Combat Archery: Why is it so hated?

[St. George]

A scimitar is a waste of time weapon in the SCA, much like a Giant Hammer or super Ax. Whatever benefit the shape has in the real world is negated by SCA practice.

g-

[audax]

Option 1
Develop a thicker skin.

Option 2
Stop caring

Option 3
Wait 5-10 minutes before responding to a post you found "insulting"

The option you picked
Out of those posting here (numbers roughly made up)
50% of the people thought there were problems with CA that could be fixed
25% disliked CA, of that 10% outright insulted it.
25% thought everything was just fine or that the problems were not worth trying to fix
So, in attempting to fire back upon 10% of the archive population you ended up insulting 90% of us.

I will admit, my first impulse was to express my desire to pop your head like an overripe melon. However, since you are not within arms reach of me or a reasonable drive this is not my best option.

It is my hope that you will end up like an old poster here "PoD". When he first arrived he was inflammatory, insulting, and a general pain in the ass. He was also only 19 and full of piss and vinegar. He ended his "Archive Career" (if one can call it that) well respected, because he began showing respect in turn.

same thing happens to me often(hint: it has to do with me being a stereotypical 20 year old )

I'm pretty sure it has more to do with you being a jackass.

[William Lee]

Ludial:

Adding to Duke Alaric's observations:

Presuming that you don't get your authorizations yanked for your behavior on the field, there are individuals who sincerely detest CA and those who participate in it who would love to run you down like a stag at bay and club you before you even get the chance to say "I yield". You will find they'll do it often enough that you won't even get a shot off. Is that what you want---ten to fifteen 200lb-plus guys with clubs and a personal blue-veined throbbing erection with your name on it?

[Josh W]

In general, I despise pretty much everything westerners used to value in the middle ages.

Why? Are you of Eastern descent? If not, then why do you hate your own heritage? What, specifically, do you despise in traditional Western values?

And I'm not saying that there is no such thing as honor in eastern culture, but they definitely know how to fight better there.

Do they?

I call on you to back that statement up with proof. Apart from just a handful of highly-publicized encounters, I think history shows that the West usually triumphed over the East when the two collided. Certainly, when you bring up the Mongol Invasion, Nicopolis, or Hattin, I can respond with Rhodes, Malta, Arsouf, Tours, Lepanto, and others.

No amount of aikido or supposedly superior Asian martial arts was able to save the Japanese "wakou" pirates who attacked an English ship near Singapore in 1604. The Japanese were soundly trounced in hand-to-hand combat. Where were those easterners who knew "how to fight better" then?

The East has no more claim to being the home of the best fighting techniques in the world than anyplace else does. Eastern martial arts just get more publicity owing to the current Western fascination with them. You have fallen prey to the pop-culture propaganda, and have allowed your opinions to be formed by Hollywood and video games rather than doing any actual research into the subject.

[Ludial]

audax, I think it's you who's being purely a jackass now.

And explaining something by saying "just because the rules say that"(without trying to understand or explain why the rule itself has been created) is blind zeal in my book.

But I can still use a scimitar, right? I don't feel comfortable with straight blades.

[BobKnight]

The rules exist to protect you.

If you say that honor is scum and refuse to adhere to the Chivalric laws, then you should be prepared to take the same in kind.


Are you ready to get polearm'd in the back of your head by a 200lb+ super duke? If not, then I suggest you obey the laws so that no one would have any reason to do that to you.



Also, can we PLEASE lock this?

[Ludial]

In general, I despise pretty much everything westerners used to value in the middle ages.

Why? Are you of Eastern descent? If not, then why do you hate your own heritage? What, specifically, do you despise in traditional Western values?

And I'm not saying that there is no such thing as honor in eastern culture, but they definitely know how to fight better there.

Do they?

I call on you to back that statement up with proof. Apart from just a handful of highly-publicized encounters, I think history shows that the West usually triumphed over the East when the two collided. Certainly, when you bring up the Mongol Invasion, Nicopolis, or Hattin, I can respond with Rhodes, Malta, Arsouf, Tours, Lepanto, and others.

No amount of aikido or supposedly superior Asian martial arts was able to save the Japanese "wakou" pirates who attacked an English ship near Singapore in 1604. The Japanese were soundly trounced in hand-to-hand combat. Where were those easterners who knew "how to fight better" then?

