Working on my Kit

DeCalmont · Post by **DeCalmont** » Sat Jun 24, 2006 10:53 pm

Well, after seeing a rather excellent event recently here in Ansteorra (The Lysts at Castleton) I have been inspired to work on my kit making it look more presentable. I would like to be able to go to a Pas or Demo and not be ashamed of my kit.

We had just finished playing around in the backyard for awhile and I forgot to put my gorget back on so it looks a little sloppy there which it normally wouldn't.

Any feedback would be appreciated.

olafr · Post by **olafr** » Sun Jun 25, 2006 2:58 am

It looks very nice. You don't have to feel ashamed of that!

Gerhard von Liebau · Post by **Gerhard von Liebau** » Sun Jun 25, 2006 3:14 am

It does look very nice, I'd say. As far as an initial impression goes, I believe you have yours down. Now I think a good aspect to focus on upgrades in would be historically related. Most blatant in the image shown, I can see that getting a nice, accurate belt would be a good idea.

I can't tell what your footgear is, but if it's boots, I'd get rid of them and replace them with period turnshoes, most likely those from Revival, with the rubber soles if you fancy that for actual use. A pair of steel frontal greaves would be a splendid addition to that all, especially since your nice surcoat already covers most of the rest of the leg, which should negate any want for chausses for use during combat if you have them.

Other than that, I can't tell much that should be changed or added, really. Do you have more close-up pictures so that the quality of your gear can more easily be assessed? A recommendation for using more period-appropriate materials for such things as your surcoat or other visible garb would be in order, if it's not already something that you've managed (again, I can't tell from the images).

Maybe you could also list out what you DO wear, as well as providing the additional images.

Cheers, and good luck!

-Gregory-

adamstjohn · Post by **adamstjohn** » Sun Jun 25, 2006 4:03 am

Looks great!

Again, it's hard to tell from the pictures, but the way your mail hangs looks like there might be no padded clothing under it. Having that "mail over padding"' silhouette is always critical for me.

Cheers!

Fearghus Macildubh · Post by **Fearghus Macildubh** » Sun Jun 25, 2006 7:18 am

You've got nothing to be ashamed of! Anything you do to improve your kit now will be to move it from looks authentic to the average SCAdian to being really authentic. Using linen and wool, using copies of extant examples for belt fittings, that sort of thing.

Duncan · Post by **Duncan** » Sun Jun 25, 2006 8:30 am

I like where you are going with your kit.

audax · Post by **audax** » Sun Jun 25, 2006 2:11 pm

Great kit, my fellow Ansteorran. Rather a lot like what I am aiming at.

As soon as I get most of my kit together, I'll post a pic.

audax

William Lee · Post by **William Lee** » Sun Jun 25, 2006 2:38 pm

Your kit looks quite knightly, in a circa 1300-1315 kind of way. I especially like the fan crest and ailettes.

DeCalmont · Post by **DeCalmont** » Sun Jun 25, 2006 8:10 pm

Thanks for the critiques so far, keep em coming!

I wanted to mention that this is for SCA combat so there are some compromises for that obviously. I'm not wearing a padded undergarment mainly because I live in far south Texas and heatstroke or padded garment is a choice here...I decided against the heatstroke.

Let's see;

Shoes are from Revival without a vibram sole (which I may get put on)

Knee and elbow cops are soupcan style from Lewis Moore

Leather vambraces

Red Leather suede shin guards over hard plastic catchers legs

Belt is intergrated with the kidney protection

Finger Gauntlets by Clay Moore

Maille is butted maille (someday would love to afford riveted maille) from Kingslance <ebay purchase>

Aillettes are sole bend leather water hardened then baked and painted

Helm is one of the first ones Steve of Forth Castle was offering

Crest is two layers of sole bend leather sewn together then water hardened and baked, mantle is red and black linen/rayon

Undertunic is linen/rayon

Surcoat is a cotton twill which I plan on replacing with a linen one which will also be a about 4 inches longer.

All of this is trying to reflect a "1300ish" time frame. I'll try to get some more pictures later.

Glen K · Post by **Glen K** » Mon Jun 26, 2006 11:02 am

An excellent looking kit! You've picked a very sweet period. Kudos to you, too, for wearing a fully-enclosed helm.

Duncan · Post by **Duncan** » Mon Jun 26, 2006 11:32 am

DeCalmont wrote:Thanks for the critiques so far, keep em coming!

I wanted to mention that this is for SCA combat so there are some comprimises for that obviously. I'm not wearing a padded undergarment mainly because I live in far south Texas and heatstroke or padded garment is a choice here...I decided against the heatstroke.

Let's see;

Shoes are from Revival without a vibram sole (which I may fix)

Knees and elbows are soupcan style from Lewis Moore

Red Leather shin guards over hard plastic catchers legs

Belt is intergrated with the kidney protection

Finger Gauntlets by Clay Moore

Mail is butted maille (someday would love to afford riveted maille)

Aillettes are sole bend leather water hardened then baked and painted

Helm is one of the first ones Steve of Forth Castle was offering

Crest is two layers of sole bend leather sewn together then water hardened and baked, mantle is red and black linen/rayon

Undertunic is linen/rayon

Surcoat is a cotton twill which I plan on replacing with a linen one which will also be a about 4 inches longer.

All of this is trying to reflect a "1300ish" time frame. I'll try to get some more pictures later.

I would go with full plate front greeves eventually. Splinted or other composite shin armor seems to be more of a mid century thing. Same with the arms.

