Ozark Medieval Fortress
Posted: Mon Mar 15, 2010 3:58 pm
The Armour Archive
Discussion Boards
http://forums.armourarchive.org/phpBB3/
Ozark Medieval Fortress
http://forums.armourarchive.org/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=113762
Page 1 of 2
Posted: Mon Mar 15, 2010 4:55 pm
Yeah, that's seriously stinking cool!
Posted: Mon Mar 15, 2010 5:32 pm
Wonder if they'd let us Calontirii hold a crown tourney there?
I will surely make the trip as soon as it's available.
Awesome.
I will surely make the trip as soon as it's available.
Awesome.
Posted: Mon Mar 15, 2010 6:06 pm
Volunteers
We are looking for Volunteers, Interns and Mentors.
Our goal is to remain true to the methods of 13th century medieval Occident
If you wish to share the Ozark Medieval Fortress adventure and become a part of this exciting project, taking time off from work and daily life or want to do practical training, Ozark Medieval Fortress offers options for individuals to participate for one day or more starting at age 18, and for groups.
Groups: Training courses on site for vocational training.
Teachers, trainers, instructors, educators, can come with a group of students.
No specific skills are required except a strong desire to learn and passion for this adventure.
You will have to certify you are in good health and complete our moral agreement form respecting community life rules.
It is suggested that you visit the site before deciding to participate.
You will be responsible for your own transportation, food, and lodging.
(Links for lodging, and camping choices in the area will soon be available on the website)
A small fee may be required to enroll in the program.
Our team members will be asked to be educated in or familiar with this time period, willing to interact with the public while working and producing and enthusiastic to bring this dream to life!
In order to help you decide under which categories you would like to interview, here are some detailed definitions to make your selection:
Volunteers
For a small fee, a person willing to participate as a team member learning on the job, and being placed wherever you are most needed. No specific skills are required. Enthusiasm, teamwork skills and flexibility are key.
Your own transportation is needed and you will need to find lodging in the area for your stay. (We will soon be providing links for lodging choices in the area.)
The principle idea of volunteering is the exchange between the volunteer and the professional, as well as the volunteer with the public.
A human exchange of knowledge , and culture, and teamwork. It is almost like one of those outward bound experiences. To have different people participating enriches and motivates the permanent employees, and the volunteer is enriched because he learns outside of his ordinary work environment.
The project benefits because the castle grows and that is satisfying to all who participate and watch.
Not everyone who would love to participate in such an extraordinary adventure can pick up and leave their job to come work for years. The volunteer program allows the computer operator to get out of the office for the week-end or part of their vacation and live out a fantasy.
The duration of your stay can range from 1 weekend to many days, this will be determined by your availability and our scheduling. You must be 18 years of age. Volunteers may come individually or in groups.
Interns
For a small fee, charged to the interns, you will be assigned to a professional, working side by side, perfecting your skills.
You will be asked to submit a letter identifying your reasons for wanting an internship, what you are looking to get out of the experience and your prior knowledge of the subject you are interested in expanding.
A certificate of internship will be provided upon completion. The length of stay is to be determined. You must provide your own lodging and transportation. (Links to lodging in the area will soon be posted on our website.)
We will be taking sign ups for interns once our opening team is established. Stay posted to our website for further information and updates.
Mentors
Professional artisans who will be able to use the site as a teaching environment and marketing opportunity.The length of stay is to be determined.
Please contact us immediately if you are interested in working at the site, teaching others, and selling your wares. We are actively looking for professionals in these specialties:
* illuminations: inks, dyes.
* storytelling.
* textiles: spinning, weaving, dying, tapestry.
* pottery.
* basket weaving.
* gardening.
* smithery.
* inventions.
Interviews will be starting soon for our Opening Team !!
Leave us your INFORMATION NOW and you will be contacted as early as January.
Posted: Mon Mar 15, 2010 6:23 pm
ROAD TRIP! 
I'd love to go and work on it.
I'd love to go and work on it.
Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 12:04 am
You mean I don't have to go to France to live my dream. HUZZAH.
Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 2:01 am
I've got a brother in Little Rock. Looks like its time to go visit some family!
Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 8:26 am
Damn! I wanna go volunteer! I would love to learn under the stoneworkers...
Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 9:17 am
Somebody please tell me this has been posted all over the Calontir and Glean Abhan mailing lists.
What a Fabulous opportunity.
What a Fabulous opportunity.
Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 10:56 am
I saw it originally on the Calontir mailing List.
Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 11:01 am
"The project of Ozark Medieval Fortress is remarkable because it is putting into practice 13th century work methods, techniques and tools
The primary goal of the Ozark Medieval Fortress project is to reproduce with utmost authenticity the technology used in the 13th century with the only limitation that of safety"
Say what!--- the picture of the smith has him using a modern pattern anvil and great bellows that didn't come into use in the smithy till several hundred years after their century! Two items that would be Cheap and Easy to do in the correct method for the century they are aiming at! (and easily researched too...) Hopefully they can clean this up before they start misleading people.
Thomas who's doing a smithing demo with Y1K set up for the local ABANA affiliate---charcoal forge, twin single action bellows, square "lump" anvil, tongs that are good from roman times through now, etc.
The primary goal of the Ozark Medieval Fortress project is to reproduce with utmost authenticity the technology used in the 13th century with the only limitation that of safety"
Say what!--- the picture of the smith has him using a modern pattern anvil and great bellows that didn't come into use in the smithy till several hundred years after their century! Two items that would be Cheap and Easy to do in the correct method for the century they are aiming at! (and easily researched too...) Hopefully they can clean this up before they start misleading people.
Thomas who's doing a smithing demo with Y1K set up for the local ABANA affiliate---charcoal forge, twin single action bellows, square "lump" anvil, tongs that are good from roman times through now, etc.
Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 12:59 pm
Thomas Powers wrote:SNIP
Say what!--SNIP
Thomas who's doing a smithing demo with Y1K set up for the local ABANA affiliate---charcoal forge, twin single action bellows, square "lump" anvil, tongs that are good from roman times through now, etc.
Sounds like you've just volunteered to write to them and offer to be one of their Smithcraft think tank.
Seriously, you should. It might be something they are working towards, or It may just be that they are not aware, and would be delighted to hear from you.
They are specifically asking for a blackmith in their Volunteers section
http://ozarkmedievalfortress.com/en-us/ ... g-artisans
Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 2:15 pm
Volunteers
We are looking for Volunteers, Interns and Mentors.
Our goal is to remain true to the methods of 13th century medieval Occident
I guess my opportunities are limited to usury
Groups: Training courses on site for vocational training.
Come out the inner city to learn skills thoroughly irrelevant to you getting any sort of job?
No specific skills are required except a strong desire to learn and passion for this adventure...
You will be responsible for your own transportation, food, and lodging.
...
A small fee may be required to enroll in the program.
...
Volunteers
For a small fee ...Your own transportation is needed and you will need to find lodging
Interns
For a small fee, charged to the interns, ...You must provide your own lodging and transportation.
Mentors
Professional artisans who will be able to use the site as a teaching environment and marketing opportunity....
* illuminations: inks, dyes.
* storytelling.
* textiles: spinning, weaving, dying, tapestry.
* pottery.
* basket weaving.
* gardening.
* smithery.
* inventions.
Its a Renn faire.
Hopefuly a better one than others - but...
Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 2:51 pm
Norman wrote:SNIP
Its a Renn faire.
Hopefuly a better one than others - but...
Norman, Have you looked at the website?
Have you looked at the French Sister project?
http://www.guedelon.fr/en/the-guedelon- ... re_01.html
Certainly, they are operating as a commercial proposition, but they are a long way removed from a renn Faire. Building a Castle, (Which is undoubtably what they are doing) takes money, but they have a successful model to follow.
The French project has been running since 1998, now employs 45 people, and is self funding, as far as I can see.
They appear to be on the same timetable, Open to the Public one year after breaking ground, and twelve years on the French site is looking great.
Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 4:01 pm
This is definitely not a renfair but I think it will definitely be an uphill battle for success. If it is able to capitalize on Branson, MO it might have a chance. It will be interesting to see.
Posted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 4:11 pm
Actually I have been asked to participate in several such endeavors; most of which never got off the ground. Many of which consisted of volunteering substantial amounts of time and money for something that would be the property of someone else.
One not too far from that location was the NW AR hill farm of an SCA member who invited us to build a castle there gratis; unfortunately she was in her 60's and the land would go to her children in California when she died *along* *with* any structures on it. She would not agree to any form of folks getting ownership of what they built. Sad as it was a lovely spot with wood water and stone aplenty to build with.
Unfortunately I am old enough to remember communes and the issues they had; especially WRT how do you divide assets upon their dissolution; most I knew of people who had donated years of their life and their income ended up with nothing. So I am a bit gun shy.
