The Armour Archive

Hi,

My kids and their friends were playing with the nerf firearms in the backyard.

"I got you!!" x 100, at high volumes.

"Did not!!" x 100, at high volumes, often as nerf darts bounced off their face.

Eventually the two groups marched off in a huff.


It was interesting to see that active marshalling and rhinohiding are universal, and so are perceptions. But compared to kids, we in the SCA are doing pretty well IMO. Limited screaming and tantrums and obvious cheating.

I remember when we didn't have anything that fired other than blanks. The honor system usually worked because half of us were good at doing hollywood deaths. We were spectacular at dying in the streets and that was part of the fun.

Sure some kids were "rhinos" but when we got a little older and used BB guns , that stopped real damn quick. Funny (not so funny) thing was, the kid who NEVER died when we played "war" when it was cap guns. Got his front teeth shot out through his lip when we moved up to bb guns bottle rockets and roman candles. M80's packed in dried mud balls made nice grenades as well. Damn we were stupid.

Man that was interesting trying to come up with a lie to tell his mom and dad. I think the story ended up being that we were playing at a constructions site (still dumb) and he fell on a board with a nail in it. Almost worked until the Dentist saw the bb jammed up in his bone on the Xray.

Sad thing now is, I NEVER see kids playing war like when I was a kid. Back then the whole neighborhood watched Saturday war movies like the Longest Day and a Bridge Too Far, then killed each other for 8 hours nonstop. Even when travelling and camping. Me and my bro bought our arsenal with us. And as always, so did every other kid in the campground.

Now a days the hippified granola munching parents would have the swat team called in.

Aaron, I am jealous. I wish my kids were still playing "war" They are a little bit older now and last time I tried to play stuff (airsoft) like that with them. My son and his "team" totally destroyed my old ass at airsoft. They figured since I was a vet, I would be a hard kill. Turns out real combat skills dont work well in a a game where dying is not a concern. I was wasting my time looking for real cover that would stop 7.62x39, not 6m plastic.

Yep. Half the fun was out-dying everyone else! Falling off a stump whilst screaming bloody murder was always fun.

Does paintball count as playing war?

Aaron wrote:Hi,

My kids and their friends were playing with the nerf firearms in the backyard.

"I got you!!" x 100, at high volumes.

"Did not!!" x 100, at high volumes, often as nerf darts bounced off their face.

Eventually the two groups marched off in a huff.


It was interesting to see that active marshalling and rhinohiding are universal, and so are perceptions. But compared to kids, we in the SCA are doing pretty well IMO. Limited screaming and tantrums and obvious cheating.

The situation you describe is what I would consider without active marshaling. IMHO, when someone refers to active marshalling, I assume there is *some* type of 3rd party referee not participating in the combat.

Plenty of SCA fighters do the same using their inside voice while on the field and some then gripe about it later, except in some wars, where I've heard the same dialog plenty of times.

JvR wrote:Sad thing now is, I NEVER see kids playing war like when I was a kid. Back then the whole neighborhood watched Saturday war movies like the Longest Day and a Bridge Too Far, then killed each other for 8 hours nonstop. Even when travelling and camping. Me and my bro bought our arsenal with us. And as always, so did every other kid in the campground.

They're still playing war, it's just electronic now. My girl's 12 year old nephew kicks my butt at Call of Duty. You'rew right though, it's sad kids don't play outside more. For me it was sticks as swords (my how things have changed for me, lol).

I've always was of the train of thought that if it is sad the kids aren't playing outside make em. I mean we have the control. My mom was always, unplugging the TV and stating I had two choices, pick up a rag/mop/vacuum/toilet brush, or go outside and play with my friends.

AHHH, for the good old days when we shot bottle rockets at each other and hid behind trash can lids

Stephen

I used to have this nasty recurring dream: I am in a firefight; everyone else has real weapons, but I have a toy, which I point at people while yelling "Bang!", then I yell at them that I just shot them and they have to fall down, which is how all of my childhood cap gun fights always played out.

JvR wrote:Almost worked until the Dentist saw the bb jammed up in his bone on the Xray.

