IWTB a CotT guy... 1351

[Tailoress]

If you are interested in knowing what the combatants at the Combat of the Thirty wore check out this book. http://www.freelanceacademypress.com/co ... hirty.aspx

I wrote a chapter on the armour worn at the Combat. You may find it helpful.

Also, anyone who fights in the CotT should pick this book up and read it so they will be educated on the historical record that inspires the modern version.

It's a great read, not dense or long, and it deserves a wider audience.

Yes, Greg Mele is one of the owners of Freelance Academy Press. I do occasional light editing work for the company 'cause he's my sweetheart and I enjoy the works they publish.

While you are at it, check out the rest of the series, which includes Royal Jousts and The Twelve of England. Forthcoming: Charny's Men at Arms, in which Professor Mulberger further analyzes Charny's Questions on War concerning the proper behaviors of men at arms.

[Vilhelm550]

Would this be suitable? I have short mail sleeves and skirting in the works, and either mail or scale sabatons.

[RandallMoffett]

Vil,

I'd say yes for the periodness of it with the mail... nice look!

RPM

[MJBlazek]

Vilhelm, were I running a deed such as this you not only would be allowed to participate, but you would be used as a model for an acceptable kit!

[MJBlazek]

Vilhelm, were I running a deed such as this you not only would be allowed to participate, but you would be used as a model for an acceptable kit!

[Caius705]

Vilhelm, if I saw you in a Deed, I'd admire your kit, then try to get another guy or two to help me club you, cause obviously you have some nice ransom.

[Henrik Granlid]

I have just gotten home with plate chauses with articulated cops and splint greaves as well as articulated elbow cops with an elongated back-lame and splinted forearms. I also have a clapvizier dogface (not a houndskull) on tailored order. In the basement there are butted mail hose and a butted, half-sleeve haubergon. I intend to make a 14th cent "gambeson" (can't remember the proper name of the garment, biiiig round shoulder areas) and a coat of plate.

I will need either hourglass mittens or hourglass demis, or hourglass fingers with finger bucklers. I will also need to make a coat of arms and a fitted coat of plate. Is there anything I'm missing? Or am I a few decades too late for the party?

What parts can and can't/shouldn't I use when aiming for the thirty?

The knees and arms have relatively small wings but are, unfortunately a bit clunky in design, being seven or eight years old and early pieces from a now phenomenal blacksmith. I'll do some work on replacing rivets, blinging the rivet-discs with brass flowers and replacing broken straps etc. Pictures will follow when there is time for work on the stuff.

Also, Vilhelm, and everybody else in this thread, your kits are inspiring!

[Caius705]

Hey Henrik, where are you located at?

[MJBlazek]

Henrik,
Just as a point. I am not aware of the "Big Round" shoulder pieces being from the 14th century. Are you talking about something like this? Also known as Mahoitered sleeves, or sometimes called Burgundian Sleeves. This is pretty well set in the last half of the 15th century and wouldn't be appropraite for a deed such as the 30.


So as to be constructive and not just negative here are a few examples or the pourpoint I would suggest.
http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9 ... LR-2aMAZnm
http://www.wintertreecrafts.com/images/ ... othes2.jpg
http://s2.gambeson.pl/pf/2143/pourpoint ... -blois.jpg

I would also reccomend Tasha's pattern http://www.lulu.com/shop/tasha-kelly/th ... 2C291BC48C

[Henrik Granlid]

Oh nono, sorry.

I was reffering to the Charles de Blois Pourpoint



Edit: And I am a beginner of the realm of Drachenwald and can be found in the southern fields of Sweden

[Caius705]

Ah, much too far then. No worries.

[MJBlazek]

Ahh good! I just added images in links to that!
That is what I reccomended.

[Henrik Granlid]

Love it when you run around eachother in forum edits and answers.

Any suggestion on something I've missed or something I won't need to use from my list of items?

[MJBlazek]

I have a pair of finger bucklers that I never use. If you get the right padding behind the fingers, or if the fingers ground out (touch before) on the rattan you really won't need them.
I highly reccomend a Jupon of some form, with your heraldry on it!
And sabatons. While you don't "need" them hey really add to the look. I am working on scale sabs myself.

[Henrik Granlid]

Sleeved jupon or not? The full hauberk feels a bit nonsensical with a sleeved jupon.