InsaneIrish · Post by **InsaneIrish** » Mon Jun 26, 2006 12:10 pm

very nicely done! You have the exact same greathelm I own. Your particular helm is very distinctive and has a pretty specific time frame. I have been doing a little research off and on about that helm and have picked up a couple pics of Effigies with that helm in them.

For the life of me I can't remember what that helm is called, but I know it is named after the person's effigy it first was seen in (effigy-1 below).

Hope these help with your representation.

DeCalmont · Post by **DeCalmont** » Mon Jun 26, 2006 12:34 pm

Thanks Irish, effigy-2 is Rodger de Trumpington I believe...no accounting for my spelling. I've looked that one over pretty often actually.

That's the first time I've seen effigy-1. I guess finding the name of that effigy will be the $100 question then. Thanks for the additional information!

Glen, thanks. I really despise bar-grills for myself, although my other kit I use a burgonet with a partial bar-grill. I use that one when I am being a combat archer because I like the visibility and air flow...I tend to run alot as an archer.

Duncan, I was contemplating going with some tooled leather greaves and arms when I remake these which I think should be right around that period as well.

Gest · Post by **Gest** » Thu Jun 29, 2006 5:22 pm

Grace be with you, DeCalmont.

You have made inspiring and excellent progress in assembling your kit. I especially enjoyed learning the provenance of the various items in your kit. Your list omitted your maille and arm defences. I would enjoy your comments on those items, as I did with the other parts of your kit.

You have inspired me to likewise inventory my kit, and do homage to those who helped me assemble it.

- Gest

DeCalmont · Post by **DeCalmont** » Thu Jun 29, 2006 10:36 pm

Peace be upon you brother Gest,

Thank you for your comments, and thanks to all who have commented as it helps me to make sure I'm going in the direction I think I'm going. I've edited the above list to make sure I've stated where I got a particular item. If there isn't a name after an item then I made or assembled that item.

It always helps to find out why people have done what they have, that way we can learn too. I've enjoyed putting this kit together and I look forward to making it even better as I learn more.

I've tried to put together a kit as close to the early 1300's as I could given SCA rules and guidelines. I've made some compromises that I can live with to meet that end, but I also realize that it does take away from a more accurate portrayal.

T. Finkas · Post by **T. Finkas** » Sat Jul 01, 2006 7:26 am

Consider gamboised cuisses to attach your soupcan knees to. Very period and perhaps fairly decent as far as sca-combat effectiveness goes.

Here's some pics for you:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v87/f ... uisse1.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v87/f ... uisse2.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v87/f ... uisse3.jpg

I may be casting up a batch of Roger de Trumpington belt fittings soon, let me know if you are interested. These would be the same ones I used to offer under my business name Historical Stud & Buckle Company. I'm currently getting updated costing from the foundry so I hope to announce pricing and availability soon.

Cheers,
Tim

Jehan de Pelham · Post by **Jehan de Pelham** » Sat Jul 01, 2006 10:37 am

God Keep You deCalmont, that's a nice-looking harness, and very excellent as I haven't seen so many early 14th century efforts. Thanks and keep striving!

John
Jehan de Pelham, esquire and servant of Sir Vitus
www.mron.org

Konstantin the Red · Post by **Konstantin the Red** » Sun Jul 02, 2006 5:39 am

Pic 2 is Roger de Trumpington, who is, like, totally famous.

I hadn't seen Pic 1 before, but you can read down the right side that hic iacet Wills de Staunton miles filius Galfridde -- "Here lies Will[i]s de Staunton, knight, son of Galfridde." They are using that really oldfashioned form of S that looks like a lowercase f without a crossbar -- another form of which looks like the soundholes on a cello -- that f-thingie only with a long tail below the line, curling back like a modern J, which letterform they didn't have then. English didn't quit using that form until the latest eighteenth century. On the lefthand side I can make out most of a date that would be either 1226 or 1326, depending on how extensive the blank spot below it really is. I'm not good enough at Latin to really puzzle out the rest, but it's a typical sort of funerary inscription for an English knight.

Irish, both memorials have sugarloaf helms, Staunton's being more advanced of form.

DeCalmont · Post by **DeCalmont** » Mon Jul 03, 2006 10:11 pm

Tim, thank you very much for the information. I think I'm going to work out a pair this weekend and see how they do. I would be very interested in the Trumpington belt fittings if you decide to cast some.

Jehan, may Gods grace keep you safe especially whilst thou are still in Outremer. I thank you for your compliments. I truly love the early 14th century.

Behold the beginings of the 14th century mafia!

Konstantin, thanks for the translation. That will help greatly.

Konstantin the Red · Post by **Konstantin the Red** » Tue Jul 04, 2006 3:50 am

There's a description found here of St. Peter's in Elford, England (Nottinghamshire)

http://ron.jean.tripod.com/id13.html -- though while other effigies at that site have their pics, this one does not -- yet the description of the effigy showing only the head with torso and arms, and the lower parts of the legs, matches.

Got him; William de Staunton, died 3 May 1326 according to the inscription, which is helpfully written out here:

http://www.nottshistory.org.uk/articles/tts/tts1924/effigies/effigies4.htm

These several pages here have sundry effigies concentrating on military effigies in Nottinghamshire from before the Black Death, well worth a look.

Added: Further nosing around on this site in the section on Nottinghamshire memorial brasses brought me to a translation of that part of William de Staunton's slab inscription that follows the date (which part of the slab is indeed damaged, broken quite away): it's an abbreviated version of sui cujus anime propicietur deus, "on whose soul may God have mercy." The whole inscription is terse and to the point: who's buried, what he was and who his father was, when he died, God have mercy. That gets all the way around the memorial slab.