The Armour Archive

Here's the question: Did Norse cultures during the 8-11th centuries employ tooled decorations on their leather gear?

I am putting together an outfit for an upcoming SCA "Viking" event. For my own satisfaction, I want my presentation to drift more towards a scholarly living-history point-of-view than the typical SCA member might strive for. To that end, I have been looking through several books I have, including "Vikings: Recreated in Colour Photographs." I have noticed that re-enactor 'Viking" pouches nearly always sport elaborate tooling, typically featuring interlaced beasties. This same decoration is sometimes extended to belts and other leather gear.

So, is there one scintilla of evidence for this or is this practice just another re-enactor"ism"? I have the growing feeling that all the Celtic tooled leather stuff has been inspired by some of the early 1960's crafty re-enactors and that the idea of Norse folks having elaborately tooled leather items is a modern construction.

I'd love to hear your comments, opinions, theories and evidence---as long as the "If they had it they would've used it" thinking is left out.

Thanks,
Tim

Not that I know of. Conversely, the "Viking Age" is about 300-250 years, and covers, geographically, from Greenland to Kiev.

The only book that I know of on leather finds is from Hedeby. I think its mostly about shoes. Give me some time and I'll see if I can find the citation.

I'm also sure someone on this list can probably answer your question.

Mord.

I'm not up on leather; however the vikings did seem to ornament most things they used---note the intricate wood carving they did. I always considered it an artifact of "what do you do during the long winters when you are not telling sagas, drinking mead and making more little norse to grow up and go a-viking...in other words I would find it odd to have everything else ornamented and the leather plain.

Thomas

Thomas,

Well, we have some extant "viking" shoes and they do not seem to be decorated. I don't think you can trust modern thinking on this sort of thing.

Another example, they knew embroidery (i.e. the Bayeux Tapestry) but we do not see extant garments covered in elaborate interlace embroidery, do we? Again real findings often run contrary to the "if they had it they would've used it" idea.

Tim

I believe they did some form of tooling on things like leather sheaths and scabbards. However I beleive the designs to be more rudementary or in a style of repeating motif than artistic elaborate knotwork.

Thanks like simple beasts or knotwork rope or simple repeated lines and dots seem to be more common than not. At least from what I have found. The Gokstad backpack has some nice extant examples of "carving" decoration on it.

Thomas,

Well, we have some extant "viking" shoes and they do not seem to be decorated. I don't think you can trust modern thinking on this sort of thing.

How many shoes in period en-toto were tooled though? The closest reference I have ever seen was small cuts (thought to be decorative) and or glove-seams (also thought to be decorative). But both of these could also serve other purposes.. the small cuts would allow a shoe to expand slightly, accepting a bigger foot, and also give some breath to the foot stuck inside the shoe for long periods of time, and the glove seams would serve as a gather across the top of the foot (where they are found occasionally) to tighten the shoe up if too small or if the leather has stretched over time.

I'd expect to see more ornamentation on something like a pouch.. (look at sporrans for an example) as a symbol of station or wealth, than on a purely utilitarian (and often mud or fur covered) item like a shoe.

Just my thinking.. I do not recall seeing any tooled leather. I would check the sutton-hoo stuff.. but my documentation on tooled leather leads me to believe the majority of it is modern interpretation that lends more to Stohlman and cowboy culture than medieval culture. With the exception of some rus/magyar quivers and bow cases, I have not actually seen a heck of a lot of tooled leather where the tooling is traced to pure ornamentation, and a lot more that leans towards the slit/cut/slice type.. which could be ornamentation, and could also be functional. (drawstrings, for example).

Thats not to say it did not happen.. only to say that I think it might be over-represented in modern re-enactment.

Maeryk

Couple of things I found:

http://www.regia.org/leatwork.htm

http://www.personal.utulsa.edu/~marc-ca ... /bibl.html

and check out Jorvik online.. they have a huge pictorial repository, viewable from the PC, that covers just about everything ever dug out of Coppergate.

