for those interested in step by step sword making

Matt Stagmer · Post by **Matt Stagmer** » Mon Jan 24, 2005 6:18 pm

<IMG src="http://www.baltimoreknife.com/bksflame.jpg">
hello my name is matt. i live in maryland and have been making swords now for about 6 years. i am only 22 years old but i have been soaked in blade making knowledge since i was very young.

What i am going to do for all of you guys out there wondering what it takes to put together a quality combat ready sword is.. i am going to try and do a step by step ... from start to finish... pictorial and explaination of a "saber/cutlass". the technique that i am going to use is stock removal. which means i will start from a blade blank and grind away untill i get the shape i desire. i will also show how I make a custom guard and a custom pommel !

i am sure that everyone will enjoy this and i plan on getting started first thing tom. morning !

if anyone wants to see something particular i suggest you post now before i get into the project.

i plan on making this a mid-high end peice that will still be intended for full stage combat use and will be fully garenteed by us for life of the maker (me). should be alot of fun and i hope that it peeks the intrest of a few of you !!!

matt !

DAVID01 · Post by **DAVID01** » Mon Jan 24, 2005 6:27 pm

I am VERY interested in this, I have wanted to try to make a viking typ sword with the Fist or trilobe pommel. I would like to make a blade like Paul Binns Tea Cosy Viking Sword.

Kaliban · Post by **Kaliban** » Mon Jan 24, 2005 6:39 pm

about time you made something .. need stuff for the house as well hehehe

Well I can back this man and his skills up . .. His brother was my mentor in makeing armor an well swords . .. but stuck with the armor .. He makes great looking blades an a few of them were used this past year at the MD Ren Fest wit hthe jousting troup .. hope you all like ..

ROC · Post by **ROC** » Tue Jan 25, 2005 12:13 pm

yes ! we all love this sort of thing.

ROC

knitebee · Post by **knitebee** » Tue Jan 25, 2005 2:22 pm

Matt count me in. Are you going to cover such dark secrets as tuning the center of percusion in the blade?

Brain

Mike Garrett (Orc) · Post by **Mike Garrett (Orc)** » Tue Jan 25, 2005 2:25 pm

Gimme!
If using spring steel, will you cover keeping the metal cool enough during stock removal so tha the properties of the steel are unaffected?

Matt Stagmer · Post by **Matt Stagmer** » Tue Jan 25, 2005 4:26 pm

Sorry it took me so long to get set up. here is a photo of the "kit" that i will be starting from. in this picture you will be able to see the cutlass blade blank , the cutlass guard blank and the round stock that is the begining of the pommel that will first be turned on our lathe and then will have hollow ground facets added ! when i start a project such as this i tend to leave the outcome a little open. so i am not sure exactly how the blade will turn out or what handle fittings will be used !

<A href="http://www.baltimoreknife.com/mattspro1.jpg" target=_new><IMG src="http://www.baltimoreknife.com/mattspro1.jpg" width=512 height=384></a>

The first step that i will be doing is roughing an edge and then sending out for heat treating. we use a medium carbon alloy that has tested over the years to hold up the best after a long life of hard use !

<a href="http://www.baltimoreknife.com/mattspro2.jpg" target=_new><IMG src="http://www.baltimoreknife.com/mattspro2.jpg" width=512 height=384></a>

here i use downward passes while using my thumb on the inside of the wheel to gain stablity. We do more flat grinding then we do hollow on the edges to keep some mass for the guys who beat the heck out of them.

<a href="http://www.baltimoreknife.com/mattspro3.jpg" target=_new><IMG src="http://www.baltimoreknife.com/mattspro3.jpg" width=512 height=384></a>
off to be heat treated !!!