The East has no more claim to being the home of the best fighting techniques in the world than anyplace else does. Eastern martial arts just get more publicity owing to the current Western fascination with them. You have fallen prey to the pop-culture propaganda, and have allowed your opinions to be formed by Hollywood and video games rather than doing any actual research into the subject.

I suggest you check out gatka.
And pirates are not necessarily completely representative of the effectiveness of eastern styles, just like knights and landsknechts are not necessarily so for western Europe. Plus, when talking about battles and campaigns, the competence of the commander is probably just as, if not more important, than the competence of the individual soldiers. And there are enough examples of all kinds of commanders from throughout the world.

And I'm from Eastern Europe. I have enough reasons to despise western culture exactly because of growing up in it.

[BobKnight]

And pirates are not necessarily completely representative of the effectiveness of eastern styles, just like knights and landsknechts are not necessarily so for western Europe. Plus, when talking about battles and campaigns, the competence of the commander is probably just as, if not more important, than the competence of the individual soldiers. And there are enough examples of all kinds of commanders from throughout the world.

.... soo, you are saying the eastern individual fighting styles are more effective because easterners have better commanders.

Your logic kinda fails there mate.

[Ludial]

The rules exist to protect you.

If you say that honor is scum and refuse to adhere to the Chivalric laws, then you should be prepared to take the same in kind.


Are you ready to get polearm'd in the back of your head by a 200lb+ super duke? If not, then I suggest you obey the laws so that no one would have any reason to do that to you.



Also, can we PLEASE lock this?

I like superdukes - they're easy to spot from afar keep a distance from
I'm also 200lb.+ soI don't really mind if they manage to catch me.

[Vladimir]

And explaining something by saying "just because the rules say that"(without trying to understand or explain why the rule itself has been created) is blind zeal in my book.

I think you are confusing "This is the rule and we must follow that rule," with "These are the rules, all hail the rules, we must never change the rules."

The first is simply fair play, you don't have to agree with the rule but you must follow it if you wish to play. If you dislike the rule you may attempt to change it.

The second is "blind zeal". This thread is proof that many of us here would like to change the rules. What we disagree on is how to change them.

[Ludial]

And pirates are not necessarily completely representative of the effectiveness of eastern styles, just like knights and landsknechts are not necessarily so for western Europe. Plus, when talking about battles and campaigns, the competence of the commander is probably just as, if not more important, than the competence of the individual soldiers. And there are enough examples of all kinds of commanders from throughout the world.

.... soo, you are saying the eastern individual fighting styles are more effective because easterners have better commanders.

Your logic kinda fails there mate.

nah, I think I just let my personal opinion get me too far. I mean c'mon, how cool is a friggin' steppe raider compared to some knight, eh?

[Josh W]

I suggest you check out gatka.

That's your proof to support your claim that the East "definitely knew how to fight better?" The name of a Punjabi martial art? I thought you said you were a history student...

And I'm from Eastern Europe. I have enough reasons to despise western culture exactly because of growing up in it.

No offense, but--relative to the rest of the Old World--Eastern Europe is still part of "the West." Eastern Europe certainly has more in common in terms of culture and religion with Western Europe than it does with the Turks, Arabs, Punjabis, or the Japanese at any rate. I ask again: why do you hate your own heritage?

[William Lee]

The rules exist to protect you.

If you say that honor is scum and refuse to adhere to the Chivalric laws, then you should be prepared to take the same in kind.


Are you ready to get polearm'd in the back of your head by a 200lb+ super duke? If not, then I suggest you obey the laws so that no one would have any reason to do that to you.



Also, can we PLEASE lock this?

I like superdukes - they're easy to spot from afar keep a distance from
I'm also 200lb.+ soI don't really mind if they manage to catch me.

But would you mind getting dog-piled by a group of them every single time you attempted to draw a bow? Is that your idea of fun?

[Ludial]

And explaining something by saying "just because the rules say that"(without trying to understand or explain why the rule itself has been created) is blind zeal in my book.

I think you are confusing "This is the rule and we must follow that rule," with "These are the rules, all hail the rules, we must never change the rules."

The first is simply fair play, you don't have to agree with the rule but you must follow it if you wish to play. If you dislike the rule you may attempt to change it.

The second is "blind zeal". This thread is proof that many of us here would like to change the rules. What we disagree on is how to change them.

if it is so, then sorry, my bad. But what I saw here was mostly people bashing at CA.

[Vladimir]

But I can still use a scimitar, right? I don't feel comfortable with straight blades.

Of course, you may construct almost any weapon that does not violate the rules of the list. I suggest you read the rules for the East Kingdom (I think that is where you are from).

