getting started as a fighter checklist (SCA)

brookswift · Post by **brookswift** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 1:53 pm

so i'm not exactly a cup connoisseur... what's the difference between a bike cup and a hockey (or other type) or cup? what i've heard is that the hockey cup is best, why is that?

btw, i have a codpiece the cup would go into. the plan right now is to get a cup to put into the codpiece. i'll have a friend take a picture of me in the padding suit eventually so i can show you guys what i mean. it's rather difficult to take my own picture in it. no good mirrors around here.

Kilkenny · Post by **Kilkenny** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 2:30 pm

Martukka wrote:Greetings and welcome my fellow newbie.

10) Shield (many places require sword and shield authorization first...poor wording can allow for other forms first like in the EK)
13) Cleats for melee, sturdy boots or sneakers for practice and the list

Joachim

I'm going to disagree with one item on your list - cleats. It's a personal choice item, but I think in our game cleats are a good way to get a wrecked knee.

And I have to ask what you mean to say with number 10. I can say that for many years in the East our rules have permitted the first authorization to be in any form, and that our rules have also stated clearly (at other times) that sword and shield was the required first form. It's not a matter of poor wording, or ambiguity. We've gone back and forth on it a time or two, as different Earl Marshalls held differing opinions on the matter, but I don't think it's ever been a case of poor wording leaving it unclear.

Gavin

Kilkenny · Post by **Kilkenny** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 2:43 pm

InsaneIrish wrote:[quote="brookswiftFrieman:

I have never heard of a "college" being designed to go dorment. They certainly DO go dorment from time to time due to graduation and lack of interest, but I dont' think they are Designed to do that.

As I recall the entire reason for the "college" category of branch is that it is allowed to go dormant. Again, from memory, it was introduced as an alternative to the canton and meant for use for subgroups within Baronies which could be expected to have a cyclical activity level.

Gavin

AlvarCadiz · Post by **AlvarCadiz** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 7:15 pm

Brookswift,

Welcome to the West Kingdom.

There used to be a Copeland's Sports on Shattuck near Andronico's Market (North Berkeley 10 min Walk from the NW corner of Campus). It may be gone?

You can probably kill the rest of you break in search of armor pics in the Library. Quick search of Armor as a subject turned up 459 entries Also ILL is easy especially if the UC system has it at one of the schools.

For those of you worried about the Marshal issue at BART. I would guess that on a typical night there is at least one senior Marshal and a few advanced marshals on hand. I know here in Sac usually 1/3 of the fighters are marshals.

I wish we had heard from you last week. We could have got you up to the Boar Hunt in El Cerrito.

I had a really hard time making BART practice when I was a student. I hope you get more in armor time than I did. Follow Irish's advice-- Study. Also remember there are at least five departments that offer Medieval topics!

Alvar

Joachim · Post by **Joachim** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 7:51 pm

Kilkenny wrote:
Martukka wrote:Greetings and welcome my fellow newbie.

10) Shield (many places require sword and shield authorization first...poor wording can allow for other forms first like in the EK)
13) Cleats for melee, sturdy boots or sneakers for practice and the list

Joachim

I'm going to disagree with one item on your list - cleats. It's a personal choice item, but I think in our game cleats are a good way to get a wrecked knee.

And I have to ask what you mean to say with number 10. I can say that for many years in the East our rules have permitted the first authorization to be in any form, and that our rules have also stated clearly (at other times) that sword and shield was the required first form. It's not a matter of poor wording, or ambiguity. We've gone back and forth on it a time or two, as different Earl Marshalls held differing opinions on the matter, but I don't think it's ever been a case of poor wording leaving it unclear.

Gavin

I stand corrected. Please forgive me. Being new, I must go by what I can read and those choice bits that I can entice from others.

I choose cleats for now because my first event included a slip which landed me on the point of my bascinet which wrenched my neck and stunned me. Moving forward from that, I chose the lesser of evils. My neck is more important than my knees IMO. That position will likely change as I grow more comfortable with the nature of the game and my footwork improves.