Maeryk

I saw several examples from Jorvik and in the '81(?) Metropolitan Museum of Art exhibit. However, I will note that while the patterns were moderately complex, the tooling was not all that sophisticated. Also, one of the knife sheathes was full of "knotwork" mistakes, missing a number of crossings and with some strands just "showing up" when needed. A nice antidote to the "museum factor" where you only tend to see the best and most perfect stuff.

Cap'n Atli wrote:I saw several examples from Jorvik and in the '81(?) Metropolitan Museum of Art exhibit. However, I will note that while the patterns were moderately complex, the tooling was not all that sophisticated. Also, one of the knife sheathes was full of "knotwork" mistakes, missing a number of crossings and with some strands just "showing up" when needed. A nice antidote to the "museum factor" where you only tend to see the best and most perfect stuff.

Now that you meantioned knife sheathes, Atli, I do seem to remember seeing some kind of decoration on them. I have a couple of Jorvik guides at home. I'll check.

Speaking of sheathes, I'll also check, "frojel.com" to see what they have.

Mord.

Just stumbled across this

I have a limited knowledge in the area but can offer some insight (and even get you better answers if youd like)

Tooling on Pouches
None that I am aware of.
Pouches are a highly debated subject in the world of reenactment.
There are so few of them that its hard to tell how common they were.
Of the ones I can think of none have tooling (or none that is noticeable or there isnt enough left to make a good guess)

Tooling on other leather items
There are certainly scabbards and sheaths with tooling marks on them.
See below:


http://www.missouri.edu/~winsloww/archi ... on/125.jpg

http://www.missouri.edu/~winsloww/archi ... hs/526.jpg

http://www.missouri.edu/~winsloww/archi ... awings.jpg

http://www.missouri.edu/~winsloww/archi ... n/pics.jpg

It is also suggested that belts where tooled and even decorated by painting them.

Some very handsome items can be done.
See below

[img]http://www.vikingsna.org/temp/Saxon%20sheath%20front.jpg[/img]
[img]http://www.vikingsna.org/temp/scabbard.jpg[/img]


Hope this helps

Halv

Okay, so far we have knife sheathes...cool! That makes sense in that you see evidence of tooled knife sheathes in later periods, i.e. late medieval England. So maybe I won't ditch my tooled scramsax scabbard

As for pouches or belts I am still curious to see if there is anything approaching the representations oft seen in "viking" re-enactor culture.

Yeah, my shoes comments was not that we expect to see tooling on shoes, but some cultures DID decorate shoes. It seems that the "viking" cultures didn't. So, you cant apply the idea that a culture enjoyed a lot of esoteric decorating to EVERY material item. That was my point. Some items are traditionally decorated and some not. Some are decorated a certain way while others are only ever decorated a different way.

For example, I see Landsknecht re-enactors put slashes on items that are NEVER depicted in period art (or extant examples) as being slashed---but the re-enactors just go overboard with their creativity and artistic license. If one re-enactor does this it's not so bad. But in re-enactor circles, such things sometimes take on a life of their own. Pretty soon, every other Lansknecht has an eleborately slashed belt, regardless of the fact there is no provenance for such a thing.

To clarify my stance, I am not against using some artistic license in recreations where info is sketchy. I indulge in such things myself sometimes. However, I think a person should do this knowing and admitting they are making a leap. For that reason, it is often prudent to question something you have seen other folks do...even if they seem to be amongst the careful and knowledgeable in the crowd.

By the way, thanks for the links. Very helpful!!!

Cheers,
Tim

StudBuckle wrote:As for pouches or belts I am still curious to see if there is anything approaching the representations oft seen in "viking" re-enactor culture.