[audax]

audax, I think it's you who's being purely a jackass now.

And explaining something by saying "just because the rules say that"(without trying to understand or explain why the rule itself has been created) is blind zeal in my book.

But I can still use a scimitar, right? I don't feel comfortable with straight blades.

You've acted like a jerk from the first post you made. Don't cry when you get treated like you are a jerk. You made your bed.

No one is saying "just because the rules say so". We are explaining to you what the rules say. These are not the same things. The SCA has developed this set of rules over a forty year span of time to address numerous issues of playability, fairness and safety. That is why the rules are as they are. They continue to evolve as new issues come up and they will not change to suit you, so you can run around pretending to be an assassin. We understand the rules and are willing to abide by them. If you can't wrap your head around that, then you should never be allowed to take the field. You will be a hazard to yourself and others.

You can use whatver type of sword you want as long as it complies with the rules. Feel free to put yourself at a disadvantage.

[Ludial]

The rules exist to protect you.

If you say that honor is scum and refuse to adhere to the Chivalric laws, then you should be prepared to take the same in kind.


Are you ready to get polearm'd in the back of your head by a 200lb+ super duke? If not, then I suggest you obey the laws so that no one would have any reason to do that to you.



Also, can we PLEASE lock this?

I like superdukes - they're easy to spot from afar keep a distance from
I'm also 200lb.+ soI don't really mind if they manage to catch me.

But would you mind getting dog-piled by a group of them every single time you attempted to draw a bow? Is that your idea of fun?

actually this makes for a tactical opportunity - while the most "honorable" (and superduke and whatnot) knights chase me for the insults made here, the rest of my unit takes advantage of the situation. Now THAT would be fun(unless ofcourse the rules specifically prohibit it, which I doubt).

[Ludial]

Audax wrote:

You can use whatver type of sword you want as long as it complies with the rules. Feel free to put yourself at a disadvantage

we'll see about this one.
For the rest, you're right.

[William Lee]

The rules exist to protect you.

If you say that honor is scum and refuse to adhere to the Chivalric laws, then you should be prepared to take the same in kind.


Are you ready to get polearm'd in the back of your head by a 200lb+ super duke? If not, then I suggest you obey the laws so that no one would have any reason to do that to you.



Also, can we PLEASE lock this?

I like superdukes - they're easy to spot from afar keep a distance from
I'm also 200lb.+ soI don't really mind if they manage to catch me.

But would you mind getting dog-piled by a group of them every single time you attempted to draw a bow? Is that your idea of fun?

actually this makes for a tactical opportunity - while the most "honorable" (and superduke and whatnot) knights chase me for the insults made here, the rest of my unit takes advantage of the situation. Now THAT would be fun(unless ofcourse the rules specifically prohibit it, which I doubt).

Wooo...

You really don't know the fun you're letting yourself in for....though I doubt you'll share in much of it.

[Ludial]

William Lee wrote:

Wooo...

You really don't know the fun you're letting yourself in for.

most probably

[freiman the minstrel]

Hi, everybody.

I just thought of a old quote. I don't know why that quote came to mind. I also can't source that quote.

"A man's worth can be judged by the quality of his enemies."

Violens had the right idea.

Lucial, you have demonstrated some great qualities here. I think that in many cases, you were trying to piss people off, but actually looking at what you said and how you said it, makes me realize some things about you. I hope you don't mind me saying this.

First, you are what we Mississippians would call a "Game Dog". I have a feeling that you have a hard time walking away from a fight at all. That fighting spirit would serve you very well in the SCA.

You are clever. These folks have pretty dang thick skin. Getting under it takes more than just work. You actually have to hit a nerve to get them to really give you a rise. The archive contains some really, really scary smart folks, some of whom are at the very, very top of their crafts. For instance, at my last count, there were two winners of Academy Awards here. You managed to step in and get them to engage you in a very short time. That is pretty remarkable.

You analyze your environment and utilize it. The fact that you immediately found the "I wanna be a" board, and utilized it for it's intended purpose says something too. Lots of folks on the Archive never figured that out. You found the SCA, and even though you aren't active yet, you managed to find one of the biggest collections of Know How about it in the world.

You are energetic. In two days, you have managed to average 16 posts a day on this board. That kind of energy is actually pretty rare.

Surprisingly, you are polite, when you choose to be. I read your thread on 16th century Spanish Armor, and found that you were polite and well spoken.

