Bascinet info.required.

Russ Thomas · Post by **Russ Thomas** » Sat May 29, 2004 12:59 am

Hello folks,

I was wondering if by any chance anybody knew of any information or a good photgraph of the bascinet in the Doges palace museum in Venice .The example that is all made in one piece and which flares out over the shoulders.It is a stunning piece of work by the look of it and I would love to know more about it .Any information would be very much appreciated.Thanyou.

Regards,

Russ

Jason Grimes · Post by **Jason Grimes** » Sat May 29, 2004 1:49 am

Hey Russ, good to see you again. I remember that helmet from somewhere. I want to say that I saw it in Ffoulkes' book. You can take a look on my site and see if it is there. If it is, please let me know so I can lable it correctly.

Alcyoneus · Post by **Alcyoneus** » Sat May 29, 2004 2:15 am

Great Bascinet, probably Italican c1400 Ducal Palace, Venice.Curtiss, 2500 Years of European Helmets, p 77.

Russ Thomas · Post by **Russ Thomas** » Sat May 29, 2004 7:59 am

Hello folks,

Wow ! That is a great website Jason,I saw much that I have never seen before,but not alas the bascinet from the Doges palace.If you mean Ffoulkes' ,"The Armourer and his Craft ",it is not in there.
I'll try and see if I can find you out a few oddities from my collection of photographs, and see if you can use them.
Ah yes,Curtis .........now that is very definately high on my wanted list of books,I unfortunately do not have a copy, but I'll keep hunting ! Does it say much about the helmet in there please ?

Thankyou for the infomation gentlemen,it is appreciated.

Regards as ever,

Russ

Erik Schmidt · Post by **Erik Schmidt** » Sat May 29, 2004 7:34 pm

<img src="http://home.armourarchive.org/members/erik/Greatbascinet_Venice.jpg">

It's a bad picture, sorry.

Erik

Alcyoneus · Post by **Alcyoneus** » Sat May 29, 2004 11:44 pm

It isn't real visible in this photo, but in addition to the holes around the edge of the helm, there is also a set of holes at about where the bottom of a normal bascinet would be.

Russ Thomas · Post by **Russ Thomas** » Sun May 30, 2004 2:35 am

Hello folks,

That is the one ! Thanks Erik,I would love to know more about this particular helmet. What an amazing piece of work ! BTW Erik,hvordan har du det ?

Many thanks for the infomation and pictures gentlemen,if there is anymore available I would very much appreciate it.

Regards ,

Russ

Erik Schmidt · Post by **Erik Schmidt** » Sun May 30, 2004 10:13 am

I'm great thanks Russ. I haven't worked on any plate armour lately though.

Have you made any single piece great bascinets yet?

I just realised I must have sent you my pictures of that helmet already. Unfortunately I haven't got any better ones since. I don't have any information about it either.

Erik

Russ Thomas · Post by **Russ Thomas** » Sun May 30, 2004 12:35 pm

Hi Erik,

You did send me several pictures of great bascinets Erik,but not that one.I would love to actually see this piece someday!

And I do have a couple of 'one piece ' helmets 'on the go',but not alas the bascinet yet.There always seems to be something else to do first ................... One day though !

regards,

Russ

Erik Schmidt · Post by **Erik Schmidt** » Sun May 30, 2004 7:04 pm

So Russel, are you actually going to try and raise a copy of that helmet from one piece?
Has anyone raised such a large, deep piece in modern times? It looks to me like it would require at least two people and special tooling, not to mention the amount of hammering.

I hope someone can at least come up with a good side shot and measurements for you to work from.

Maybe you should write to the museum in your capacity as armourer and fellow museum owner. I'm sure someone on the forum from Italy would happily translate your correspondence.

Erik

Russ Thomas · Post by **Russ Thomas** » Mon May 31, 2004 1:58 am

Hi Erik,

No Erik,I am not thinking of making this bascinet ! Thankfully,I value my sanity(what's left of it :lol:

),tooooooooo much to attempt this piece ! No I simply marvel at what a tour de force this piece is.I too would love to see a side view.Perhaps as you say ,I should approach the museum for some info.I'll see what I can do.

I did see some pictures from the Royal Armouries,taken when they were still in the 'Tower',of the late Russell Robinson raising a helmet from a rather considerable blank of metal,and there were if I remember correctly, five people working on it ! One heating it with a torch,one hammering it and three holding it down ! I have not attempted to work it out correctly,but I would guess that the starting blank to produce the example in the Doges palace would be about 1 metre across ! :shock:

The great bascinet that I think I may have a crack at when time allows,is the example in the British Museum,though this example lacks its visor.This is also a terrific example of the armourers craft. But at the moment I have two full harnesses that I am starting ,one being the Henry VIII 1520 foot combat armour,as well as a few other odd projects ,so it may be some time before I can get around to starting anything else for fun !

I'll let you know if I get hold of any info. from the Doges palace museum.

Regards as ever,

Russ

Parlan · Post by **Parlan** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 1:37 pm

You mean to say that is raised from one piece of metal!? :shock:

(insert long whistle here) that's amazing!

And the lines are stunningly graceful.

Erik Schmidt · Post by **Erik Schmidt** » Fri Jun 04, 2004 3:31 am

Russ, the British Museum example (if we are thinking of the same one) doesn't seem to be that much easier. It's also single piece, but just shorter at the front and sides.

Parlan, I assume it to be one piece since there are no obvious joins, but there is always the possibility that it was forge welded in part.

Erik