museum collection, and janet arnold's patterns of fashion 4 for more info there)
Such a shirt is considered almost essential for any strata of society, really, and there's archival evidence indicating that even the relatively poor middle class would own such garments.

onto the next layer, you're going to be looking at doublet and hose of course; in england in 1570, the primary fashion was for trunk-hose, with peascod doublet. Pluderhose are popular in germanic and sweden , and not unknown, so part of your attire will be dependant on your location (east coast of england is more likely to have contact with german fashions, london likewise.) as to which of these fashions is most appropriate, although padded trunk-hose are most likely. doublets, the general pattern indicates that the padded peascod is relatively fashionable, although that will be dependant on your own body shape. the doublet for that period is most likely to have 4 tabs over the hose band, with 8 or 12 only coming in later on. That can also be applied to soft armour, for instance padded jacks, for lower-class combatants (reference, padded jack dated to 1570, Scottish National Museum, Edinburgh)

Hose proper, bias cut at this point if I recall.
Footwear, at that point generally a low-cut shoe, laces, not buckled, and relatively soft-soled.

over the doublet, generally a jerkin, winged but sleeveless, often contrasting in colours. at this point it would've been buttoned often with silkcovered contrasting buttons.

Headgear, the archetypical floppy-brimmed hat in velvet, or felted wool, or even soft leather. the flowerpot shapes were also fashionable, and no man would be seen in the street without a hat.

Belts and harnesses, shortening but with a chape, often with patterned studding decoration. (reference the finerary effigy of sir Alexander Denton, Hillesden Berks, All Saints chapel)

doublet and jerkin would of course be abandoned for harness wear, replaced with an arming doublet with maille inserts, as per sha-ul's pic above. Harness, very much dependant on the social class, the highest obviously would be a grenwitch harness with exchance peices for horse and field, which is likely in blued with gold trim at this point in england. Imported germanic armour is likely to be black/silver painted, and imported as a trade good along with blades from solingen and other industry centres.
guntlets fingered, possibility that lower greave and sabatons would be missed out. on lower classes a breast, gorget and shoulder spaulder/pauldron may be the sum total, headgear, again very dependant on social standing and income. What is most likely however is that in all custom-produced, rather than general munitions harnesses, the widened tassets and fuald to take the trunk-hose will be a distinctive feature.

Weapons-wise, sword and buckler still dominate, but I'll leave all coments on the fashions of the rapier coming in to upper echelons to our finest xenophobe, George silver, whose rants on the weak, fantastical and italianated schools of defence, I'm sure you're familliar with

erm, that's all that springs to mind without doing some research. hope it's a start particularly on the soft kit underneath.

[J.G.Elmslie]

I had a most excellent response

hrm, a subject I can speak about at length....


What is most likely however is that in all custom-produced, rather than general munitions harnesses, the widened tassets and fuald to take the trunk-hose will be a distinctive feature.

just noticed I'd borked that up.
Edit that line to "likely however in many custom produced, rather than general munitions harnesses"

little bit inaccurate there, was late and did'nt notice I'd made it sound more definate than it is.

[Rittmeister Frye]

Nicely done summary, thank you.

Cheers!

Gordon

[James Adair]

Is there any information you fine people can give me on english and scottish protestants fighting against Spain in the Netherlands? I am researching for my new SCA persona.
Thanks
Adair

[Baron Alejandro]

Which side are you looking at doing? The good side, or the protestant side?

[James Adair]

The side that isn't at the bottom of the channel your excellency..LOL. I am doing a Scottish Reiver that also has fought in the low countries against the spanish. I have done some reading about the Flanders wars and the Duke of Parma was tough. I am reading when I have time (I have 2 jobs) the Reivers by Alistar Moffet. It is excellent and entertaining. I will be Protestant your excellency. I have a fine pair of tall boots ordered from Darkwood armory

http://www.darkwoodarmory.com/index.php ... ucts_id=47

along with on of Earl Sir Brian McBran's fine English Basket hilts.

I am having a morion built by Hammer Breaker in the Ukraine with a plume holder like what Illusion Armory does or did? They are also doing a Spanish Collar Gorget for me. I am building a "Jack of Plates" the Jack plates will probably be Kydex sandwiched between 2 layers of quilted linen. If all goes well a light and spiff kit. I don't know yet what I am going to do when fighting polearm or spear. I had gotten a used pair of the "Stealth" gauntlets but they were too big for me..maybe a set made for me. Any help will be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
Lord Adair

[James Adair]

Here are the pics of the boots. In fact they called when I was typing the other page to tell me my basket hilt was made and my hilt, boots and some gloves I got were shipping today! They had given me a shipping date of 3 weeks because he was in a production run on the hilts. They are shipping 9 days early..great service!

Lord Adair

[Baron Alejandro]

Well, you might be portraying a protestant, but you've got a morion - so I s'pose you're alright.

An idle question - if you're going to all the trouble of doing a linen jack, why are you using kydex? Go all the way, and use steel. If you use spring steel, there won't be any weight difference at all.

[James Adair]

There will be rust...and I live in the Mid South...we get to have temps and humidity that match alot...LOL...100% for both...I really wanted a peascod..like Illusion makes..but no luck on finding a armorer.
Adair

[DavidEvans]

Tinning......

[Thomas MacFinn]

This thread (Non-Armor-Late Tudor Clothing needed) may also be useful.

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=134968

[Thomas MacFinn]

And this one (16c Jack of Plate):

viewtopic.php?f=16&t=140947

[Aaron]

Thanks for making this happen!