I want to learn more about Polypropylene swords!

[Corby de la Flamme]

You didn't narrow the rod any... right?

That's correct.

The cuts run toward the hilt, from the tip. They extend about 8-10 inches down, and are only as wide as the kerf of the saw blade.

[Christophe de Frisselle]

Did you retape it at all?

Don't seem to be tested out this way...

[Corby de la Flamme]

Retape?

Sure, I think. Can't imagine how tape would affect the safety of it.

[Sir Omarad]

Lengthwise cuts to remove some material. You can see them in cross section in this picture.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/14778685@N ... otostream/

We have been testing one that has similar cuts. They where made using a table saw set to ¼” depth. The cuts where made up the length of the blade on the flats, and stopping before the hilt. The diameter still measured over 1.25”. The result was lighter weight and better balance. My squire has been using it at practice for about four months. So far we have not seen any negative effects.

I am behind on my reporting. I will endeavor to fix that in the next few weeks. They are becoming fairly common in Caid. As far as I know no one has declined to fight against them in tournament. When it comes to crown, we all go back to rattan for the high end power, Just incase we need it

Patrick, Caid

Get me a report on that with a description of the cuts whenever you can.
Thanks.

[Corby de la Flamme]

I think I'll strip off the tape this weekend and take more pictures of the bare rod. By the way, those pics are of exactly the same piece of poly used in the my & Amos' videos from a fight practice where I whack Matthew and then take it to a concrete filled steel pole.

A solid year of use and it is still my day-to-day sword!

[Gregoire de Lyon]

Gregoire, if you're asking about the lines in the picture that is in my first post, then I'm pretty sure those are tape fibers.

Yeah, the lines in the first picture. Tape fibers makes sense, but my mind saw stress lines and couldn't let go. Thanks!

[BdeB]

I'd love to see how these cuts are being made. I can't quite picture it yet.

[BdeB]

In that case has anyone figured out any nifty taping method to eliminate some of the wobble? I really didn't like the way it felt when I was hitting my pell. Maybe cutting one down to a 34" length would help some but any other ideas?

The only tapping suggestion I think would help with the vibration would be to thin down your handle and wrap it with tennis grip tape. That should cut down on the vibration felt in the hand some.

[Baron Eirik]

The cuts run toward the hilt, from the tip. They extend about 8-10 inches down, and are only as wide as the kerf of the saw blade.

I'd love to see how these cuts are being made. I can't quite picture it yet.

If I am reading it correctly, picture skinny fullers running for 8-10 inches from the tip to reduce mass in the tip.

[Samuel]

Years ago ( 98-00) time frame Sir Haroun here in the Outlands was using this exact stuff at practice as a test sword. ( giving full warning to what it was)

His sword, if memory serves, was about 32-34 inches long and was hands down the hardest Ive ever been hit. on a helm it was enough to rattle you well but legs was where it REALLY put the spank on ya. the density of it made it handle like a glue filled stick of rattan with a layer of lead hammered around it. Most hard shots on my cuisse would leave minor stings, this stick would leave deep tissue bruising.

( cuise I wore where 12-15 oz waz hardend leather with 6-7 oz leather riveted over top)

[Sir Omarad]

Years ago ( 98-00) time frame Sir Haroun here in the Outlands was using this exact stuff at practice as a test sword. ( giving full warning to what it was)

His sword, if memory serves, was about 32-34 inches long and was hands down the hardest Ive ever been hit. on a helm it was enough to rattle you well but legs was where it REALLY put the spank on ya. the density of it made it handle like a glue filled stick of rattan with a layer of lead hammered around it. Most hard shots on my cuisse would leave minor stings, this stick would leave deep tissue bruising.

( cuise I wore where 12-15 oz waz hardend leather with 6-7 oz leather riveted over top)

I seriously doubt it was the same stuff.
there were guys trying out NYLON at that time but it was waaaay too dense and inflexible.

That experiment is why some were instantly fearful of the polypropylene experiment.
totally different material completely.