I'll have to stop by and visit if I can on the way to the Annual Blacksmithing Conference in OH in late September and ask my kinfolk in AR if they have heard about it. Shoot I may even send them a copy of "Cathedral Forge and Waterwheel" to provide some better examples for their smithy!
Thomas.
One not too far from that location was the NW AR hill farm of an SCA member who invited us to build a castle there gratis; unfortunately she was in her 60's and the land would go to her children in California when she died *along* *with* any structures on it. She would not agree to any form of folks getting ownership of what they built. Sad as it was a lovely spot with wood water and stone aplenty to build with.
Unfortunately I am old enough to remember communes and the issues they had; especially WRT how do you divide assets upon their dissolution; most I knew of people who had donated years of their life and their income ended up with nothing. So I am a bit gun shy.
I'll have to stop by and visit if I can on the way to the Annual Blacksmithing Conference in OH in late September and ask my kinfolk in AR if they have heard about it. Shoot I may even send them a copy of "Cathedral Forge and Waterwheel" to provide some better examples for their smithy!
Thomas.
Posted: Sat Mar 20, 2010 6:43 pm
This sounds extremely cool, but something about it is making my BS detector go off.
I dont have any concrete reason, but something feels hinky...
Anyone else?
I dont have any concrete reason, but something feels hinky...
Anyone else?
Posted: Sat Mar 20, 2010 8:59 pm
I don't think there is anything hinky going on.
I think this is like most other dreams of doing such things except that someone has put the initial money in to it in order to get it off the ground.
That is the easy part. At some point the site will have to stop bleeding money and at least create some sort of equilibrium and I have really serious questions if that site where it is an how it is conceived can do that. That isn't hinky its just a questionable business decision.
I think this is like most other dreams of doing such things except that someone has put the initial money in to it in order to get it off the ground.
That is the easy part. At some point the site will have to stop bleeding money and at least create some sort of equilibrium and I have really serious questions if that site where it is an how it is conceived can do that. That isn't hinky its just a questionable business decision.
Posted: Sat Mar 20, 2010 10:21 pm
Cool project, pity about the location though.
-Derian.
-Derian.
Posted: Sun Mar 21, 2010 10:31 am
Piers Brent wrote:I don't think there is anything hinky going on.
I think this is like most other dreams of doing such things except that someone has put the initial money in to it in order to get it off the ground.
That is the easy part. At some point the site will have to stop bleeding money and at least create some sort of equilibrium and I have really serious questions if that site where it is an how it is conceived can do that. That isn't hinky its just a questionable business decision.
Kinda the direction I was thinking. I didnt mean to say there was anything underhanded going on, just not well thought out.
With proper funding this project should be a 5 year deal at most I would think. heck in a few years I may be in the position to buy a half build castly in Arkansas =)
Posted: Sun Mar 21, 2010 9:33 pm
The world is littered with unfinished sailing ships and broken dreams. The Panama Canal is cluttered with sailboats for sale from folks who were going to sail around the world and only got as far as Panama before reality or fatigue or monetary or family/companion problems set in.
Grand and ambitious projects occasionally come off, and bring a little joy to my skeptical old heart; but those that do usually come about either through good and solid organization and leadership, independent wealth, or a level of devotion bordering on a total commitment of heart, time and money. Sometimes these, or a combination of these, will work; and sometimes all of these together will fail.
And then, sometimes, getting it built is the easy part; keeping it running, the management of people, budgets, activities, repair and maintenance, and dozens of different details needed to keep a "Grand Project" going, is the really hard part. Is there a clear goal beyond getting the d@mn thing built? What happens when key people leave, or change their minds, or want to change the goal? Is it adaptation, or hijacking the "dream"?
I like the concept of the castle; I'd love to see it completed and visit it. But, were I near enough to get involved, I'd look things over very carefully before I invested my time and treasure in any grand project; the grander the project, the higher my caution.
Grand and ambitious projects occasionally come off, and bring a little joy to my skeptical old heart; but those that do usually come about either through good and solid organization and leadership, independent wealth, or a level of devotion bordering on a total commitment of heart, time and money. Sometimes these, or a combination of these, will work; and sometimes all of these together will fail.
And then, sometimes, getting it built is the easy part; keeping it running, the management of people, budgets, activities, repair and maintenance, and dozens of different details needed to keep a "Grand Project" going, is the really hard part. Is there a clear goal beyond getting the d@mn thing built? What happens when key people leave, or change their minds, or want to change the goal? Is it adaptation, or hijacking the "dream"?