And, you're new. For me, new people are very, very important. I feel like new folks are the life's blood for our game, and I love this game very much.

I think that you could have a great time in the SCA. I think that because you remind me of myself when I got started in the society nineteen years ago. I think that you are making some pretty classic mistakes, and you really need a better way to interact with the Society if you are going to have as good a time as you can. It can be the most fun you can have with your pants on, in my opinion.

There are better ways to do these sorts of things. I didn't know that when I started, and I spent a lot of time learning how to do this.

If you can't make Lillies War, please consider Pennsic War. It's a lot closer to Montreal than Lillies. Pennsic is held outside of Pittsburgh, Pa in late July and early August. The timing is pretty friendly to folks in school.

It is the largest war that the SCA has to offer, and it offers some of the largest armored combat battles available anywhere on the planet.

It is also one of the premier party functions held anywhere on the planet. I have done Mardi Gras, Carnivalle in Milan, Oktoberfest in Munich, and a host of other great party experiences.

Here is an "Unnoficial" website devoted to Pennsic.

http://pennsic.net/

If you do manage to make it, I would like to offer you the hospitality of my camp. Omega Camp has been active at Pennsic for 10 years now, and while we are very concerned with Chivalry, Honor and Philanthropy, we are not anything that could possibly be described as "Hoity Toity". Really, the largest sub groups in camp are the Rock and Roll band and the biker types.

The way I describe it to outsiders is that we are a "Rude Camp". The way I drive that message home is that there is a standing rule that nobody under 18 is allowed in camp, ever, even with their parents and a note from their Pope, and that we have, in the past, had a sign by the gate (going out) that said "Did you remember to dress?"

Despite being a Rude Camp, we are relatively respected and well treated at Pennsic. This is because we generally understand and enjoy this game, and we play it pretty well.

You will have to handle your own food, tent and garb and such, but I am betting that you will be happy to be there. We have one of the largest beer coolers that anybody has ever seen, and a keg system for those that prefer draft beer. The plan is that this year, we will have a wet bar as well. Everybody kicks in on the barrels, so it aint "Free Beer", but it's cold, wet and good. I live in Bavaria, and I am a beer snob.

I would have to require two things. That you are straight up with my actives, and that you don't do anything that would endanger or embarrass my house.

There is a place for a dashing, smiling leather clad rogue in the SCA. I think, however, that you want to play it in a way that gets you laid, rather than yelled at.

Please PM me and we can talk about it.

freiman

[audax]

Audax wrote:

You can use whatver type of sword you want as long as it complies with the rules. Feel free to put yourself at a disadvantage

we'll see about this one.
For the rest, you're right.

Everyone here already knows what your scimitar experiment will be like, just like we know how well your run and gun will fare. You are not the first guy with big ideas and small experience who talked alot of trash.

We've been there, seen what works and tossed out what didn't. You have not.

There are people on this board who can hit you any time they want, any where they want. Including right in the taint. You will puke in your helm and fall on the ground curled in a tiny ball. And it will all be because your mouth wrote a bunch of checks your butt could not cash.

[Ludial]

Hi, everybody.

I just thought of a old quote. I don't know why that quote came to mind. I also can't source that quote.

"A man's worth can be judged by the quality of his enemies."

Violens had the right idea.

Lucial, you have demonstrated some great qualities here. I think that in many cases, you were trying to piss people off, but actually looking at what you said and how you said it, makes me realize some things about you. I hope you don't mind me saying this.

First, you are what we Mississippians would call a "Game Dog". I have a feeling that you have a hard time walking away from a fight at all. That fighting spirit would serve you very well in the SCA.

You are clever. These folks have pretty dang thick skin. Getting under it takes more than just work. You actually have to hit a nerve to get them to really give you a rise. The archive contains some really, really scary smart folks, some of whom are at the very, very top of their crafts. For instance, at my last count, there were two winners of Academy Awards here. You managed to step in and get them to engage you in a very short time. That is pretty remarkable.

You analyze your environment and utilize it. The fact that you immediately found the "I wanna be a" board, and utilized it for it's intended purpose says something too. Lots of folks on the Archive never figured that out. You found the SCA, and even though you aren't active yet, you managed to find one of the biggest collections of Know How about it in the world.

You are energetic. In two days, you have managed to average 16 posts a day on this board. That kind of energy is actually pretty rare.

Surprisingly, you are polite, when you choose to be. I read your thread on 16th century Spanish Armor, and found that you were polite and well spoken.