[Corby de la Flamme]

I'd love to see how these cuts are being made. I can't quite picture it yet.

I took a sawzall/reciprocating saw with a long blade, and put it at the tip pointing toward the guard.

[Corby de la Flamme]

Sadly, looks like I won't get to see how my poly sword holds up for the second year of use.

It seems to have been lost at our Thursday practice about 3 weeks ago. I've asked all around, checked everywhere it could be, no sign of it anywhere.

A shame, it not only had lots of life left in it, but it also had a very nice, irreplaceable basket hilt made by my good friend Master Robear. Yes, a basket hilt made by a cooking Laurel!

[Corby de la Flamme]

Found it!

As the saying goes "if it had been a snake, it would have bitten me."

[Corby de la Flamme]

At practice last night, my squire Philip pulled out a plastic rod he got from McMaster Carr. He thinks he ordered the right stuff.

It feels about the same as mine--though his isn't in a basket hilt yet so hard to really compare

It hits about the same as mine--again hard to compare: no basket.

It looks about the same, with one difference: It is entirely black instead of the white I've always seen.

Now, Philip is going to check the order details to see if he did get the right stuff, but until then, has anyone seen the proper material in black instead of white?

[bigfredb]

You didn't narrow the rod any... right?

That's correct.

The cuts run toward the hilt, from the tip. They extend about 8-10 inches down, and are only as wide as the kerf of the saw blade.

Please, can you post some pictures of the sword and the cut you made?

[Sir Omarad]

black, white, and natural are the common colors.

[Count Johnathan]

This is the main issue I have with the poly swords. Rattan is easy to see if it's the right material. With the poly it seems the only way for us to check is after it breaks. I fear that the manufacturers or distributers are willing to just send whatever they have on hand to random buyers. I am sure they would send the right materials to an industrial manufacturer who needed it but I pretty much had the same thing happen (I assume). Patrick posted the link where he bought his. I clicked on the link and ordered the exact same thing and poof the stick I received shattered the first time I fought with it. Obviously not the same material but no way to check it until it's too late really. Money wasted.

That is bothersome.

[uwhguy]

Hmmm. If you can get it in black or white, can you get make it in black and white with a preexisting striking edge? that would be cool!

[Sir Omarad]

Hmmm. If you can get it in black or white, can you get make it in black and white with a preexisting striking edge? that would be cool!

You must tape it anyway.

[Sir Omarad]

This is the main issue I have with the poly swords. Rattan is easy to see if it's the right material. With the poly it seems the only way for us to check is after it breaks. I fear that the manufacturers or distributers are willing to just send whatever they have on hand to random buyers. I am sure they would send the right materials to an industrial manufacturer who needed it but I pretty much had the same thing happen (I assume). Patrick posted the link where he bought his. I clicked on the link and ordered the exact same thing and poof the stick I received shattered the first time I fought with it. Obviously not the same material but no way to check it until it's too late really. Money wasted.

That is bothersome.

Yours is the only one from the hundreds that are out there that this happened to.
Either there was a flow line or bubbles in the material or they made a mistake and sent you the wrong material.
Luckily it hasn't happened since.
There is only one standard of polypropylene rod.
No grades, no weird industrial standards, etc...
If a marshal or fighter is familiar with the material is is fairly easy to notice if it's the right stuff.

[BdeB]

Hmmm. If you can get it in black or white, can you get make it in black and white with a preexisting striking edge? that would be cool!

You must tape it anyway.

Personally, besides marking an edge, i'm not sure this is really neccessary based on my experiments with the material so far. None the less mine has tape and some strapping tape (which I feel is REALLY over kill because of the weight of the thing, but does make it easier to get the scraps of duct tape off when it is time to retape it.)

[Woeg]

So out of honest curiousity (I've no idea how experimental weapons work), how long will these swords be experimental, before they become acceptable for common use? I'm just curious - this is the first experimental weapon phase that I've ever paid closer attention to.

Thanks!