We were smart enough to use metal window screening (all they had at the time) wrapped around the front of our ball caps.

Face shots didn't count.

Falcone

Aaron wrote:Hi,

My kids and their friends were playing with the nerf firearms in the backyard.

"I got you!!" x 100, at high volumes.

"Did not!!" x 100, at high volumes, often as nerf darts bounced off their face.

Eventually the two groups marched off in a huff.


It was interesting to see that active marshalling and rhinohiding are universal, and so are perceptions. But compared to kids, we in the SCA are doing pretty well IMO. Limited screaming and tantrums and obvious cheating.

It is because we are taught, as a society, from a very young age that LOSING is the WORSE thing you could ever do. If you are a LOSER you are worth NOTHING. Only WINNERS are. So we will find ways to always be that winner. No Matter how much it blackens us.

MJBlazek wrote:
It is because we are taught, as a society, from a very young age that LOSING is the WORSE thing you could ever do. If you are a LOSER you are worth NOTHING. Only WINNERS are. So we will find ways to always be that winner. No Matter how much it blackens us.

My son, 6, is like this. I am not sure where it came from, but he is incredibly competitive and cannot stand to lose a game of crazy 8s. He gets upset when I close within *1 score* in Xbox football, let alone tie him or pass him.

I apparently was such a bad sport as a child that my little sister refused to play games with me (at the time, I didn't understand why).

It's very strange and not all children are like this. It is very hard to unteach (at least at age 6), no matter how much you lead by example of not caring whether you win or lose.

I suspect there may be more than a little "nature" mixed up in the "nurture".

MJBlazek wrote:
It is because we are taught, as a society, from a very young age that LOSING is the WORSE thing you could ever do. If you are a LOSER you are worth NOTHING. Only WINNERS are. So we will find ways to always be that winner. No Matter how much it blackens us.

Its not taught. Its natural. In nature second place is first loser. Its purely and evolutionary trait. Survival depends on it in the natural order.

Second place can mean you are somethings lunch.

Perhaps.. but if it were purely nature it is a trait that would have been bred out centuries ago.

Humans have not been in danger of "being someones lunch" for quite a while.


You obviously come from the "nature" camp... I obviously come from the "nurture" camp...

I'll not turn this into a competition for who's right

Or at least let me add this..
Perhaps "Competetiveness" is an ingrained trait.

Poor Sportsmanship is something that is learned.

MJBlazek wrote:Perhaps "Competitiveness" is an ingrained trait.

Poor Sportsmanship is something that is learned.

Sounds about right to me.

It's both of course. Like anything, there are innate tendencies that are genetic/biologically based. People, being heterogeneous (literally in this case!) probably have different amounts of this innate tendency (towards hypercompetitiveness)

This can be reinforced by learning (rewarded), or suppressed (punished).

Proxus wrote:... pick up a rag/mop/vacuum/toilet brush, or go outside and play with my friends.

Only problem with that is that "play with friends" usually means going to their house and playing with their video games.

MJBlazek wrote:Perhaps.. but if it were purely nature it is a trait that would have been bred out centuries ago.

Humans have not been in danger of "being someones lunch" for quite a while.


.

Maybe not literally, but figuratively?

Who got better grades? Who went to the better school? Who is better looking/ more attractive to the opposite sex? Who interviews/schmoozes the boss better? Who gets the good job?

We compete for EVERYTHING. Losing might not mean you actually get killed and eaten, but it CAN mean you don't eat, live, or pass your genes on.

Aaron Wrote:

I was wasting my time looking for real cover that would stop 7.62x39, not 6m plastic.

I seem to have had the same problem when playing paintball and laser tag against my little brothers!

Thomas MacFinn wrote:

Proxus wrote:... pick up a rag/mop/vacuum/toilet brush, or go outside and play with my friends.

Only problem with that is that "play with friends" usually means going to their house and playing with their video games.

Until your mom calls their mom and they conspire to make you guys go outside to the park. I can't count the number of times that me and my buddies all wound up at the park playing barefoot football because our moms told us to clean or get out. LOL

My parents didn't play fair.