(Edit by JT to shrink images so they don't wreck table-display. Click on image for the full-size version)

Matt Stagmer · Post by **Matt Stagmer** » Wed Jan 26, 2005 9:00 am

the blade is now finished being heat treated and I am ready to start putting the finished edge and any other detial i want before polish. From here out it will be very important that i quinch in a oil/water mixed tank in order to keep the temper right where i want it ! while grinding any blade that has already been tempered you have to be realy carefull not get the metal too hot. this means you dont ever want to see any color change. it can be very easy to throw the temper off while removing mass of metal from the edge , this is why i do the bulk of the edge grinding before the tempering !

-matt

Thomas Powers · Post by **Thomas Powers** » Wed Jan 26, 2005 11:20 am

Matt is that picture the state you sent it to heat treat at? If so how thick is the blank?

The originals I have seen have a much more tapered grind to them---helps reduce the weight and as you mentioned *much* easier to grind before heat treat!

Thomas

Matt Stagmer · Post by **Matt Stagmer** » Wed Jan 26, 2005 12:58 pm

ah ! i started from a 3/16 blank ! the last picture on there is infact the state that i sent it to be heat treated ! like i said i wanted to get the mass away from the edge. not finish the grind totaly. i tend to quench after every pass anyway so for me working in pre tempered stock doesnt matter. I plan on taking a chunk more off. stick around too see.

as a reminder. i am making a combat ready ,stage combat ,to be used ...cutlass/saber. So i am not trying for a 100% authentic look. more like a 90% authentic look

first goal is to make it stand up against every day use ! 2nd is to make it look great !

also i could turn this peice into a crazy high end piece but i am shooting for a 300.00 $ - 375.00 $. so i cant afford to take a long time and make it 100% authentic !

matt

KerryStagmer · Post by **KerryStagmer** » Wed Jan 26, 2005 1:06 pm

just an note about the heat treating...

For this size blade we are using a 1550 degF salt bath (sent out to a commercial heat treater) that is then quenched in oil and finally cooled in water.

Our target hardness is 48-50 Rc as we mostly make rebated blades and they have to be tough, not sharp

The grind you see is left simple with a thick edge until after hardening. Everyone has a different opinion how far to grind before heat treating, much of it has to do with the type of machine your using and how you keep it cool. If your using a hand grinder more pregrind might be in order, to the other extreme a commercial planer blade is ground completely after hardening under a constant coolant flow (much like production knives are made)

For more direct questions on Heat treating you could talk to the forumite Kaliban as he works at the heat treater we use most often.

There will be a big difference once matt starts finishing the blade, im sure you will see!

Mike England · Post by **Mike England** » Wed Jan 26, 2005 1:12 pm

You 3 have too much time on your hands.

Maybe you should work some horse armor.

Matt Stagmer · Post by **Matt Stagmer** » Wed Jan 26, 2005 2:48 pm

this is the next step after getting the blade back from heat treating. i made the front edge much wider as well as sanded the flat ! i also added a back edge or a "false edge" to reduce weight at the tip of the blade. this creates a much faster feel as well as creates a 2nd cutting edge ! the next step is the polish ! and then file work !

<a href="http://www.baltimoreknife.com/mattspro4.jpg" target=_new><IMG src="http://www.baltimoreknife.com/mattspro4.jpg" width=512 height=137></a>

(Edit by JT to shrink images so they don't wreck table-display. Click on image for the full-size version)

Kaliban · Post by **Kaliban** » Wed Jan 26, 2005 5:02 pm

Nss we do not have to much time on our hands .. i know when i have work from them as I find it on the coffee table when i go to work in the morning .. and as much as I enjoy heat treating .. doing a freinds stuff is much more stressful .. cause if you do not get it right you will hear about it

hehe

Kaliban

DAVID01 · Post by **DAVID01** » Wed Jan 26, 2005 5:23 pm

How much does a belt grinder like that run?

Kaliban · Post by **Kaliban** » Wed Jan 26, 2005 5:33 pm

The ones he uses .. well i think the lowest price one he was able to get (at an auction) was about 900 or so .. i havent even asked what they are new .. but they are fun to work with ..

