Logan asked about this and it’s easier to type it here than to keep writing it over and over (Though I suppose you could just check out my diary from time to time. http://bdeb.diaryland.com) Please just skip over this if you aren’t interested, no harm no foul.
So general shoulders/elbows/hands thing is that the Prednisone, Alleve, Ice and Rest HAVE been helping. I’m a ton better than I was a couple of weeks ago, far sure.
But I have good and bad days and moments. Last night for instance I was just really tired after the business meeting. I collapsed into my chair with a Harp and an ICE pack. Fuck therapy, I was DONE. So sue me. Other than last night I have been able to do the daily exercises twice a day per the Doc’s orders without fail.
Anyway, on Monday I walked into the Physical Therapists office with my sword and we got down to brass tacks. I explained the sport as best I could, let him play with the sword, talked about typing and work difficulties, my general injury history, etc. Most of what we did was examination with a focus of flexibility and strength tests. (“Put your arm out like this and keep me from pressing downâ€
My PT progress so far (tendonitis)
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MalcolmMacRobert
- New Member
- Posts: 44
- Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 2:01 am
- Location: Barony of Caer Mear, Kingdom of Atlantia
EXCELLENT!!!!!!
GO Byrum GO!!!!
*feeling pretty silly in this cheerleader's skirt*
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Malcolm MacRobert de Moffat, Barony of Caer Mear, Kingdom of Atlantia, Lieutenant of the Black Company, Sole Squire to Sir Edward Tanner of Cambria.
[This message has been edited by MalcolmMacRobert (edited 12-05-2003).]
GO Byrum GO!!!!
*feeling pretty silly in this cheerleader's skirt*
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Malcolm MacRobert de Moffat, Barony of Caer Mear, Kingdom of Atlantia, Lieutenant of the Black Company, Sole Squire to Sir Edward Tanner of Cambria.
[This message has been edited by MalcolmMacRobert (edited 12-05-2003).]
I have been through this nightmare. Seems your doctor is doing a lot of good things for you. YAY!!
As for this:
"We did some pressure tests for neck damage/ nerve damage and that wasn't that conclusive. He wants to focus on the elbows since he thinks the shoulder tendonitis comes from overcompensating for the weak elbows."
I had the same trouble with my shoulders. I think your doctor is right. Go with it.
One thing I would caution for though; how is your fighting technique? I had to readjust my fighting style so that in itself would not keep the injury "open", so to speak.
My advice would be to look up those fighters that has a reputation of being very technical and/or "smooth" in their fighting and ask for their advice.
I wish you VERY much good luck!!! =)
As for this:
"We did some pressure tests for neck damage/ nerve damage and that wasn't that conclusive. He wants to focus on the elbows since he thinks the shoulder tendonitis comes from overcompensating for the weak elbows."
I had the same trouble with my shoulders. I think your doctor is right. Go with it.
One thing I would caution for though; how is your fighting technique? I had to readjust my fighting style so that in itself would not keep the injury "open", so to speak.
My advice would be to look up those fighters that has a reputation of being very technical and/or "smooth" in their fighting and ask for their advice.
I wish you VERY much good luck!!! =)
Taken from today's Diary Entry: (http://bdeb.diaryland.com)
Here’s the latest report from my PT session yesterday:
I started off disappointed since the guy had forget to study the CD I made him, but I understand, shit happens. If he hasn’t studied it on Thursday though, we are going to sit at his computer and go thru it together. I’m paying (ok my insurance) too much for this to get fucked around with.
Anyway, I started on the elliptical bike, arms only again. Seven minutes this time, set at 7 of a possible 10 instead of the 5 and 5 that I did last week. That was tough, and though I was in range of about 4 more reps, my concentration lapsed at the end and I ended up just shy of my 100 reps a minute goal. Crap! But I was way over it for most of the exercise, so I’ll settle for that.
Next was the rubberbands, which went really quickly. (With the exception of the “Touchdownâ€
Here’s the latest report from my PT session yesterday:
I started off disappointed since the guy had forget to study the CD I made him, but I understand, shit happens. If he hasn’t studied it on Thursday though, we are going to sit at his computer and go thru it together. I’m paying (ok my insurance) too much for this to get fucked around with.
