Baskets

marcidius · Post by **marcidius** » Tue Oct 09, 2001 8:09 pm

I am relatively new to SCA fighting, and I have done some looking at basket hilting.
Most sites offer a guarantee "If you break a weld, we'll replace it, free." so my question is twofold:

1: does this happen frequently enough that those guarantees are commonplace, or is it common courtesy?

2: Does the shape have any real effect on fighting, and the life expectancy of the basket? (like heart-patterned vs. a "standard" hilt basket)

------------------
-Gid
I.R.G.Y.F.

Alcyoneus · Post by **Alcyoneus** » Tue Oct 09, 2001 10:40 pm

If done right, the weld should be stronger than the material welded. Therefore, if the weld breaks, somebody didn't do something right.

Vogeljager · Post by **Vogeljager** » Wed Oct 10, 2001 7:01 am

I have seen a Sheet metal basket with a few small dents, and nothing more serious than a little rubbed paint on the welded bar baskets.

I personally don't like blocking with the baskets so I expect mine to last long after I'm finished fighting (which hopefully won't be for a long while)

If you actively block with them, expect a little more wear.

Not blocking/Blocking with a basket is a topic which has set off flame wars in the past and most likely will again in the future.

I'm against. You will have to make up your own mind.

------------------
Vogeljager
www.angelfire.com/nf/dfowler/

Lochlainn · Post by **Lochlainn** » Wed Oct 10, 2001 10:18 am

Err, yeah. Baskets can be problematic as far as authenticity vs. safety.

It breaks down to personal choice, really. I use a basket on my sword, but other single weapons I don't.

Baskets shouldn't take any more wear than any other piece of armour. Get a stainless steel sheetmetal one, I think they're a little lighter. You'll find that the dents don't really matter to you after you start fighting.

------------------
Lochlainn
Liberalism: "a State of perfect Freedom to order their Actions...as they think fit...without asking leave, or depending on the Will of any other Man"--Locke

Lodhur · Post by **Lodhur** » Wed Oct 10, 2001 7:13 pm

Say, is there anything that says I couldn't use a water hardened cuir boulli basket hilt? Has anyone seen it done effectively?

Alcyoneus · Post by **Alcyoneus** » Wed Oct 10, 2001 10:15 pm

One reason I use BH is for hand protection. One thing that results from that is it helps balance the sword, which would not work effectively with leather, or plastic.

I have seen cour boulli bh, and they seem to work.

Patrick · Post by **Patrick** » Thu Oct 11, 2001 1:04 pm

A note on the leather baskets-

Our baron used to use one. It was wax hardened. After getting hit enough and knocking around in the car enough, and all the usual abuse, it wasn't a very good form of protection. he blocked with the basket and was done for the day.

This is my gripe about most leather armor, by the way. I have replaced one demigauntlet for a fighter who loved his leather one. But it was as soft as glove leather. People don't tend to maintain thier gear in this regard.

Anyway, another option may be rawhide. If you seal it with wax, then sweat and water won't make it floppy. Cariadoc's Miscellany has a design for a rawhide basket hilt.

-Patrick

Reinhard · Post by **Reinhard** » Fri Oct 12, 2001 5:46 am

Basket hilts are the easiest things in the world to make, all you need is:
(Tools)
A vice
A power drill and a good 5mm bit
2 x vice grips
A hacksaw
A ball pien hammer
(Materials)
Some 5mm flat bar
Some 4.5mm shank width nails
About 6cm of water pipe, wide enough to go around your rattan stick with a little space.
(Method)
Cut the pipe into two equal sections, this will be your top and bottom grips, if you leave a little strip sticking out you will have something for the tape to stick to when it attaches to your rattan.
Now, cut three equal strips of flat bar and bend them like an 'omega' symbol, a curve with two short arms. These are your three vertical ribs, you drill a hole at each end and in the pipe, then cut a nail and use it as a rivet to fix it to the pipe (getting it welded is a LOT easier, and should cost almost nothing) Then just do rings around ribs using the flat bar and drilling a hole at each intersection. You bend the flat bar in the vice using the vice grips or around a curved surface. I'll post a photo of mine when I get a hold of the camera, mine took about a days work because I was learning as I went. Don't forget to leave >25mm space between each ring or you can get your knuckles mangled!

Konall · Post by **Konall** » Fri Oct 12, 2001 2:36 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by marcidius:
Most sites offer a guarantee "If you break a weld, we'll replace it, free...
1: does this happen frequently enough that those guarantees are commonplace, or is it common courtesy?

I would say common courtesy. It is an easy guarantee to offer, because they are usually way overbuilt, and very rarely break. If I build them to stand up to the guy who blocks glaives with his basket <cough-SirDanu-cough>, then it will last forever in the hands of a normal person.

2: Does the shape have any real effect on fighting, and the life expectancy of the basket?

Not really. It seems to be more an effect of how much you block with the basket, and how well the welding was done. I've seen baskets crumpled from years of abuse with welds still intact, and I've seen relatively new looking baskets with broken welds. The broken welds I've seen have been due both to poor welds (cold joint) or insufficient filler.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

marcidius · Post by **marcidius** » Fri Oct 12, 2001 9:57 pm

I use the basket a *lot*, it takes abuse from rattan sliding down the "blade" to impact near the upper mount.

------------------
-Gid
I.R.G.Y.F.