--Here is a brief synopsis of extant "Viking" age leather pouches that I am aware of. I don't feel that their is enough evidence to suggest one way of the other so I will let you make your own decision;)



Birka - many pouches here, most were cloth with metal fittings but at least one (there may be more) of them was leather but it was HIGHLY decorated with metal fittings so I donno if tooling would be needed

The remains of the sprang purses of Birka
http://www.missouri.edu/~winsloww/archi ... purse1.jpg

Remains of the leather pouch at Birka (image 3)
http://www.missouri.edu/~winsloww/archi ... purse2.jpg

A reconstruction
http://www.missouri.edu/~winsloww/archi ... h_full.jpg



Sutton Hoo
The purse itself was suspected to be leather but the lid wasn't, it was bone/ivory with metal decoration

Reconstruction of the lid
http://www.missouri.edu/~winsloww/archi ... se_lid.jpg



Gokstad
There were some remains of cut pieces of leather/hide buried amongst the chieftains personal effects, these were thought to be remains of a pouch.

Suggested reconstruction
http://www.missouri.edu/~winsloww/archi ... uchpic.jpg


Oseberg
IIRC there was a small leather drawstring pouch in this find but I cant seem to find my notes on it. More on this one later if you want.


Satchel from the Bed Burial at Swallowcliffe Downs
Cant find the copy of this I keep at work but I believe it was leather. I can give you more info on the particulars tomorrow (I have a copy at homes as well)


Reconstruction
http://www.missouri.edu/~winsloww/archi ... uction.jpg

Here are some pictures that I took at the Yorkshire Museum last year.

Two sheaths, both tooled:

http://www.holyort.net/gallery/yorkshire/DSCF0611

As for belts, I don't know if I have ever seen the leather from a viking belt. As far as I know, we only have the metal bits left so there really is no way to tell. However, since we do see tooling on sheaths and scabbards, I would guess that they would do it on belts as well.

Oh.. and someone mentioned looking at Sutton Hoo .. which isn't viking.. its Anglo-Saxon.

Rollo

I just checked "frojel.com." Gallery 32 has 3 photos of knife sheathes. The leather looks tooled--it certainly is decorated. However, the sheathes in the photos look to be reproductions.

Mord.

Oh.. and someone mentioned looking at Sutton Hoo .. which isn't viking.. its Anglo-Saxon.

Which is why i used the word "Viking" (in quotes)

I use that word as most folks dont know the difference.
Granted alot of folks here do but I was in leymans term mode;)

For the record, Swallowcliffe isnt Viking either.

Halv

Oh.. and someone mentioned looking at Sutton Hoo .. which isn't viking.. its Anglo-Saxon.

True, but as a gauge for prevalence of tooled leather in early medieval period, its a site to check. Wasnt trying to use it for documentation of Viking, specifically, but more of tooling in general.

Maeryk

Sir Mord wrote:The only book that I know of on leather finds is from Hedeby. I think its mostly about shoes. Give me some time and I'll see if I can find the citation.

Groenmann-Van Waateringe, Willy. Die Lederfunde von Haithabu. (Berichte Ãœber die Ausgrabungen in Haithabu, Berichte 21) Neumunster : K. Wachholtz, 1984

I have a copy of this at home if yall need any info from it.

Somewhere here at work I have the translation of the bits about the sheaths and the images that accompany it.


Halv

Halvgrim wrote:The remains of the sprang purses of Birka...

Sprang Robb?

/N B

Hey Rollo
Check your PM when you get a chance
Thanks

Halv

Ny Bjorn wrote:Sprang Robb?

/N B

--It was my understanding that some of the purses of Birka had metal 'frames' and the actual purses were made of sprang woven textile.

IIRC Images 2a and 2b in the image below are examples of this


http://www.missouri.edu/~winsloww/archi ... purse3.jpg

I am more than willing to be proven wrong as I am remembering this from a discussion from LOOOOOOONG ago;)


Halv

Ok, since it's OT I wont argue too much with you, that and the fact that my copy of Birka II is 240 Km from my present location.
-I'll check it when I'm back in Stockholm on Sunday, but sprang - sounds odd - and I can't remember anything like that in Gräslund's article.

