Just started to make some of my own and they keep breaking for various reasons.
So what is exactly expected of a waster? Should it be strong enough to fight briefly with metal weapons or metal edged shields? Or are they only supposed to be used for light sword on sword training against other wood?
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Ish
The more you know, the more you know you ought to know
How long should a waster last?
Waster life significantly varies based on design and use AND how you take care of them over time.
Ideally, the waster should be made of hickory. This is due to the type of wood fibre/grain and how it reacts to repeated stress (impacts). Purpleheart has also been used in the past, but the fibre tends to "flake" over time. Other hardwoods like oak should be avoided is they can splinter/crack especially over time as they dry out.
Treatment: Oil, oil, oil. Part of curing and setting up a waster is both the initial and then occassional treatments of the wood. Initially (after sanding), put a couple of layers of boiled linseed oil (thinned with thinner/turpentine maybe 3:1). This will soak in very slowly. It is better to use a rag and rub a number of continued light coats. It will also take a few days to dry properly. If the mixture get's too thick, I've had some blades take a week in the sun to finally cure. The advantage is that this creates a sealed, harded surface. Opposing wasters slide off easier, and it resists surface scrapes better. Check your waster regulars and touch sand any spots showing problem areas. I usually take mine and lightly sand the "edges" once a year and give them a couple of light recoats of oil.
Using your waster. While edge on edge is unavoidable, try to refine your technique so that you avoid smashing edge to edge. (Parry and strike techniques.) Varying where and how you strike adds life. Repeatedly using the "sweetspot" (technical term for the lower, strong part of blade ignored for simplicity) will create a weakspot.
Design: Probably the two areas most prone to failure on wasters is the "sweetspot" and an improperly made crossguard that wasn't fitted right or (and most have now gone to this) pinned.
As to length of life? I've seen a couple early models that we use at the museum shatter in a couple of years. Mine have gone on for 4 years and are still ok. (And have repeatedly taken and given some brutal shots.) But one of mine is showing serious edge flattening over time and one has developed this truly odd 10 degree twist at the tip. Which is great for learning sword wrapping techniques but a little odd when you look at it.
Most of ours, btw, came from Christian Darcy at http://www.woodenswords.com
Between all of us in the group, I think we've ordered 30 or so plus other items from him. I think we've shattered only 2 or 3 wasters so far and those were the ones that were used bi-weekly and often in education demos.
BTW, we NEVER do wood on metal. Either wood vs metal blades or shields. So it saves the waster from early death. For metal we use metal. If you are looking to use your waster for safety concerns, foam/edge wrap your shield (garden hose or something).
[This message has been edited by Friedrich (edited 01-20-2003).]
Ideally, the waster should be made of hickory. This is due to the type of wood fibre/grain and how it reacts to repeated stress (impacts). Purpleheart has also been used in the past, but the fibre tends to "flake" over time. Other hardwoods like oak should be avoided is they can splinter/crack especially over time as they dry out.
Treatment: Oil, oil, oil. Part of curing and setting up a waster is both the initial and then occassional treatments of the wood. Initially (after sanding), put a couple of layers of boiled linseed oil (thinned with thinner/turpentine maybe 3:1). This will soak in very slowly. It is better to use a rag and rub a number of continued light coats. It will also take a few days to dry properly. If the mixture get's too thick, I've had some blades take a week in the sun to finally cure. The advantage is that this creates a sealed, harded surface. Opposing wasters slide off easier, and it resists surface scrapes better. Check your waster regulars and touch sand any spots showing problem areas. I usually take mine and lightly sand the "edges" once a year and give them a couple of light recoats of oil.
Using your waster. While edge on edge is unavoidable, try to refine your technique so that you avoid smashing edge to edge. (Parry and strike techniques.) Varying where and how you strike adds life. Repeatedly using the "sweetspot" (technical term for the lower, strong part of blade ignored for simplicity) will create a weakspot.
Design: Probably the two areas most prone to failure on wasters is the "sweetspot" and an improperly made crossguard that wasn't fitted right or (and most have now gone to this) pinned.
As to length of life? I've seen a couple early models that we use at the museum shatter in a couple of years. Mine have gone on for 4 years and are still ok. (And have repeatedly taken and given some brutal shots.) But one of mine is showing serious edge flattening over time and one has developed this truly odd 10 degree twist at the tip. Which is great for learning sword wrapping techniques but a little odd when you look at it.
Most of ours, btw, came from Christian Darcy at http://www.woodenswords.com
Between all of us in the group, I think we've ordered 30 or so plus other items from him. I think we've shattered only 2 or 3 wasters so far and those were the ones that were used bi-weekly and often in education demos.
BTW, we NEVER do wood on metal. Either wood vs metal blades or shields. So it saves the waster from early death. For metal we use metal. If you are looking to use your waster for safety concerns, foam/edge wrap your shield (garden hose or something).
[This message has been edited by Friedrich (edited 01-20-2003).]
If your fighting me it shouldn't last longer than 5 minutes 
Generally I would use a waster for skills training against another wooden waster.
Xander
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"Thats very shaky moral ground Kalten," Bevier said disapprovingly.
"I know" Kalten admitted. "That's why you have to run across the top of it so fast."
Generally I would use a waster for skills training against another wooden waster.
Xander
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"Thats very shaky moral ground Kalten," Bevier said disapprovingly.
"I know" Kalten admitted. "That's why you have to run across the top of it so fast."
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Shane Smith
- Archive Member
- Posts: 188
- Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2003 2:01 am
A waster is definitely not intended for use against either blunt steel or a metal-rimmed shield.It should only be used for non-contact drills through to,and including, moderately intense wood on wood applications.If used as intended,my oak wasters last through about a year of continual use.My fellow scholars' hickory wasters last much longer.Setting-aside drills really take a toll on wasters.Best regards...
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Shane Smith
ARMA~Virginia Beach
[This message has been edited by Shane Smith (edited 01-20-2003).]
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Shane Smith
ARMA~Virginia Beach
[This message has been edited by Shane Smith (edited 01-20-2003).]
Thanks guys.
I was getting discouraged with the amount of breakages I was getting (I have one left out of about 5, only lightly oiled and some of them tested against metal swords, shields and large trees
.
Although the experience has improved my wood working technique.
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Ish
The more you know, the more you know you ought to know
I was getting discouraged with the amount of breakages I was getting (I have one left out of about 5, only lightly oiled and some of them tested against metal swords, shields and large trees
.Although the experience has improved my wood working technique.
------------------
Ish
The more you know, the more you know you ought to know
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Shane Smith
- Archive Member
- Posts: 188
- Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2003 2:01 am
Uniquely,the ARMA approach requires that our members possess the martial skill of the Swordsman as well as the inquisitve mind of the Scholar.Without the very necessary study of the source-texts left to us by the Masters of old, any effort to re-discover the lost art of the sword would be prone to flawed interpretations and falsity of application.All ARMA Swordsmen must, as a matter of course, commit themselves to the pursuit of knowledge and understanding via the writings left to us in concert with our extensive hands-on work.For that reason we prefer to be called a "Scholar" of the sword,or simply "Swordsman".That is enough.Best regards...
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Shane Smith
ARMA~Virginia Beach
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Shane Smith
ARMA~Virginia Beach
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