After re-reading those documents, which I now realize are society rules, I must have glazed over somewhere in there. Interpretation isn't really my place as I am so new and I shall work to refrain from it for the near future. I would guess that situations like this cause a great deal of misunderstanding.

I thank you for sharing your wisdom.

Joachim

Blaine de Navarre · Post by **Blaine de Navarre** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 8:51 pm

brookswift wrote:so i'm not exactly a cup connoisseur... what's the difference between a bike cup and a hockey (or other type) or cup? what i've heard is that the hockey cup is best, why is that?

Most male SCA fighters wear a fairly ordinary style of cup that can be gotten at any sporting goods store, or the sporting goods section of Target, "Bike" is the brand name you'll see the most, but there are others. Almost everyone finds these entirely adequate.

There are also more expensive "high performance" cups. There are two factors that make some better than others: 1) better coverage and 2) they stay put better.

If you're on a starving student budget, you can probably safely skip the $30 plus shipping for a HP cup.

Scott · Post by **Scott** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 9:04 pm

I was going to post about marshals at practices in these parts, but I see His Highness beat me to it. He is absolutely correct. The percent of fighters who are also authorized marshals is pretty high around here. I would hazard a guess that nearly a quarter of all of the active mid-level & higher fighters are marshals.

Brookswift,
I'll be at BART next week and would be happy to answer any questions you have. To echo what many have said, I wouldn't run out and buy everything right away until you have talked with some experienced fighters and figure out just what it is you need. You will need a cup, though. They usually come with a jockstrap as well. I wouldn't worry about getting rattan before Thursday since you probably won't have a basket hilt or gauntlets to use with it. When you are ready to get some, the Canning Shop is in your area.

Cleats, btw, are going to be worse than useless at BART practice. (we fight on the pavement there)

- Scott

brookswift · Post by **brookswift** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 9:40 pm

yeah, actually, i already have two basket hilts (left and right hand) that i use with shinai. i went out and bought a cup today, so i should be all set. i'll be wearing my moving pad gambeson and (if i can get it to fit) a lorica that's extended around my hips and down to my knees. i haven't finished the gauntlets i'm working on, but i have been promised some loaner armor for next week to fill out the holes in my armoring stock. my padding has a codpiece for the cup i bought as well. i'm still working on it and all, but it works pretty well so far.

canning shop? what's that?

oh, and alvar, i would have loved to make it last week to practice, but i do ballroom dance and our last practice of the semester was on thursday night, so i had to go learn my last tango moves of the semester. what's a boar hunt? i have friends who have hunted and cooked wild boar, but i imagine that's a different thing.

as for the cleats thing. right now i wear basic combat boots and they work great on whatever ground you happen to be near. they also appear somewhat period, being a basic leather half boot.

Scott · Post by **Scott** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 10:10 pm

Brookswift,
The Caning Shop is on Gilman. That's where weirdos go to buy supplies for caning (chairs, etc.) and where normal people like us can go get rattan for making swords and other weapons for use in SCA combat.

The minimum diameter for a sword is 1.25", after taping. Some people like heavier (thicker) sticks and some like minimum diameter sticks. Some take larger diameter sticks and plane the sides down to 1.25". Most people shape their grips somewhat, some don't. Those that do shape them have different preferences as to what shape they like. Some people spiral wrap their sticks and some use strips along the length. Some put a single layer of tape on, some put (too) many layers on. Some like a 36" stick and others use a 42" stick. This is why I didn't say, "Go to the caning shop and buy a piece of rattan and make a sword." It is easier to explain these things in person, show you examples of swords made by different people, etc. Then you can go and make an informed purchase.

Lots of people use combat boots. I started off using the East German Officers Boots ($20) from surplas stores and from the Sportsman's Guide catalog. I'm now using Chipawa motorcycle cop boots. Some people wear period turnshoes. As long as you aren't wearing sneakers, you should be OK. :-)

The boar hunt is an anual event where one or more fighters will play a boar and go out and hide. They are armed with a pair of maces. Other fighters will be hunters and they are armed with spears. Still more fighters are hounds, and they are armed with just a single dagger. Unarmoured participants are dogs and they are used as scouts. The hunters send them into the underbrush, around buildings, up hills, etc. to look for the boars. The dogs and hounds can talk to each other but can only bark to the hunters. When they find a boar, they alert the hunters by barking a lot.