/N B

Hmmmmmm

I just read thru the translation of Monetary bags from the Viking Age by Eric Sörling (Fornvännen 34 (1939). Stockholm) (which can be seen at http://www.vikingsna.org/translations/moneybags/) and didn't find a reference to these pouches.

I have sent an email to the person I believe told me this (I trust this person when it comes to Birka matters as its her major area of research;) in case I am misquoting her.



ADDED

DOH!
I asked her about the sprang and she said the following:

The identified pouch material is a
repp weave wool. Repp weave is a ribbed material. It can look like
grosgrain hair ribbon.



Sorry to go OT Studbuckle



Halv

Halvgrim wrote:...Sorry to go OT Studbuckle

Halv

No problem at all. I find your info on cloth purses very pertinent here!

Thanks,
Tim

The York Archaeological Trust has a fascicule on leather craft. I skimmed someone else's copy and was impressed by it. I don't remember if it mentioned leather carving but Amazon's blurb says something about decorative techniques.

http://www.yorkarchaeology.co.uk/booksale.htm#craft

Esther Cameron's book on Sheaths and Scabbards is the source for the seax sheathes.

In addition to the York sheaths, check out the cover of St Cuthbert's bible or the simple spiral on Staraya Ladoga shoe III. There's shoes from Ireland & Scotland with some pretty amazing punch & tooling decoration, as well.

The Cronk Moar scabbard had a raised pattern (cord glued under the leather), but that plus the fragment of painted shield from (er) Ballatear (?) (Rollo! gimme back my book!) indicate that those folks decorated their leather stuff.

In addition to what has been mentioned here, there are two surviving seax scabbards in Trondheim, Norway that are highly decorated, quite similar to what has been shown above.

They are indeed from a "viking" core area, but are dated to 6-700 AD, and are strictly speaking not viking.

The sword scabbard remains from the norse grave at Cronk Moar, Isle of Man are decorated with raised ridges in simple geometric motives. The famous sword from Snartemo (again Norwegian pre-viking) feature similar decoration in the form of more or less parallell ridges along the scabbard.

It is common in archaelogical circles to be sceptical of "lacunae", ie if a certain type of object can be found in numbers before and after a given period - it is likely that it was used in that period as well even though it has not been found. Following that line of thinking, it is probable that scabbards were decorated also in the scandinavian homelands considering the finds both before and after the "viking" period.

The standard viking reeenactor pouch has annoyed me for years. One thing is the lack of evidence for the pouches themselves, another is the common form of decoration. If they were not decorated by metal findings, I find it likely that the leather was decorated - but not by a single knotwork motive in the middle of an undecorated surface. The typical decoration in the viking and high medieval period fills out the available space whether the decoration itself is advanced or simple. Decoration along borders, even if nothing more than parallell lines is almost always present.

Halvgrim wrote:Satchel from the Bed Burial at Swallowcliffe Downs
Cant find the copy of this I keep at work but I believe it was leather. I can give you more info on the particulars tomorrow (I have a copy at homes as well)

Reconstruction
http://www.missouri.edu/~winsloww/archi ... uction.jpg

Wow...that thing is wacky!

Halvgrim wrote:... http://www.vikingsna.org/translations/moneybags/ and didn't find a reference to these pouches.
...Halv

Wowser..these are really cool! Now...which one to make???

Cheers,
Tim

Okay...I got inspired and started working on this:

[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v87/finkas/BirkaPouchColor.jpg[/img]

So far the front brass pieces have been cut out and embossed in punchwork. I'm cutting out the leather next. For the leather decoration, I am thinking of simple geometric lines, but we'll see what happens. This will be just a test run. If it comes out nice I'll make the next out of fur per the archeological findings.

Photos will follow in a new thread...

Cheers,
Tim