Anyway, I started on the elliptical bike, arms only again. Seven minutes this time, set at 7 of a possible 10 instead of the 5 and 5 that I did last week. That was tough, and though I was in range of about 4 more reps, my concentration lapsed at the end and I ended up just shy of my 100 reps a minute goal. Crap! But I was way over it for most of the exercise, so I’ll settle for that.
Next was the rubberbands, which went really quickly. (With the exception of the “Touchdownâ€
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Animal:
<B>How much warm up stretching are you doing before you fight? I'm real guilty of not doing enough but I have noticed that a bit before hand really tends to help keep things from tightening up.
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Not engough that is for sure, but that is going to change. I stopped doing a lot of stretching a couple of years ago, cos I found out that I was MORE likely to pull something if I went out and fought after stretching. I'm pretty darn flexiable, so I don't need a whole lot normally anyway.
This injury seems to have been aggretivate at Pennsic by fighting, carrying shit, setting up camp, etc. and it just has gotten worse and worse. I[m more or less past the mind numbing pain (tho the shoulder strain today is pissing me off) at this point.
None the less, I see a lot of pre-fighting streching in my future...
B
BdeB
<B>How much warm up stretching are you doing before you fight? I'm real guilty of not doing enough but I have noticed that a bit before hand really tends to help keep things from tightening up.
</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Not engough that is for sure, but that is going to change. I stopped doing a lot of stretching a couple of years ago, cos I found out that I was MORE likely to pull something if I went out and fought after stretching. I'm pretty darn flexiable, so I don't need a whole lot normally anyway.
This injury seems to have been aggretivate at Pennsic by fighting, carrying shit, setting up camp, etc. and it just has gotten worse and worse. I[m more or less past the mind numbing pain (tho the shoulder strain today is pissing me off) at this point.
None the less, I see a lot of pre-fighting streching in my future...
B
BdeB
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by twoswords:
One thing I would caution for though; how is your fighting technique? I had to readjust my fighting style so that in itself would not keep the injury "open", so to speak.
[/B]</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
That's a good point and I plan on spending some time analizing my stance, arm positions, etc. with some more experienced fighters that I trust in the future, esp. once I get back in gear.
Michael had to pretty much stop throwing wraps for a couple of years there, and of course, Anton had to totally change his stance and style after the last knee surgery.
Me, I blame Cuan. If he hadn't gotten me working on high guards and snap combonations I'd been just fine.
Ok, truth to be told, my whimpy little arms are the real culprits here, not Cuan. But it IS more fun to blame him, afterall...
Byram
One thing I would caution for though; how is your fighting technique? I had to readjust my fighting style so that in itself would not keep the injury "open", so to speak.
[/B]</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
That's a good point and I plan on spending some time analizing my stance, arm positions, etc. with some more experienced fighters that I trust in the future, esp. once I get back in gear.
Michael had to pretty much stop throwing wraps for a couple of years there, and of course, Anton had to totally change his stance and style after the last knee surgery.
Me, I blame Cuan. If he hadn't gotten me working on high guards and snap combonations I'd been just fine.
Ok, truth to be told, my whimpy little arms are the real culprits here, not Cuan. But it IS more fun to blame him, afterall...
Byram
Have you looked into theraputic massage? A lot of times if you can relax the surrounding tissue and allow for better blood flow you seem to heal faster. Find someone knowledgable and let them work on you for a bit. Make sure they start slow and work in deeper as they go, dont start out digging fo china. Maybe it'll help.
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Animal Weretiger
"Trample the weak; hurdle the dead"
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Animal Weretiger
"Trample the weak; hurdle the dead"
Another couple of days, another diary entry...maybe I should stop posting these...or move them to the Off Topic list...don't know how many of the few of you that care about this read that page tho. There is always the Rant Page, I suppose...
So,
PT progresses. I almost missed yesterday’s session because of a scheduling error. Luckily, I checked my appointment card about 2 hours before I was supposed to get there. Work screwed me up, but I still got there in time to do the whole session.