KerryStagmer · Post by **KerryStagmer** » Wed Jan 26, 2005 7:18 pm

the grinders we use are quite spendy , over $3000 new i think, but a good table top machine like that can be purchased around $1000 US new. I'm sure this will start some kinda grinder debate but im 100% a Bader grinder fan. I cant recomend anything else , i own 4 of these machines (all be it the huge versions) and run the hell out of them. they are 2hp and i consider that a minimum for power if you want to do this full time. Matt often loads up a 2 hp while roughing blades

What we have are call Bader Spacesavers (they are very large, go figure) but the table top units are BIII and use all the same basic components.

The company gives fantastic support and are just great to buy from/work with

DAVID01 · Post by **DAVID01** » Wed Jan 26, 2005 7:23 pm

KerryStagmer, Have you ever thought about making a dvd or vhs of making a sword for those of us who would like to see this siep by step and be able to refer back to it? PLEASE :oops:

Matt Stagmer · Post by **Matt Stagmer** » Thu Jan 27, 2005 8:52 am

never have done a video. but i am doing my best to give a little insight on these forums !

while polishing the blade i also started work on the gaurd. as you can see in this picture, i first sanded the flats of the guard and now am dishing the entire piece on our skrew press. I have been blessed by having this piece of equipment. for the most part i am never forced to pick up a hammer and a stump to achieve a dished piece. not all of the forming for this guard will be done by the press. some good hammer and anvil work will be needed to create the proper look.
<a href="http://www.baltimoreknife.com/mattspro5.jpg" target=_new><IMG src="http://www.baltimoreknife.com/mattspro5.jpg" width=384 height=512> </a>

these guards start off 3/16. so dishing without a press will be tuff. doing this process hot maybe the best answer for a lot of you. of course the guards could start off in a thinner material , but i think that takes away from the look. if using a press be sure to start the dish on the outside of your piece and work your way towards the middle. this helps prevent any crushing and warping that could accure if not dished correctly.

matt

(Edit by JT to shrink images so they don't wreck table-display. Click on image for the full-size version)

Robert P. Norwalt · Post by **Robert P. Norwalt** » Thu Jan 27, 2005 9:40 am

Do you have your blanks plasma cut. That's a nice guard. What steel is your sword blank made from? Do you anneal, and then keep your grind cooled? Nice opperation. I too give kudo's to the wonders of the screw press. :idea:

KerryStagmer · Post by **KerryStagmer** » Thu Jan 27, 2005 10:06 am

we have our own cnc plasma table. 80 amp head will cut to 1" steel max and 3/4" aluminum. for the thinner metals there is a fine cutting head that makes amazing cuts

In this case the blade is of Chromoly, if it were to be for a sharpened sword we would most likely use 1075 or 5160. I find the the high carbon levels of those steels unsuitable for long term hard 'bashers' as they work harden

ps nice site robert! gives great info of what your about right from the start... How do you like that plansihing hammer? I've seen them for sale but havent seen one running yet, we have an old Goram Silver spring hammer and English wheel from planishing, but ive wondered about the new ones

Robert P. Norwalt · Post by **Robert P. Norwalt** » Thu Jan 27, 2005 12:15 pm

I've made 'em in every Hi C Alloy, tool steel, and I say I like 15n20 and 52100 series the best, for final result. For forgeability, and painintheassology, no. I also prefer the 10 series plow shear steels, 5160's for shear ease of forgeing, hardening and tempering uniformity. And to top that off, they are cheaper (usually) and more excessible if your scrounging in a bone yard.

That little red plainishing "hammer" is really more of a fab shop deal. I use it to get out dings, but not that hot for shaping. If your wanting to go with production work, get a bigger one. I have a HUGE plainishing HAMMER by Jim Claar of New Lisbon Indiana, and it is a dream machine. Once I get it set up in the new shop, I will give you a report on a 10 hour day process for helm halves and shield bosses.

