Historically accurate steel?

Forj · Post by **Forj** » Fri Jun 07, 2002 7:22 pm

Ok, I hear a lot about the newer armours coming out that are made of high carbon/spring steel. With my materials knowledge, and descriptions of period manufacture, this sounds about right for a period material. But what historical evidence is there for the actual type of steel used? What studies have been done? I agree with the idea, would just like to see written somewhere "we tested the composition this piece, and it has too much carbon to be mild, it has almost the same composition as spring steel", or even better, an actual % composition listed. Anyone have a source for this?

------------------
Aww, come on...a little pain never hurt anyone...

wcallen · Post by **wcallen** » Fri Jun 07, 2002 7:47 pm

Williams, A 1979 A Technical Note on some armours of king Henry VIII and his contemporaries - Arhaeologia 106:157-165.

Williams, Z 1995 The Royal Armoury at Greenwich 1515-1649, a history of its Technology. London, Royal Armouries.

Reuck, A The armourer's dilemma: hard or tough. Royal Armouries Yearbook 2 - 1997.

There is real research. The materials were not as clean as modern steels, but 1050 is about as good as we get for immitating good quality armour.

2 of these are available from the Royal armouries now.

Wade

Forj · Post by **Forj** » Fri Jun 07, 2002 8:41 pm

Thanks, that perfect. Are there any online resources anyone knows of, before I run off to the library/bookstore? (its the weekend, too).

Cheers, Tristan

Cet · Post by **Cet** » Sat Jun 08, 2002 6:17 pm

For an online resource you might try the-wallace-collection.org.uk. They had William's article "Scientific Investigation of the Armour in the Wallace Collection" available online a while back and it may still be there. Incedently, I recently purchased a nicely bound copy of the Archaeologia article Wade mentioned through alibris.com.
All of these articles determine the type of steel used in the suites in question by examining the microstructure of each suite. If you aren't familiar with steel microstructure and how it's affected by heat treatment I would recommend getting a text on basic metallurgy from your local library; it will make the articles much more accessible.

Forj · Post by **Forj** » Sun Jun 09, 2002 5:42 am

Thanks, but I have no worries about steel microstructures, I'm about to start my Masters in Materials Science, with a Metallurgist for a supervisor

. Checked out the Wallace collection before, very good stuff on that, but they describe the microstructures found, not the composition. Will have to look for the books mentioned instead I guess.

------------------
Aww, come on...a little pain never hurt anyone...

Cet · Post by **Cet** » Sun Jun 09, 2002 2:30 pm

Glad to be of help. Given your course of study I'm sure you'll get full use out of these books and articles. If by composition your referring to the precise carbon content of the steels in question it seems that Williams uses his examinations of microstructure and hardness to infer carbon content based on comparisons of known samples. As far as alloying elements other than carbon I have heard theories that german armour steels were supperior to their Italian counterparts due to a higher maganese content, but I believe that these theories were based on comparisons of contemporary ore sources rather than actual analysis of samples of steel from armour. You would probably know better than I, but I think such an analysis would necessitate the destruction of at least small samples from the armour in question- something most conservators are probably loth to do.

Forj · Post by **Forj** » Sun Jun 09, 2002 4:39 pm

Oh yes, will certainly get some use out of those books

. What the papers on the Wallace Collection site have done is state the types of microstructures found, ie martensite, pearlite etc, which tells you a lot about the heat treatment that went on, the quality of the steel to begin with, and the quality of the methods used to make it, but to even guess at composition, you need to know at least the proportions of various microstructures. Naturally, this will vary from spot to spot, and even (especially!) through the thickness, but an average can easily be arrived at.

If I can convince anyone to let me borrow any actual armour, I plan on using an Electron Microscope to chekc out the microstructures myself, and this will give a readout of what elements are present in what quantities as well, so no destruction needed, thank goodness.

------------------
Aww, come on...a little pain never hurt anyone...