And, you're new. For me, new people are very, very important. I feel like new folks are the life's blood for our game, and I love this game very much.

I think that you could have a great time in the SCA. I think that because you remind me of myself when I got started in the society nineteen years ago. I think that you are making some pretty classic mistakes, and you really need a better way to interact with the Society if you are going to have as good a time as you can. It can be the most fun you can have with your pants on, in my opinion.

There are better ways to do these sorts of things. I didn't know that when I started, and I spent a lot of time learning how to do this.

If you can't make Lillies War, please consider Pennsic War. It's a lot closer to Montreal than Lillies. Pennsic is held outside of Pittsburgh, Pa in late July and early August. The timing is pretty friendly to folks in school.

It is the largest war that the SCA has to offer, and it offers some of the largest armored combat battles available anywhere on the planet.

It is also one of the premier party functions held anywhere on the planet. I have done Mardi Gras, Carnivalle in Milan, Oktoberfest in Munich, and a host of other great party experiences.

Here is an "Unnoficial" website devoted to Pennsic.

http://pennsic.net/

If you do manage to make it, I would like to offer you the hospitality of my camp. Omega Camp has been active at Pennsic for 10 years now, and while we are very concerned with Chivalry, Honor and Philanthropy, we are not anything that could possibly be described as "Hoity Toity". Really, the largest sub groups in camp are the Rock and Roll band and the biker types.

The way I describe it to outsiders is that we are a "Rude Camp". The way I drive that message home is that there is a standing rule that nobody under 18 is allowed in camp, ever, even with their parents and a note from their Pope, and that we have, in the past, had a sign by the gate (going out) that said "Did you remember to dress?"

Despite being a Rude Camp, we are relatively respected and well treated at Pennsic. This is because we generally understand and enjoy this game, and we play it pretty well.

You will have to handle your own food, tent and garb and such, but I am betting that you will be happy to be there. We have one of the largest beer coolers that anybody has ever seen, and a keg system for those that prefer draft beer. The plan is that this year, we will have a wet bar as well. Everybody kicks in on the barrels, so it aint "Free Beer", but it's cold, wet and good. I live in Bavaria, and I am a beer snob.

I would have to require two things. That you are straight up with my actives, and that you don't do anything that would endanger or embarrass my house.

There is a place for a dashing, smiling leather clad rogue in the SCA. I think, however, that you want to play it in a way that gets you laid, rather than yelled at.

Please PM me and we can talk about it.

freiman

Thanks a lot for the post, freiman. I can't PM you since I'm too new to the forum and haven't found the direct way yet(there are some things to be desired here compared to other forum sites).
I'd be happy to join you and your group, though unfortunately I don't think I'll be able to come to Pennsic this year as much as I may want it - with me and my family being recent immigrants, me being in school and despite the fact that the gear I'm planning on won't be too expensive, income security is as of yet an unattained dream. But I think I'll be able to make it for next year

Also(sory, english is not my first language, after all), what does "straight up with your actives" mean?

And I'd like to ask you if you have anything against me putting the expression "game dog" in my sig? I liked it a lot

[Saritor]

Thanks a lot for the post, freiman. I can't PM you since I'm too new to the forum and haven't found the direct way yet(there are some things to be desired here compared to other forum sites).

There's a link.

At the bottom of his post.

It says privMsg.

It doesn't mean shouting at him while he's in the priv.

[MJBlazek]

For safety reasons the rules are there to follow.
If the rules are changed to say you can put your bow right up against the guys head and fire then sweet... but right now they aren't.



Have you even read the rules of this game you want to play?

There are no "Light Fighters"
Section 4. Authorization Restrictions:

4.1
Since Combat Archers are taking place in HWC, they must meet all standards and procedures applying to HWC.

Section 5. Authorization Process
5.1
Know that the legal targets for arrow strikes are the same as those which apply to thrusts. No firing from behind.



This isn't a computer game, there isn't any 5 minute tutorial then you are off and running a certified ass kicker.
There are men and women here (whom you have insulted by the way) who have trained for years in the SCA style to get where they are.
Some who will train for years and never get to their level.

The combat style really isn't Western vs Eastern. It's SCA... and they are gonna kick your butt.

[Ludial]

Thanks a lot for the post, freiman. I can't PM you since I'm too new to the forum and haven't found the direct way yet(there are some things to be desired here compared to other forum sites).

There's a link.

At the bottom of his post.

It says privMsg.