I like the concept of the castle; I'd love to see it completed and visit it. But, were I near enough to get involved, I'd look things over very carefully before I invested my time and treasure in any grand project; the grander the project, the higher my caution.
Posted: Sun Mar 21, 2010 9:42 pm
heh. smithery is a weird word for 'blacksmithing'.
Posted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 11:41 am
Cap'n Atli wrote:
I like the concept of the castle; I'd love to see it completed and visit it. But, were I near enough to get involved, I'd look things over very carefully before I invested my time and treasure in any grand project; the grander the project, the higher my caution.
Yep, the only way to make this really work is to undertake the project on land that you own and have full control over.
The minute you let anyone else call any of the shots your fucked.
In my experience what starts out as a LH dream has full potential to end up one turkey leg booth short of a ren faire.
Posted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 11:50 am
Malachiuri wrote:This sounds extremely cool, but something about it is making my BS detector go off.
I dont have any concrete reason, but something feels hinky...
Anyone else?
Yeah. "for a small fee" my ass. If you want work done, then you don't CHARGE me for the PRIVELEGE of doing work you would otherwise have to PAY SOMEONE TO DO.
Posted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 11:57 am
Honestly I think these folks are fooling themselves if they think folks will pay for the privelage to do back breaking work.
In the years that I ran the Norstead project I was flooded with folks that wanted to help, needed to help, would kill to help, would sell their first born to be able to help, etc.
MANY of these folks were within just a couple hours of the site
The largest work crew we ever had was less than a dozen folks one weekend.
Most folks who offered to assist (save some good friends in the SCA) never even saw the site before I left the project.
What folks aim to do, and what folks actually do is entirely different. (FWIW the same thing happened when we bought the Fyrdraca way back when)
What was done there was done mostly on the backs of 3-4 dependable people in the time that I was involved.
In the years that I ran the Norstead project I was flooded with folks that wanted to help, needed to help, would kill to help, would sell their first born to be able to help, etc.
MANY of these folks were within just a couple hours of the site
The largest work crew we ever had was less than a dozen folks one weekend.
Most folks who offered to assist (save some good friends in the SCA) never even saw the site before I left the project.
What folks aim to do, and what folks actually do is entirely different. (FWIW the same thing happened when we bought the Fyrdraca way back when)
What was done there was done mostly on the backs of 3-4 dependable people in the time that I was involved.
Posted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 12:14 pm
Hmm I seem to be able to recognize who has experience with such ventures from their postings...and yet we all wish them well anyway!
Thomas
Thomas
Posted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 4:47 pm
In re: pay to play -
SCA event this Saturday in NJ.
Site fee: $12
Dinner: $10
Fuel for me: $25
Tolls: $5
Clothing to my historical standard: ~$500, including shoes and other accoutrements.
All so I can volunteer to be on my feet all day and bust my ass being a sentient public-address system while displaying my latest metalworking project before doing blah blah blah.
Another: Volunteer weekend at Pennsbury Manor, the replicated homestead of William Penn in America.
Fuel/food/etc.: $~50 per day
Clothing: Again, ~$500 per outfit
interpretation supplies: Who freakin' knows?
All so I can volunteer to do things like shovel crap out of the barn, mow hay with a scythe, repair split-rail fence, and exhaust myself in the brewhouse.
Now, these are not exact parallels - the SCA group organizing the event is not technically a for-profit entity, though they will undoubtedly do quite a bit better than break-even, and Pennsbury Manor is run by the Commonwealth of PA museum system.
It is to illustrate to all you "pay to play" nay-sayers that it's a matter of perspective. Me, I'm seriously considering taking some time while I'm vaguely in the area of the castle for Lilies to stop and pitch in a bit.
How often do you get to say, "Guess what I did this weekend? I hauled stone for an honest-to-Gawd medieval castle!"? Some folks would - and do - pay for that privilege.
Anyway, that's my tuppence.
Bob
SCA event this Saturday in NJ.
Site fee: $12
Dinner: $10
Fuel for me: $25
Tolls: $5
Clothing to my historical standard: ~$500, including shoes and other accoutrements.
All so I can volunteer to be on my feet all day and bust my ass being a sentient public-address system while displaying my latest metalworking project before doing blah blah blah.
Another: Volunteer weekend at Pennsbury Manor, the replicated homestead of William Penn in America.
Fuel/food/etc.: $~50 per day
Clothing: Again, ~$500 per outfit
interpretation supplies: Who freakin' knows?