[MJBlazek]

Mine is not sleeved. It is the same general shape of Vilhelms. With Fancy round dags on the bottom edge.
I actually really want to make or have a better one made with my arms appliquied on the front and back.

Depends on how accuarate you want to be. There are depictions of mail and breastplates being worn under a long sleeved jupon.

[Henrik Granlid]

Should a non-sleeved jupon be padded?

[MJBlazek]

Just so we are not getting the term "Jupon" confused, becasue I know that the term is thrown around a bit to mean a bunch of different garments.
What I reffer to as my "jupon" is a short, sleevless, form fitting, some people would call it a heraldic surcoat. It looks approximately like this:

This is not me. This is Sir Murdock here on the Archive.
I would not pad this.

[Henrik Granlid]

Ah, I was thinking of the long-sleeved, quilted jupon seen in art and effigies of the time. I Think I've found a good design for a sleeveless one as well that'll go nicely with my colours without displaying my crest yet.

And thank you for answering so many of my questions in so many different threads.

[Jan van Nyenrode]

Henrik,

The jupon you describe sounds to me like the typical jupon you see from 1370 till 1400. Could you perhaps show a picture of what you mean?

With kind regards,

Jan

[Henrik Granlid]

Aketon, my bad, but yes, probably exactly what you read from my description?




So for landing in the decades surrounding CotD, I presume it would be too late then and that a coat of arms or heraldric jupon would be better then? The more you know

[MJBlazek]

If you are going for a spot on CoTT portrayal yes. A lot of the people who take part in the deed fall in a 30 to 40 year span around the time of the Thirty.
Here are the results from a search on Manuscript Miniatures using the perameters of 1349-1353
http://manuscriptminiatures.com/search/ ... anuscript=

[Henrik Granlid]

I just got my helmet!
I'm not entirely certain on exactly where it enters into the fourteenth century, but it should be close enough, correct?
The visor, although not locked down with a historical visor swappage, can be swapped for whatever visor I'd like and on the fly too, and I have grand plans for twisted bar-grills, fencing mesh and, perhaps, should I ever find the money, a sculpted face with proper decorations on and around it.

But yes! I love it, it's just right for me, it's not 100% historical, but it's close enough! I hope I can brag with it, it IS part of my very first fighting getup ever as well, and once it's been padded and strapped (I'd love historical padding, but there's just so much work on making something you sow into a thing where you'll be sweating a LOT), and once I've done some basic maintenance (new straps, some rivets here and there) on my second hand armour, I'll present to you my starting gear, and, hopefully, it'll be nice enough for a first kit for the CotT!

My pics:

https://scontent-b-ams.xx.fbcdn.net/hph ... 6159_n.jpg

https://scontent-b-ams.xx.fbcdn.net/hph ... 7584_n.jpg

Blacksmith's pics:






Made by the amazing Martin Merkel over at Swedish Armory

[MJBlazek]

a grand start!
If you really want to stand out, make a padded liner for it!

[Henrik Granlid]

Unfortunately, I can't at the moment, it's on the plan, but for something that will see a lot of training, the padded lining not being sewn in is probably going to be quite a lot nicer after a few sweaty bouts when time comes to wash the thing.

However, come more experience and more time, there will definitely be a padded liner in all it's glory. (Right now, I am still looking at a padded liner on the inside of the aventail, but padding the cap the foamy way, just to get a quick start).


EDIT: By the by, for elbows and legs, rondels or small wings? The klappvizier and the splinted forearms and shins are all leaning toward German armour it would seem.

[MJBlazek]

If you are going for German, just doing a quick look on effigiesandbrasses.com it looks like the small wings is the way to go.

[Belemrys]

Anyone know a good CotT period Spanish effigy? Lots of German/French/English effigies in that time but not many spanish, much less with plate armor or even floating cops (lots of mail from what I see).

[Mr.Francis]

would soupcan knees WITH rondels be correct for 1351 period?

[Henrik Granlid]

Belemrys, you might want to look for frescoes or paintings rather than effigies, you could find that those have been preserved better or at least there being more of them.

Francis, I seem to recall having seen just that in some Brittish, or possibly German effigies, often with either splint or maille over the shins. But you're gonna have to look for them yourself I'm afraid, been a while since last I did proper research and I can't recall any of my proper sources from this pc.

EDIT: Disregard my globular, I have found something else I am eyeing.

A Corrazina.

How far off am I with one?