First thing he said to me was “Yeah I watched your CD…this isn’t just a social club, is it?!?â€
So,
PT progresses. I almost missed yesterday’s session because of a scheduling error. Luckily, I checked my appointment card about 2 hours before I was supposed to get there. Work screwed me up, but I still got there in time to do the whole session.
First thing he said to me was “Yeah I watched your CD…this isn’t just a social club, is it?!?â€
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Bedlam:
<B>Byram:
Have started experiencing any of the wonderful side effects of the prednisone?</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Hey man,
No i've been taking predinsone in one form or another for about 15 years, i'm used to the side effects, they barely phase me now. Besides making me act like an even bigger A-hole when I am on REALLY high doses, I'm pretty much used to the weight gain, cramps, insomnia, etc.
I have a couple of chronic allergy issues including Atopic Dermitisis, and chronic URI, bronchistis and pneumonia and i've been on predinsone and/or Kenelog injections for years.
The good news is that with the new allergy shots, I have had bronchistis or the need for a serious dose in almost six months. That is a major breakthru tho, since I was getting URI leading to Bronchitsis quarterly for the last 5 years or so.
The most fun was about 5 years ago when I got walking pneumonia and colitus at the same time right around Ymir (only one I have missed in 10+ years). The pneumonia was coming from my stomach acid traveling up my windpipe and burning and scarring my lungs. Fun Fun.
One of my favorite "Chirgeons from Hell" Stories involves Prednisone actually. I was at the first or second "Seige of Troy event and I dropped from a groin cramp after the Pub Battle. I was immediatly surrounded by at least six Chirgeouns (thus named forever more "Black Vultures" in my lexicon) who all crowded around me considering how to cut my armour off me. I was in so much pain I couldn't speak, and luckily my squire brother (now Sir) Duncan pushed his way in, figured out what was wrong, grabbed the leg muscle where it was cramping and had me up and walking in about 2 mins.
Then I got the lecture that I had damaged my Seiatic (sp) Nerve and if I continued to fight, I would cripple myself and be in a wheelchair in 10 years. I explained to them that no, I was taking 20mg of prednisone a day and had been for five years or so, and I got the best reaction: "Then you shouldn't even be on the field!!!"
Yeah. I was a danger to myself and others. *Sigh*
I have a lot of respect for a couple of the SCA's medics that are real world practioners and that is a really short list. There has always been a long standing order in my house that my friends know who is allowed to touch me if I drop (that goes both ways...)
Look at me, i'm rambling about my health issues like a certain Atlantian Laurel that Logan and I know...
Do De Do....
[This message has been edited by BdeB (edited 12-11-2003).]
<B>Byram:
Have started experiencing any of the wonderful side effects of the prednisone?</B></font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Hey man,
No i've been taking predinsone in one form or another for about 15 years, i'm used to the side effects, they barely phase me now. Besides making me act like an even bigger A-hole when I am on REALLY high doses, I'm pretty much used to the weight gain, cramps, insomnia, etc.
I have a couple of chronic allergy issues including Atopic Dermitisis, and chronic URI, bronchistis and pneumonia and i've been on predinsone and/or Kenelog injections for years.
The good news is that with the new allergy shots, I have had bronchistis or the need for a serious dose in almost six months. That is a major breakthru tho, since I was getting URI leading to Bronchitsis quarterly for the last 5 years or so.
The most fun was about 5 years ago when I got walking pneumonia and colitus at the same time right around Ymir (only one I have missed in 10+ years). The pneumonia was coming from my stomach acid traveling up my windpipe and burning and scarring my lungs. Fun Fun.
One of my favorite "Chirgeons from Hell" Stories involves Prednisone actually. I was at the first or second "Seige of Troy event and I dropped from a groin cramp after the Pub Battle. I was immediatly surrounded by at least six Chirgeouns (thus named forever more "Black Vultures" in my lexicon) who all crowded around me considering how to cut my armour off me. I was in so much pain I couldn't speak, and luckily my squire brother (now Sir) Duncan pushed his way in, figured out what was wrong, grabbed the leg muscle where it was cramping and had me up and walking in about 2 mins.
Then I got the lecture that I had damaged my Seiatic (sp) Nerve and if I continued to fight, I would cripple myself and be in a wheelchair in 10 years. I explained to them that no, I was taking 20mg of prednisone a day and had been for five years or so, and I got the best reaction: "Then you shouldn't even be on the field!!!"