All so I can volunteer to do things like shovel crap out of the barn, mow hay with a scythe, repair split-rail fence, and exhaust myself in the brewhouse.
Now, these are not exact parallels - the SCA group organizing the event is not technically a for-profit entity, though they will undoubtedly do quite a bit better than break-even, and Pennsbury Manor is run by the Commonwealth of PA museum system.
It is to illustrate to all you "pay to play" nay-sayers that it's a matter of perspective. Me, I'm seriously considering taking some time while I'm vaguely in the area of the castle for Lilies to stop and pitch in a bit.
How often do you get to say, "Guess what I did this weekend? I hauled stone for an honest-to-Gawd medieval castle!"? Some folks would - and do - pay for that privilege.
Anyway, that's my tuppence.
Bob
Posted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 4:49 pm
Yeah, I get what you are saying, Bob, and for some that might be the draw.
But I also think that when I "pay to play" in the SCA any net proceeds go back into my local group.
WHen I "pay to play" there, any net proceeds go into their pockets. And they end up with an improved site, that I "paid" for the privelege of improving.
Not saying it's not for some folks.. but it's definately not for me.
I'll happily VOLUNTEER.. but the term "volunteer" doesn't mean "you pay us to work", to me.
But I also think that when I "pay to play" in the SCA any net proceeds go back into my local group.
WHen I "pay to play" there, any net proceeds go into their pockets. And they end up with an improved site, that I "paid" for the privelege of improving.
Not saying it's not for some folks.. but it's definately not for me.
I'll happily VOLUNTEER.. but the term "volunteer" doesn't mean "you pay us to work", to me.
Posted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 4:55 pm
now if your volunteer hours counted toward a discount on using the site later; that would make a lot more sense!
Thomas
Thomas
Posted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 5:08 pm
Thomas Powers wrote:now if your volunteer hours counted toward a discount on using the site later; that would make a lot more sense!
Thomas
Yup.
I don't mind volunteering.. it's a give and take. I mind paying AND volunteering, you know?
(And I've built enough rock walls, dug enough ditches, and made enough berms, that I don't need "that experience". hell, if I want to point stone walls, I can start in my living room...)
Posted: Tue May 04, 2010 6:59 pm
One of our locals, Michael Bettes, leaves tomorrow for the Ozarks. He got the job as the castle's blacksmith. He's been blacksmithing at Cowtown here in Wichita for a number of years.
Posted: Tue May 04, 2010 8:36 pm
Baron Alcyoneus wrote:One of our locals, Michael Bettes, leaves tomorrow for the Ozarks. He got the job as the castle's blacksmith. He's been blacksmithing at Cowtown here in Wichita for a number of years.
So, is he going to report back to you with the straight dope on how the project is going? What works and what doesn't? Levels of participation? Interesting projects and ironwork?
That would be both fun and informative.
Posted: Tue May 04, 2010 9:24 pm
I hope so. It isn't that far from Branson MO(35mi), so if I happen to be down that way...
He did say that he found a design for an English chisel, that swells a bit in the palm, and thought it might be fun to make some of those for the French stone mason to use...
It isn't that far from Branson MO(35mi), so if I happen to be down that way...
He did say that he found a design for an English chisel, that swells a bit in the palm, and thought it might be fun to make some of those for the French stone mason to use...
Posted: Wed May 05, 2010 12:40 am
Baron Alcyoneus wrote:One of our locals, Michael Bettes, leaves tomorrow for the Ozarks. He got the job as the castle's blacksmith. He's been blacksmithing at Cowtown here in Wichita for a number of years.
Good luck to him. I was offered a job about a month ago and had to pass. $10 an hour and 4 days a week I thought was a little umm humerous.
What they told me is they are mainly wanting someone to make tools they cant find. And thats what i'd realy be "demonstraiting".
Posted: Wed May 05, 2010 10:33 am
Wow neat concept. So does it actually say what they charge people to work there? Maybe they provide lunch? 
It looks like a great venture and something that we could use over here. It was so awesome to do reenactment around castles and such. Really adds to the feel of it. Even if it is a modern build the look is good so I can see this becoming a nice venue for the SCA and other reenactment groups, if they'd allow such activities there.
RPM
It looks like a great venture and something that we could use over here. It was so awesome to do reenactment around castles and such. Really adds to the feel of it. Even if it is a modern build the look is good so I can see this becoming a nice venue for the SCA and other reenactment groups, if they'd allow such activities there.
RPM