It doesn't mean shouting at him while he's in the priv.

found it

also, by light fighter I mean someone who covers the minimum armor requirements of the SCA.

[MJBlazek]

Thanks a lot for the post, freiman. I can't PM you since I'm too new to the forum and haven't found the direct way yet(there are some things to be desired here compared to other forum sites).

There's a link.

At the bottom of his post.

It says privMsg.

It doesn't mean shouting at him while he's in the priv.

found it

also, by light fighter I mean someone who covers the minimum armor requirements of the SCA.

Did you get the more important part of my post.
The RULES part...

you know the part that says "NO Firing from BEHIND"


Am I saying these are the best rules? No
Am I saying there are certain rules I'd like to change? Sure.
BUT
If you want to play with us, you have to follow the current rule set we all follow. If you choose to break those rules before they are changed then we can revoke your privilege to play.

[Ludial]

MJBlazek wrote:

Did you get the more important part of my post.
The RULES part...

you know the part that says "NO Firing from BEHIND"


Am I saying these are the best rules? No
Am I saying there are certain rules I'd like to change? Sure.
BUT
If you want to play with us, you have to follow the current rule set we all follow. If you choose to break those rules before they are changed then we can revoke your privilege to play.

come to think about it - no problem.

Although I will most likely strive to change those rules in the future.

[MJBlazek]

MJBlazek wrote:

Did you get the more important part of my post.
The RULES part...

you know the part that says "NO Firing from BEHIND"


Am I saying these are the best rules? No
Am I saying there are certain rules I'd like to change? Sure.
BUT
If you want to play with us, you have to follow the current rule set we all follow. If you choose to break those rules before they are changed then we can revoke your privilege to play.

come to think about it - no problem.

Although I will most likely strive to change those rules in the future.

Good luck to you on that, but if you want people to get behind that movement you have a lot of attitude adjustments you need to make.

This game has been evolving for 43 years. I don't know your age, but I am guessing longer than you have been alive. It's longer than I have been alive for sure.
Just set aside the attitude that "You know what is the best way to play"
There have been people tweaking these rules for decades.
Can you share your ideas? Please do.

But drop the "Eastern Archery Messiah " act.

[Vladimir]

also, by light fighter I mean someone who covers the minimum armor requirements of the SCA.

I'm wondering if our little armour forum has given you the wrong idea about the average SCA fighter.

This is, as you know, an armour discussion forum. It has branched into other areas, but it was for armour junkies first and foremost. Many, if not most of us hear wear armour that is heavier than what would be considered "typical". Trust me, there are lots of heavy fighters, many of them dukes, who wear the absolute bare minimum. Just like an archer they can run, jump, twist, turn, dodge, and some can even do somersaults on the field.

[audax]

Josh Warren can do a cartwheel in full plate.

[Sigurd of Jorvik]

Wow. I'm on a 4+hr bus trip and the bus has internet. This freaking thread is really helping to pass the time.

I come from a Markland background and very much love being in a melee with javelins, throwing axes, and arrows flying past. Their rules were plate is proof, and I remember when I finally had a breast plate and took an arrow hit I got to ignore it, how great that felt. (I also remember a res scenario in the woods and being frustrated with so many archers and purposefully stepping on arrows. Not so proud a memory)

Anyways, fast forward 20 years, my last fight was at Storvik Baronial Birthaday. The CA were split up to make even amounts for each side. I had a blast. The arrows zipped by and on occasion into my shield, and even more rarely my head. I managed to run down one archer and I took pity and gave him the option to yield which he accepted.

CA in battles is a great element of our game. It enriches my experience and helps my 'dream' come more alive.

[Ludial]

Josh Warren can do a cartwheel in full plate.

has to be pretty damn strong...

[William Lee]

Josh Warren can do a cartwheel in full plate.

has to be pretty damn strong...

Actually, Josh is of average size and weight. And his armour is specially built for him. Add to this that he trains in it, and it's not really that much of a feat of strength.

In the SCA, a well-made suit of plate armour will allow one to do almost everything one could do in their regular clothing. Also, it generally will not weigh more than a third of the wearer's body weight in mild steel--even less when made of spring steel alloys. Because the name of a man in ill-fitting, overly-heavy armour is "corspe".

[Chris G.]

Nah, I'm sure Josh is no weakling, but he has a harness that fits him well and he is in good shape which I believe are the factors that allow him to do the cartwheels. A lighter but ill-fitting harness on him would probably give him trouble.