I am starting a progress thread for creating a scabbard for my roundel dagger.
There are extant roundel scabbards and many many effigies and brasses with men wearing a roundel in a scabbard and in every case the scabbard has a cup that comes up over the lower part of the handle. Rarely do you see a reproductions with a proper scabbard but I helps Ian LaSpina make one for his roundel and decided to try making another for my dagger.
Here is the results of the initial wet forming. Pictured next to reference material:
Tonight I hope to do the decoration and get it all trimmed up properly.
Last edited by James B. on Thu Jul 17, 2014 8:10 am, edited 1 time in total.
I decided to harden the leather last night using the House of the Wolf technique. Soak the leather and bake at 180. Worked like a charm. Here is what it looked like this morning:
The cup of the sheath is much stiffer now after bake hardening it. It should hold up much better than if I did nothing.
I made one a couple weeks ago after seeing Ian's project. To shape the cup, I cut a wooden disc with a hole saw. Next time I do one, I want to line it with skiver like the MoL sheath.
Did not work on the rondel dagger scabbard last night, I did work on a bollocks dagger scabbard for another La Belle member. Edric the Potter will likely be wearing this one at Pennsic:
Nice James!
What tool did you use for the decoration? I am working on belts at this point ( thread in design and construction), I haven't gotten past the test strip stage yet...
I saw the belt thread your samples are looking good.
I used a ruler and stylus for this work, just pressed in will the leather is cased. I used the spoon side to slightly bevel around the beast on the rondel scabbard.
James. Thank you very much. Do the impressions made with the stylus stay sharp after you harden them? My concern with doing it on belts is that they won't stay as long. If I spend as much time as I think I need to on the designs, I hate to see them go away after a few wearings.
I have done this in the past with blades but the wrap makes the scabbard loose and I want a super tight fit so they don't slip out if turned over. I have had no issue with damage to any of the blades I have done this with. I have made a dozen knife sheaths and this week alone I have made 4 dagger sheaths.
Last edited by James B. on Mon Jul 21, 2014 11:21 am, edited 1 time in total.
Johann Lederer wrote:James. Thank you very much. Do the impressions made with the stylus stay sharp after you harden them? My concern with doing it on belts is that they won't stay as long. If I spend as much time as I think I need to on the designs, I hate to see them go away after a few wearings.
They remain as sharp as you see. its not the same as cutting or cutting and tooling but it does not fade out even if wet that I have seen anyway.
Gregoire de Lyon wrote:Gorgeous! These are single layers of leather?
In these cases yes. I have found out since starting the rondel dagger sheath there was a second layer so I may make another in the near future. I am working on a 2 layer sheath for another dagger now. I will have pictures up soon. I overlapped the thin layer slightly and skived the edges to lay flat and glued it like historic examples.
These are extremely well-made, James. Beautiful silhouette. The cup on the scabbard of the rondel is new to me; I hadn't seen that before this thread. Perhaps I hadn't looked hard enough. Are the decorations of your own invention, an extrapolation of extant designs, or a mimic of a surviving example?
"There is a tremendous amount of information in a picture, but getting at it is not a purely passive process. You have to work at it, but the more you work at it the easier it becomes." - Mac
Keegan Ingrassia wrote:These are extremely well-made, James. Beautiful silhouette. The cup on the scabbard of the rondel is new to me; I hadn't seen that before this thread. Perhaps I hadn't looked hard enough. Are the decorations of your own invention, an extrapolation of extant designs, or a mimic of a surviving example?
There are only a few extant examples of these sheaths; one is in Knives and scabbards at the end. The decoration is a combination of elements from historic examples on knives; in this case all early 15th century.
Jasper I will get a photo of the back seam up. The blade is a triangle so it not a flesh or grain edge stitch, its stitched straight through the overlap.
First before starting orientation of your leather is important. The leather stretches more in the direction of foot to spine so you want that to be the sides of your cut patter and your top bottom aimed head to ass on the hide. This holds true with belts and shoes, belts need to run head to ass and toes need to aim either direction on a shoe pattern.
1) For a rondel scabbard cut out a large piece of leather than can accommodate the cup diameter
2) For a flat/diamond blade shape you can mock up a paper patter first if you want grain edge butted seems. Simply make the paper edges butt together. Take that pattern and add 1mm to the edges to accommodate the leather thickness. You can also pre-punch these holes with an awl before wet forming
3)Work the leather wet over the blade. You must pull all the slack out of the leather for a tight fit. For the rondel I have an overlap seem not a grain edge butted seem so simply pull tight, punch, and sew as you go along. In this case I stated at the bottom working up to the cup. The cup leather was folded back towards the blade to keep it from deforming while working it.
4) When I got to the cup I created the seem under the roundel first then smoothed the leather with a cup stylus for leather working, then pulled the leather tight to make a straight cup standing up.
5) Trim the work as needed.
6) I decorated with the blade in the piece while the leather was still cased (damp but close to dry).
7) For the rondel I soaked it again and hardened in the oven at 180 degrees, checking the work every 20 minutes. I started with an empty scabbard on a rack but as it was drying out I put the dagger in it to hole the shape. Bake as long as you can, the dryer it gets the more hard tit becomes. Don't over due it or it will crack. I do not harden the other scabbards, I only did it this time because of the cup.