Yeah. I was a danger to myself and others. *Sigh*
I have a lot of respect for a couple of the SCA's medics that are real world practioners and that is a really short list. There has always been a long standing order in my house that my friends know who is allowed to touch me if I drop (that goes both ways...)
Look at me, i'm rambling about my health issues like a certain Atlantian Laurel that Logan and I know...
Do De Do....
[This message has been edited by BdeB (edited 12-11-2003).]
PT was yesterday.
Ouch. I wimped out and only did my exercises at the doctor’s office. I was just too sore afterwards, and heck, before.
First was my nemesis, the elliptical bike. Ten more minutes, set at strength of 7. I just plain gave up on trying for 100 reps a minute; I knew that I was too sore and tired for that. I ended up averaging about 96 reps a minute, which I think is pretty good. I’m at a rep and ½ a second consistently for 10 minutes. Arm still hurt like hell though, 24 hours later.
I’ve noticed that my left arm (shield) seems to be the most sore in the elbow department these days. Saturday we had some folks over for some slow work/ pell work out of armour and I tested out the arms. I was pretty much ok, except for the left elbow. It got sore pretty much from carrying the shield for a couple of 10-15 minute stretches.
Anyway, at PT I finished up the reps and then did my rubber band exercises. Next were the 2-pound weights, and the dreaded table stretches. Instead of adding more stretches or weights, or pull-ups, what have you, we moved to the next room and Greg grabbed an old wooden tennis racket (with the old wooden frame cases for those of you that remember those) that we used as a “swordâ€
Ouch. I wimped out and only did my exercises at the doctor’s office. I was just too sore afterwards, and heck, before.
First was my nemesis, the elliptical bike. Ten more minutes, set at strength of 7. I just plain gave up on trying for 100 reps a minute; I knew that I was too sore and tired for that. I ended up averaging about 96 reps a minute, which I think is pretty good. I’m at a rep and ½ a second consistently for 10 minutes. Arm still hurt like hell though, 24 hours later.
I’ve noticed that my left arm (shield) seems to be the most sore in the elbow department these days. Saturday we had some folks over for some slow work/ pell work out of armour and I tested out the arms. I was pretty much ok, except for the left elbow. It got sore pretty much from carrying the shield for a couple of 10-15 minute stretches.
Anyway, at PT I finished up the reps and then did my rubber band exercises. Next were the 2-pound weights, and the dreaded table stretches. Instead of adding more stretches or weights, or pull-ups, what have you, we moved to the next room and Greg grabbed an old wooden tennis racket (with the old wooden frame cases for those of you that remember those) that we used as a “swordâ€
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Bedlam:
Have you ruled out a cortisone shot? They work like magic for me.</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
No, I haven't ruled them out, but they weren't suggested to me from my doctor. For one thing, there is a limited number of them that you can do. For another, I take a LOT of steriods. Despite how safe they are suppose to be, have you looked at the side effects for long term use? I get prob. four-six kenalog shots a year anyway, plus the occasional (and thankfully less often now) dose pack of prednisone. If only they made me big and strong like bull! (I'll take my nuts at thier normal small size tho, thanks! Don't need any help there in the shrink department!)
My plan at this point to hang in there with the PT for a couple of months, and see how I do after the first of the year when I start training hard again. If I don't see results with the PT, you better believe that I will be pushing for a trip to an Ortho specialist. I'm also considering visiting my ostipath again, since i've had really good pain and sympthom relief from him in the past.
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http://bdeb.diaryland.com/
[This message has been edited by BdeB (edited 12-16-2003).]
Have you ruled out a cortisone shot? They work like magic for me.</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
No, I haven't ruled them out, but they weren't suggested to me from my doctor. For one thing, there is a limited number of them that you can do. For another, I take a LOT of steriods. Despite how safe they are suppose to be, have you looked at the side effects for long term use? I get prob. four-six kenalog shots a year anyway, plus the occasional (and thankfully less often now) dose pack of prednisone. If only they made me big and strong like bull! (I'll take my nuts at thier normal small size tho, thanks!