[Sir Omarad]

So out of honest curiousity (I've no idea how experimental weapons work), how long will these swords be experimental, before they become acceptable for common use? I'm just curious - this is the first experimental weapon phase that I've ever paid closer attention to.

Thanks!

Depends on the data and the number of Kingdoms participating.

Not before Pennsic.

[Count Johnathan]

Yours is the only one from the hundreds that are out there that this happened to.
Either there was a flow line or bubbles in the material or they made a mistake and sent you the wrong material.
Luckily it hasn't happened since.
There is only one standard of polypropylene rod.
No grades, no weird industrial standards, etc...
If a marshal or fighter is familiar with the material is is fairly easy to notice if it's the right stuff.

Uhh ok how about Corbys squire Philip who pulled out a plastic rod he got from McMaster Carr that just happens to be black?

Is that the right stuff?

The marshal being able to check the material is the more serious issue but wasting money is also sucky.

[Sir Omarad]

Yours is the only one from the hundreds that are out there that this happened to.
Either there was a flow line or bubbles in the material or they made a mistake and sent you the wrong material.
Luckily it hasn't happened since.
There is only one standard of polypropylene rod.
No grades, no weird industrial standards, etc...
If a marshal or fighter is familiar with the material is is fairly easy to notice if it's the right stuff.

Uhh ok how about Corbys squire Philip who pulled out a plastic rod he got from McMaster Carr that just happens to be black?

Is that the right stuff?

The marshal being able to check the material is the more serious issue but wasting money is also sucky.

Yes, wasting money sucks. Email the manufacturer and see if you can get your money back.
Nothing we can do for you here.
I already posted that white, black, and natural are common colors.
For most applications you get natural because it's cheapest but in a pinch they will sell you whatever color they have in stock unless you specify a specific color when you buy.
Usually in the small print it says they will substitute color unless you specify.
Ods are 99 to 1 that it is fine, but always check the invoice.
I always buy through Brast. Those guys are great.

[Aaron]

Would it be possible to use polypropylene (siloflex?) hafts for pollaxes?

-Aaron

[Baron Eirik]

Polypropylene is distinctly different from siloflex(polyethylene) pipe.

As I understand it, polypropylene is only being tested for single-handed swords for now.

Siloflex has only ever been allowed for single-handed swords.

[Aaron]

Bummer. It would be nice to have more durablity for the weapons I use.

[Count Johnathan]

Would it be possible to use polypropylene (siloflex?) hafts for pollaxes?

-Aaron

I think you would find it to be a bit to flexible for that use. The longer the stick the greater the flex and the higher the vibration in the hands. Plastics are funny that way.

[Gregoire de Lyon]

Would it be possible to use polypropylene (siloflex?) hafts for pollaxes?

If you think you have problems getting people to take your shots now, try putting the foam heads on the end of polypro...

The stuff bends like crazy. I can't get people to take shots from my 36" sword if the blow lands in the last six inches of the baton.


Also, as Baron Eirik says, the experiment is for single handed swords only.

[Aaron]

Good points. I'd be back to flyfishing.

[Sir Omarad]

single hand swords only.

[Corby de la Flamme]

It just won't work for great weapons.

This stuff is slightly more flexible. And it is slightly heavier. In a 36" length, those characteristics balance out. On a 6' length, it would be a very heavy pool noodle.

And on the other hand, the piece of rattan I used this week to make my "new" axe Eleanor is easily 15 years old. Buy good rattan, don't make a plain stick of a polearm, and your long rattan will last longer than your joints.

[Christophe de Frisselle]

This was the sticker on the 3' piece I got from McMaster-Carr:
http://on.fb.me/kp5apz

Abit wonky in a basket hilt. Then again I haven't used a basket hilt since I was in loaner in the mid-nineties and find it a bit odd. It had a good bit of flex if a blow landed in the right spot on it. I cut about an inch and a half off then put my IronMonger crosshilt on it. Helped alot with the flex and is not much heavier than my normal rattan swords.