Thanks about the site. It' need's work and polish, and I haven't updated the "catolog". But I will soon.

see ya's

Robert.

Matt Stagmer · Post by **Matt Stagmer** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 4:19 pm

these pictures dont seem to project the true shine. but i assure you that the polish is all the way too a full buff !
<a href="http://www.baltimoreknife.com/mattspro6.jpg" target=_new><IMG src="http://www.baltimoreknife.com/mattspro6.jpg" width=510 height=67></a>
<a href="http://www.baltimoreknife.com/mattspro7.jpg" target=_new><IMG src="http://www.baltimoreknife.com/mattspro7.jpg" width=494 height=103></a>

the blade is now in polish...next step is any "extra detail" that i would like to add. in this case i am going to create a serrated edge on the back of the blade. After that i plan on adding an engraving of some sort. I have not yet decided on that though.

matt

*be back soon with next pic*

(Edit by JT to shrink the images to a reasonable size. Click on picture to see full-size version)

Matt Stagmer · Post by **Matt Stagmer** » Sun Jan 30, 2005 7:36 pm

sorry that this has been so drawn out. here in Maryland we have been pounded with snow. tends to shut things down for me. since i drive a 88 5.0 mustang. I dont get around in snow and ice to well.

hopefully i can finish this piece out for you guys on monday.

matt

Matt Stagmer · Post by **Matt Stagmer** » Tue Feb 01, 2005 5:55 pm

did not get a chance to engrave this beast yet...but i did finish the back edge

turned out pretty good. what do you think ?

<IMG src="http://www.baltimoreknife.com/mattsprofinal.jpg">

this was done by carfully using a smal grinding wheel on an angle. takes big balls to do this after polish but i think if you do it before polish it looses the sharpness.

matt

Thomas Powers · Post by **Thomas Powers** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 4:41 am

I'm a big bader fan too---the crazy things you can do slack belt grinding on one---not safe but very effective...You can get contact wheels ranging from 12" to 1/2" making grinding fullers a lot easier.

What I love about screw presses is they are *quiet* and fast when you want to tweak things around.---bought a large old one at an industrial auction for $50, cost me $35 to have it loaded on my truck!

Thomas

Matt Stagmer · Post by **Matt Stagmer** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 3:26 pm

I decided to engrave a passage from the old testimate.

"And my wrath shall wax hot, and I will kill you with the sword ;
And your wives shall be widows, and your children fatherless"

KJV Exodus 22:24

here are some good pictures of the process

<IMG src="http://www.baltimoreknife.com/mattsprograve1.jpg">

<IMG src="http://www.baltimoreknife.com/mattsprograve2.jpg">

<IMG src="http://www.baltimoreknife.com/mattsprograve3.jpg">

<IMG src="http://www.baltimoreknife.com/mattsprograve4.jpg">

believe it or not...this was my first time using this machine. my older brother Kerry has done the engraving in the past but I thought it was time for me to step up !

any q's ?
matt

Trevor · Post by **Trevor** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 6:21 pm

Very cool!

Now-how'd you do the flaming sword thing? :twisted:

Kaliban · Post by **Kaliban** » Thu Feb 03, 2005 4:38 pm

ahh that is a carefully guarded secret

I have seen it an its interesting ..

Mike England · Post by **Mike England** » Thu Feb 03, 2005 5:01 pm

I think the bigger trick with the flaming sword was finding a sucker to hold it for the picture.

Kaliban · Post by **Kaliban** » Thu Feb 03, 2005 5:40 pm

yep an we know the sucker well hehe

Matt Stagmer · Post by **Matt Stagmer** » Sat Feb 26, 2005 6:03 pm

<3 so sorry that i lost pace on this project. The start of our ren fair season came and i had to get orders or rapiers out. i will be buisy from now till end of november but i will do my best to have this sword complete by wensday of this coming week. should end up being a stunning piece.

once agian sorry.

for those interested in step by step sword making

for those interested in step by step sword making

day 1

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...

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engraved