Steel scales in the 11th century

[Mack]

Hi all, I have a box of steel scales that I'm building a vest out of and I was wondering where in northern Europe they would have been used in the 11th century. I'm looking at building a Viking or Norman kit. The location of scale use will determine the culture I base my kit from. I do know the standard was maille around this period but I thought I might try something different.

Mack

[Ingvarr]

In the 11th century, I'm not sure they were much in use in Northern Europe. Roman lorica squamata is probably the closest you'll get. Possibly Mongols.

[Fearghus Macildubh]

Maybe earlier or later. There are Carolingian manuscripts that show what looks like scale armour. In late 13th/early 14th century you can find a few images of regular warriors in scale, sometimes worn over mail, sometimes solo. The Manessa Codex has a couple. There is a caveat, medieval artists would often use scale as a visual shorthand for "bad guy", supposedly because returning Crusaders described Islamic armour as scale.

[Ernst]

There seems to be an surge in Western depictions of scale armor after the 4th Crusade, which could reflect surviving Roman influence on art and/or armor in Byzantium (Eastern Roman Empire). I'm not big on Ottonian art, but most of the armed figures that spring to mind have only a spear and shield.

Edit: There's always the ongoing debate on whether Guy de Ponthieu's wearing a bi-metal scale cuirass over a tunic, a patterned tunic, etc..

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... ene10a.jpg

[Mack]

Ernst, I was looking at the Bayeax Tapestry today. Made me wonder and I'll keep all that in mind. I'm not too much into the crusades, the only research I've done is on the first along with a whole semester of the byzantines. Much of what I've seen that isn't chain are brigandines.

Mack

[Fearghus Macildubh]

Here it is, the Golden Psalter of St Gallen, http://www.e-codices.unifr.ch/en/csg/0022/141/large It could be mail, it could be scale. The Codex Manesse image is pretty clear : http://www.tempora-nostra.de/manesse.php?id=203&tfl=76

[Mack]

Thanks for that info. Looks like I'll be looking for a hauberk to go with it.

[Russ Mitchell]

Please post pics when you're done -- there wasn't a whole lot I could add this time around, but I'm a huge fan of scale.

[Mack]

Will do Russ


Mack