- Scott

brookswift · Post by **brookswift** » Fri Dec 16, 2005 10:13 pm

cool, sounds like a lot of fun. it's too bad i missed it. i'll see you next thursday though. i'll be easy to recognize as my padding and armor are both green.

Koredono · Post by **Koredono** » Sat Dec 17, 2005 12:08 am

Kilkenny wrote:
Martukka wrote:Greetings and welcome my fellow newbie.

10) Shield (many places require sword and shield authorization first...poor wording can allow for other forms first like in the EK)
13) Cleats for melee, sturdy boots or sneakers for practice and the list

Joachim

I'm going to disagree with one item on your list - cleats. It's a personal choice item, but I think in our game cleats are a good way to get a wrecked knee.

And yet, from personal experience, mine is the exact opposite opinion: ever since I stopped fighting in steel-toed engineer boots (a command from my knight, who said it made my footwork too slow) I've fought in cleats on grass/dirt/&c, and the few times I wasn't wearing them, be it melee or tourney, was when I'd gotten knee issues. Mind you, these are rubber soccer cleats, which are designed for running around and making quick turns on grass.

Kilkenny wrote:And I have to ask what you mean to say with number 10. I can say that for many years in the East our rules have permitted the first authorization to be in any form, and that our rules have also stated clearly (at other times) that sword and shield was the required first form. It's not a matter of poor wording, or ambiguity. We've gone back and forth on it a time or two, as different Earl Marshalls held differing opinions on the matter, but I don't think it's ever been a case of poor wording leaving it unclear.

Gavin

His Grace is more learned than I on that particular point (I believe he was East EM before I joined?), but from what I've been told it's true that that rule has changed back and forth over the past 30 or so years (my knight fought sword and shield exactly once, because he was required to to authorize in other forms), but when I joined it was not a requirement, merely a strong suggestion (I fought it on and off, mostlyoff, for a couple of years before giving it up completely for more than a decade). In Ãƒâ€ thelmearc we do not require sword and shield be the first form you authorize in (right now, ~35 of Ãƒâ€ thelmearc's ~550 authorized combattants are not authorized in sword and shield at all) because, like every other form, it's just not for everyone, be it personal preference or interpretation of persona.

Richard Blackmoore · Post by **Richard Blackmoore** » Sat Dec 17, 2005 3:09 pm

Before my first fight practice, I read all the rules and regulations for the armour, weapons and combat. so I'd have a clue as to how it worked. At my first practice I showed up well prepared with all items needed including a cup and supporter. I also brought a case of beer and a cute brunette. They offered to loan me practice armour and spent part of the practice modifying it to fit, went over basic offense and defense and drank beer and told stories while I watched the others fight.

At the second practice I brought less beer but also brought a busty, cute blonde. At that practice we finished getting the loaner armour to fit as well as we could, got sword that worked OK. I fought for the first time and authorized in sword and shield. Three weeks later I fought at my first Pennsic (got killed quickly and often but it was fun).

It's a lot like boy scouts or life. Be prepared. God helps those that help themselves.

brookswift · Post by **brookswift** » Sat Dec 17, 2005 3:42 pm

lol, yes, beer is the great friend maker, but i can't buy the stuff for another year. now, if only i could convince a blondle or a brunette to come to fighter practice with me....

Blaine de Navarre · Post by **Blaine de Navarre** » Sat Dec 17, 2005 4:09 pm

brookswift wrote:now, if only i could convince a blondle or a brunette to come to fighter practice with me....

Just tell 'em you can hook 'em up with real live knights in shining armour...

Euric Germanicus · Post by **Euric Germanicus** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 5:46 pm

Pffft, the knights get all the fun!

Tell them the squires all look like Brad Pitt in Troy......because hell we do!

brookswift · Post by **brookswift** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 5:58 pm

i've had more luck convincing them to come to dance for some reason... maybe it has to do with that, ahem, personal connection you get to make with them