Don't need any help there in the shrink department!)My plan at this point to hang in there with the PT for a couple of months, and see how I do after the first of the year when I start training hard again. If I don't see results with the PT, you better believe that I will be pushing for a trip to an Ortho specialist. I'm also considering visiting my ostipath again, since i've had really good pain and sympthom relief from him in the past.
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http://bdeb.diaryland.com/
[This message has been edited by BdeB (edited 12-16-2003).]
PT this time was all about adding weight and increasing resistance.
Only eight minutes on the dreaded elliptical bike today, moved up to setting 8. After that we graduated to the black rubber band from the blue one. Much harder to crank out the drills this time.
Also, we did the hand weight, but moved it up to a 3 pounder this time.
After that we picked up the sword and did the latest shoulder movement exercises. I also let him play around with my shield for a bit to get an idea of weight.
Basically, he is pleased with my progress. Next week he is out for Christmas so I am to keep it up in that absence. This morning, since I don’t have the black rubber band, I added 5 more reps to each set of exercises. Not sure what to do on the sword end, besides just keeping at it. Maybe I’ll add some more reps in a couple of days.
He wants me to come in on the 29th and depending on how I am doing, he is talking about ending the PT. Part of me is glad, but another part is sorta wary. I can see the difference in tone and development in my arms and shoulders (though it is slight). But I am still having pain and discomfort issues. I knew going in that the PT wasn’t a cure all, but I want to make sure that I have a lot of options at my fingertips if these problems don’t go away with time and rest.
January will be back in armour month and I’m really going to push it. We will see how that goes. My plan at this point is to make our practice every week (do that anyway, since I’m the KM), and add either another practice or an event for the rest of January. By February I’d like to be back to two practices a week and an event if possible.
I guess I’m stuck in a wait and see pattern right now.
I made the mistake of complaining about the difficulties of my schedule of doing the PT twice a day and he said that after our next meeting I might be able to slack off to once a day, and then once every other day, depending. Whatever. I don’t want to slack off just for the sake of slacking off though. I figure once I get down to the every other day routine I can add some light lower body work in on the days off. Even if it is stretching and leg lifts, that is better than nothing.
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http://bdeb.diaryland.com/
Only eight minutes on the dreaded elliptical bike today, moved up to setting 8. After that we graduated to the black rubber band from the blue one. Much harder to crank out the drills this time.
Also, we did the hand weight, but moved it up to a 3 pounder this time.
After that we picked up the sword and did the latest shoulder movement exercises. I also let him play around with my shield for a bit to get an idea of weight.
Basically, he is pleased with my progress. Next week he is out for Christmas so I am to keep it up in that absence. This morning, since I don’t have the black rubber band, I added 5 more reps to each set of exercises. Not sure what to do on the sword end, besides just keeping at it. Maybe I’ll add some more reps in a couple of days.
He wants me to come in on the 29th and depending on how I am doing, he is talking about ending the PT. Part of me is glad, but another part is sorta wary. I can see the difference in tone and development in my arms and shoulders (though it is slight). But I am still having pain and discomfort issues. I knew going in that the PT wasn’t a cure all, but I want to make sure that I have a lot of options at my fingertips if these problems don’t go away with time and rest.
January will be back in armour month and I’m really going to push it. We will see how that goes. My plan at this point is to make our practice every week (do that anyway, since I’m the KM), and add either another practice or an event for the rest of January. By February I’d like to be back to two practices a week and an event if possible.
I guess I’m stuck in a wait and see pattern right now.
I made the mistake of complaining about the difficulties of my schedule of doing the PT twice a day and he said that after our next meeting I might be able to slack off to once a day, and then once every other day, depending. Whatever. I don’t want to slack off just for the sake of slacking off though. I figure once I get down to the every other day routine I can add some light lower body work in on the days off. Even if it is stretching and leg lifts, that is better than nothing.
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http://bdeb.diaryland.com/
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Christian1095
- Archive Member
- Posts: 277
- Joined: Thu Nov 06, 2003 2:01 am
- Location: Gastonia, nc
- Contact:
Hey B.. .something that worked well for me was to take an old basket or broomed sword and cut right above the tang... then I didn't have to swing around all that mass and still got the "feeling" of having a real rattan weapon in my hand. Most of the slow work katas were based on opening shots and movement... mabe that might be an option for ya....
PT was yesterday. I’ve only got one more session (according to my GD HMO) left now. I think I have some newer minor things going on (I think I’ve strained the tendons a bit by overdoing it) so the plan is to get back into armour next week and see how the body reacts. If I am back to crippling pain on Wednesday then it will be back to my doctor to see what the next step is. The HMO just won’t authorize anything else until we have done the PT, and I think that if I push it I can get a bit more. Either way, I’m confident about sticking to my guns and making sure I get the help I need.
This week we started out on the elliptical bike again, set back down to a strength of 7, for 7 minutes. For the first four minutes I got to use my legs, and then I switched to all arms for the last three. I think Gary stepped back on this, since I reported the pain and other symptoms that I had been having.
Then it the rubber bands, back to the blue ones and back to 15 reps instead of the 20 that I had been doing at home.
Next we did the light weights and it turns out that I have been overdrawing on the upswing, due to a combination of rushing, and laziness. So that was frustrating, since I though I was doing really well with those and ready to move on to higher weights. But, since the technique isn’t right, there is no point in just doing the higher weights and risking an injury. The problem is that I’m in that dangerous zone, where I have healed up enough to be able to do the exercises pretty easily. So I’ve gotten slack and I have to work on that.
Next we went to the table and did the arm stretches, but this time with a one pound weight. By this point, by arms were jelly and I felt like a complete wuss. However, I did manage to finish them out, and afterwards Gary worked out some knots in my shoulders and collarbone areas. That felt REALLY good, and it’s the first time I’ve had any sort of professional massage in far too long. Gotta get a hold of that therapist that owes me a freebie…
Anyway, that’s that latest. I’m frustrated, since I’m not as stiff and swore and when I started, but I’m not better yet. I certainly have more definition and strength, but the pain is still there. I know it’s a long road so I’m not too worried about it. The big test, I suppose will be next week after practice.
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http://bdeb.diaryland.com/
This week we started out on the elliptical bike again, set back down to a strength of 7, for 7 minutes. For the first four minutes I got to use my legs, and then I switched to all arms for the last three. I think Gary stepped back on this, since I reported the pain and other symptoms that I had been having.
Then it the rubber bands, back to the blue ones and back to 15 reps instead of the 20 that I had been doing at home.
Next we did the light weights and it turns out that I have been overdrawing on the upswing, due to a combination of rushing, and laziness. So that was frustrating, since I though I was doing really well with those and ready to move on to higher weights. But, since the technique isn’t right, there is no point in just doing the higher weights and risking an injury. The problem is that I’m in that dangerous zone, where I have healed up enough to be able to do the exercises pretty easily. So I’ve gotten slack and I have to work on that.
Next we went to the table and did the arm stretches, but this time with a one pound weight. By this point, by arms were jelly and I felt like a complete wuss. However, I did manage to finish them out, and afterwards Gary worked out some knots in my shoulders and collarbone areas. That felt REALLY good, and it’s the first time I’ve had any sort of professional massage in far too long. Gotta get a hold of that therapist that owes me a freebie…
Anyway, that’s that latest. I’m frustrated, since I’m not as stiff and swore and when I started, but I’m not better yet. I certainly have more definition and strength, but the pain is still there. I know it’s a long road so I’m not too worried about it. The big test, I suppose will be next week after practice.
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http://bdeb.diaryland.com/
So, Tuesday was my first night back in armour since 11/11/03 and Wednesday was my last PT appointment.
I was REALLY pleased with how the arms, shoulders, and wrists held up. Admittedly, I only did some light sparing with Laz, and some training with Jack, but I was in armour about an hour with no significant problems. Afterwards, I iced my forearms, which were aching a bit, but nothing like the “can’t raise my arms – please kill me sorta painâ€
I was REALLY pleased with how the arms, shoulders, and wrists held up. Admittedly, I only did some light sparing with Laz, and some training with Jack, but I was in armour about an hour with no significant problems. Afterwards, I iced my forearms, which were aching a bit, but nothing like the “can’t raise my arms – please kill me sorta painâ€